# Anti-Theft System & Remote Starter



## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Is the factory Anti-Theft system adequate enough?

I'm planning on purchasing a remote starter, and was wondering is I should get the remote start/alarm combo, or if I can just get away with the remote starter?

I had a Command Start/Alarm installed into my Honda Accord, and it was a nicely integrated sytem. However my Honda did not have a factory Anti-Theft system.

Thanks


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## aussietrail (Sep 24, 2004)

ViperZ said:


> Is the factory Anti-Theft system adequate enough?
> 
> I'm planning on purchasing a remote starter, and was wondering is I should get the remote start/alarm combo, or if I can just get away with the remote starter?
> 
> ...


Hey Viper,

This has been discussed before.

Check this thread out:

http://www.nissanforums.com/showthread.php?t=81966


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Thanks, I had already read that thread, however the Factory security system was not really covered off in that thread.

I'm more questioning how the factory alarm system works, seeing as I have not taken delivery of my truck yet.

Is the factory system adequate as an alarm system?


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## aussietrail (Sep 24, 2004)

ViperZ said:


> Is the factory system adequate as an alarm system?


Depends on the level of experience the thieves have in your location 

The factory system for my exy seems to work fine for me, but I was more looking for the comfort of the remote starter system as an added accessory.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Most times the flashing LED is enough to deter, other times I suppose it is not. 

I suppose depending on what I find, I may get an fully intergrated system so I only have to use 1 remote Key fob. Or do they integrate the factory arming functions into your remote starts remote?

Its good to hear others experiences and opinons to what they did, if they went with remote start only, or if they went with a combo system.

Thanks


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## mfreedman (Jun 13, 2004)

ViperZ said:


> Most times the flashing LED is enough to deter, other times I suppose it is not.
> 
> I suppose depending on what I find, I may get an fully intergrated system so I only have to use 1 remote Key fob. Or do they integrate the factory arming functions into your remote starts remote?
> 
> ...


I had considered this upgrade and decided against it. You can add a remote starter without upgrading the alarm system but then you will need to carry around two remotes. I've got enough stuff to carry around already, thanks. If you want to upgrade the entire alarm system and add the remote at the same time withonly one remote the $ start to flow and I was quoted well over $500 by the time all the required accessories were included. Then there's the matter of the coded key for the remote starter, etc. Put it this way, based on my experience, and myabe others have a better POV, this isn't worth the effort. If anyone knows it'll be Steve though. I think he's got one in his (jeez - he's got everything esle !!) He can surely offer a different opinion. For me it just wasn't worth it. As for the alarm it does the trick but there is one feature I would love to add and that's a chirp when the alarm sets. Apparently this cannot be upgraded. It really needs this IMO.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Considering I paid about $700 fo the combo unit in my Accord, this places me in the ballpark for the X-Trail.

I'm going to have to go around with the truck (once we get it) to see. I do want a universal 2 way remote, rather than carry 2 remotes.

I do want to get one of those transponder kits that does not require the key, however I'll have to see what the shops have here for the X-Trail.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

mfreedman said:


> As for the alarm it does the trick but there is one feature I would love to add and that's a chirp when the alarm sets. Apparently this cannot be upgraded. It really needs this IMO.


I prefer not a chirp, but a comfirmation flash from the side markers, or other light visable from a distance that the factory system is armed. Does the stock system flash lights when armed?


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## mfreedman (Jun 13, 2004)

ViperZ said:


> I prefer not a chirp, but a comfirmation flash from the side markers, or other light visable from a distance that the factory system is armed. Does the stock system flash lights when armed?


Yes it does but sometimes you cannot see in bright sunlight and then you listen for the locks to engage - they're not loud enough (to me) so I have to press the lock button three or four times before I'm satisifeid. That's why I like the chirp.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

I went to a local car toy store and looked at the Python 571 & Ultra Start XR3560. I wanted to see the Python 881, however they didnot have one in stock.










Python 571 XP, Ultra Start 3560XR


Python 571XP: It is a 2 way remote that uses LEDs with flashing comfirmations. Nice unit, long remote battery life 1/4 mile range. No indicator which door or trunk has been opened..etc that is available on the LCD remotes. Price $711 installed, taxes included

Ultra Start 3560XR: 2 way remote with LCD. Not so crazy about the remote and visual cues. Huge range of 1 mile, comes with secondary 1 way remote. Price $905 installed, taxes included.

I haven't even seen the Python 881, however I still think it's remote is the best of the bunch. I just wish it had a bigger range than 1/4 mile. $905 installed, taxes included. I like the no nosense remote that does not have that goofy colored car. Rather it is just a top outline.

































I will go look at the Compustars on the weekend. Tiger Automotive sells those, and my brother inlaw can get me around 20% off there.

A quick call to Tiger indicated that a 2WSS-AS was ~$850 installed -20% or whatever the discount my BIL can get. It also has the huge 1 mile range. Although the remote on the web page does not look as nice as the Python 881XP, however at about $700 installed, including taxes... it really is movin gto top of the class, even though I'm not fond of the remote.












Tough choice. I suppose in the end, if I'm going to spend +$700, I'm leaning towards the mega range units.... I like the Python 881XP remote the best, but functionality I want the Compustar or the Ultra Start because of the range.


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

I'm fairly neutral about remote start, but my wife really wants it on our next vehicle. If we can live with two remotes, does that situation work fairly well?

I'm assuming that to remote start the car, you first disable the immobilizer using the Nissan fob and then click on the command start fob. The car is no longer armed from theft while it's running, but the doors are still locked. That's probably something I could live with for the times we use it (could maybe use a Club as well).

The other question is whether that screws up the insurance discount (assuming the insurance company knows about my command start)?


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

If you are talking about having 1 car with 2 remotes (1 for you, 1 for your wife), no problems

I'm not sure how it would integrate with the Nissans factory unit, however a separate transponder unit is required to Auto Start. It either replicates the code, or has a (hidden) key present to allow remote starting.

Once started, the car will run for a predefined time (~15min) before it shuts down. If somebody was to enter the car with out the key, the combo alarm would shut the car down. If they were to get in to the car with it still running, the car would shut down as soon as you stepped on the brake with out the key inserted in the ignition. I suppose if a thief really wante dyou car, they are savvy enough to get it, however it is pretty effective still.


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

Actually I was talking about 4 remotes (2 for me and 2 for my wife) with no integration into the existing Nissan system. I would use one remote to disable the Nissan system and then click the other remote to start up the car.

Like you said, at that point if someone were to break in, as soon as they touch the brake pedal the engine would die.

In my mind this seems like a reasonable and cheap solution to get the best of both worlds. I can live with 2 remotes if it means saving 1000 bucks.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Ahh, got it.... I suppose we all have our limits. 

The difference is actually $250 for an alarm vs no alarm. For that amount I would rather have the complete 2 way system, with much better security and 2 way comunication should some event be happening.

The cost is in the installation.

For me if I'm going to spend +$400, I just may aswell spend $700, I may as well get what I really want. 

We'll see once I get the truck....


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

Cool.  

I wouldn't have a hot clue. I thought remote starter systems were around $250 installed but it seems that's not the case.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

No, you're correct, remote starters system can be had for about $250 installed, depending on the unit and the shop.

However chances, that doesn't include the transponder required to bypass the factory security.

Additionally, we are wanting a 6000ft range unit as my wife parks downtown, sometimes 4 blocks away. The extra range is welcomed, but not one of the cheaper units.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Looks like this is the system I'm going with.

Arctic Start RTW900FMAS










Up to 6000 feet of Range
This ground-breaking 900MHz Spread Spectrum 50-Channel frequency changing technology was developed by Firstech after spending thousands of hours perfecting the art of radio signal modulation and applying it to vehicle security and remote starts. This technology resulted in one of the most advanced security technologies available for the automobile. These modulation techniques help eliminate interference and allow for more power to transmit than conventional systems.

(Includes 1 two way remote. 1 one way remote) 

*Basic Remote Features:*
-Two-way paging remote 
-Vibration and audible notification 
-Run-time indicator 
-Turbo Timer 
-CompuGlow backlight 
-Multi-color LCD (liquid crystal display) 
-Shock sensor on/off through remote 
-Timer start mode 
-Passive mode on/off through remote 
-Valet mode on/off through remote 
-Uses standard AA 1.5 volt battery 


*Basic Alarm/Start Features*
-Includes dual stage shock sensor
-RPS (remote paging system)
-External Siren (six-tone)
-Super bright blue LED
-2-auxillary outputs
-Dedicated trunk output
-Horn honk output
-Anti-grind and starter-kill relay
-Driver's priority unlock
-Ignition controlled door locks
-Trunk output
-Remote start
-Diesel features built-in
-Manual transmission compatible

$740 Installed, All taxes included as well as an extended warranty on the remotes. Lifetime warranty on the Module and Installation.


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## chansen (Feb 7, 2005)

One question: Do you really need a fancy anti-theft device in Saskatchewan?


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## x-trail-R6 (Oct 27, 2004)

those compustar alarm/autostart are really good... i installed one on my x-trail and i love it..


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

chansen said:


> One question: Do you really need a fancy anti-theft device in Saskatchewan?


I suppose you never know...  

It's not so much for the fancy alarm, rather for the range of the remote starter. Getting an integrated unit was the only elegant solution I could see.

We get a better alarm that will alert of glass breakage, shock damage attempts, plus the system will let us know if it's our car making all the noise, and what the problem may be, rather than have people wonder.. 'Whose car alarm is that that has been going off?' :crazy:

Besides, 2 way communication systems with your Auto is cool  


x-trail-R6, Excellent to hear. Thanks for the feedback :thumbup:


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## tylast (Jan 17, 2005)

I just got my 05 Pathfinder yesterday. The dealer was trying to sell me a $500 upgraded alarms system. The only difference (between the factory installed alarm & the upgraded Nissan alarm) he could tell me was that the upgraded one rotated codes. I was pretty put back to find out that the factory one does NOT already do that. Hell, my 02 Mini Copper (& all BMW) key fobs already do that. Why is Nissan 3 years behind? Can anyone else confirm the rotating code deal?


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

I can't as I don't know about the factory alarm and it's features.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

*It gets Installed Today*

Well, our X-Trail with ~300 km on it goes in under the knife for the install of the Remote car starter and Alarm today.

I hope all goes well, it should only take 3-4 hours I'm told, however seeing as this is the first X-Trail any installers have done in town, they asked me to plan for the whole day just in case.

I'll report back here once it's done


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## dubberwithanxtrail (Mar 14, 2005)

chansen said:


> One question: Do you really need a fancy anti-theft device in Saskatchewan?


Actually, Regina(where I live), is the capital of Saskatchewan and was at one time the car theft capital in Canada. It still has one of the highest per capita car theft rates in Canada. On a side note this is my first post, been lurking for a while now, so hello to all the fellow x-trail owners. PS to ViperZ , who did you get the qoute from for the alarm/starter system?


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

dubberwithanxtrail said:


> Actually, Regina(where I live), is the capital of Saskatchewan and was at one time the car theft capital in Canada. It still has one of the highest per capita car theft rates in Canada. On a side note this is my first post, been lurking for a while now, so hello to all the fellow x-trail owners. PS to ViperZ , who did you get the qoute from for the alarm/starter system?


Welcome to the Boards Dubber :thumbup: 

I remember you guys were home to the notorious "Oldsmobile Gang", a group of car thieves that stole Oldsmobiles for thrill rides.. Did they ever catch them?

The $740 price for the FM900 was at Visions Electronics.


The X-Trail is there now.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Well the car alarm remote start went very well. The 2 way remote is very cool as it provides feed back if the car is started/running, current status and/or what created the alarm condition. The range is very good form what I have tested. It is stated to be a 1 Mile range. I started the Truck form deep with in a Shoping Mall, which usually it hard to get communications out of, even cell phones are are tough for reception :thumbup: 

In car it has this very Bright Blue flashing LED when armed that looks very cool 8)










-Top, 2 way Remote
-Middle, 1 way Remote
-Bottom, Factory Remote


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## dubberwithanxtrail (Mar 14, 2005)

The "oldsmobile Gang" was actually just a bunch of kids no older then 15 and as young as 9 from what I remember. Some of them the cops could do nothing about because they were so young. I think they just put the older ones in juve (sp?) and that kind of stopped the other kids. Oh and thanks for the welcome. Are you in Saskatoon ViperZ? Just curious.

Nice looking set up you got there too :thumbup:


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Thanks Dubber!

Right, I remember now... They were Juveniles :loser: 

Yes, I'm in Saskatoon


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Just came back from Walmart, -10C outside and snowing. 

The remote is so nice to use. I started the X-Trail while I was in line at the cashier. It beeped once to let me know the command was sent. It then beeped 2 times shortly there after indicating the car had started, and the LCD confirmed it with an exhaust picture coming from the back of the car icon. While I approched the car, I unlocked the doors, the remote beeps 2 times to indicate the door is unlocked and alarm is unarmed, The XTy also chirps and flashes the lights (as normal) to confirm this :thumbup: All remote beeps and car Chirps can also be muted if so desired.

It's installed as a double alarm in that it arms/disarms the Compustar alarm, and the Nissan one at the same time, sort of like a back up system if you will. 

I think this was money well spent :thumbup:


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

Sounds effective. Let me ask just a few questions so I can understand properly. I know that everything is incorporated into one remote now, but how does it interact with the Nissan system?

When you turn on the alarm, my assumption is that the Nissan immobilizer plus the Compustar audio alarm are activated. When you remote-started your car from inside Wal-Mart what changed at that point? Has the car started but the Compustar alarm is still active? Is the Nissan system still active at that point?

Ultimately (other than price) I have two concerns:
1. If at any point the Nissan system is defeated that will likely disqualify me for the ~$50 annual insurance discount.
2. If I don't report the upgrade to the insurance company, they may refuse my claim if there is a break-in.

The other thing is that I plan on buying a 5-speed Xy, I think that makes remote starting more of a pain because you have to do something about the clutch each time you park.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Winterpeg

When the Compustart alarm is active, it disables the starter and all doors, hood and rear hatch are pinned so if any of them are opened (while armed) will trip the alarm. The Compustar also has a shock sensor so is glass breakage or body blows occur, it will trip the alarm. All the while the Stock Nissan alarm is active as well. This is just a Door entry alarm, so a door has to be opened for it to trip. By unlocking the doors via Compustar remote, it disarms the Compustar alarm, and disarms the Factory Alarm, just as you were using the factory remote.

With the factory alarm, if a person was to break the glass and enter through the window, the factory alarm would not know it. It requires a door to be opened to trigger.

With the Compustar, if the glass is broken, it will trigger the Compustar alarm, if they were to open the door or slim-jim the lock and try to open the door, it would trigger the Compustar alarm and the factory Alarm.

When I started the car in Walmart, all alarms are still active because the doors have not been unlocked, remember you have to unlock the door to disarm the factory alarm, and by unlocking the door, also disarms the Compustart alarm. You still need a key to drive away for with out it, the engine will stop as soon as you step on the brake.

For a manual trmsmission car, you have to place the the alarm/starter/car in what is known as reservation mode. That is linked to your parking brake and requires a set of routines before shut down. It's a bit of work, but I suppose it all become second nature after a while. Here is how the Compustar is used in reservation mode.

Reservation mode must be activated each time for a manual transmission with the engine running.

Step 1: Activate reservation mode on remote
Step 2: Before turning engine off place transmission in neutral
Step 3: Activate parking brake
Step 4: Remove foot from foot brake
Step 5: Remove Key from ignition, engine remains running
Step 6: Exit the vehicle and close door with in two minutes after activating the parking brake. The engine will shut off and reservation mode for the remote starter is complete.

If a door is opened after that, reservation mode will be cancelled and the process will have to begin again with inserting the key in the ignition and starting the car.

I hope that all made sense.


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## x-trail-R6 (Oct 27, 2004)

yah the reservation mode takes time to get use too.... it took me awhile before i got use to it... just make sure you open your door before the passenger open and shuts dere door before you, or else you'll get locked in... i got locked in a few times


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

ViperZ,
Thanks for your detailed explanation, I understand completely now. Might be worth spending the money after all, but I can't believe how complex the routine is on a manual tranny. It also seems to have a loophole. If you active the reservation mode and leave the car right away, you car could be a sitting duck for about the next minute and a half. Here's an example:

I pull into Wal-mart, and the parking is full. I set the alarm and pull the parking brake and leave the car quickly (because it's Dec 24th and I still have Christmas shopping to do). The alarm starts a 2 minute countdown. Meanwhile some goon walking buy notices that I didn't click my keyless entry fob to lock the doors. He waits a second to make sure I'm not looking and then opens the door and jumps in. Of course he still has to hotwire the vehicle, but all the alarms are disabled when he opened the door and he's got as much time as he needs.

Does that seem about right? It would be a shame to have to worry about this sort of thing even though chances are it would never happen that way.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

No, you can lock the doors an arm the security system as soon as you exit. You have 2 minutes to exit or else the system will have to be reset is how I read it.


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

x-trail-R6, can you confirm this?


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## x-trail-R6 (Oct 27, 2004)

Winterpeg 
viperz is right because as soon as the door shuts the car will shut down and arm it's self right away... the 2min is the only time you have to get out of you car when setting the reservation mode...


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

That seems not too bad then. Thanks for clarifying.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

x-trail-R6 said:


> Winterpeg
> viperz is right because as soon as the door shuts the car will shut down and arm it's self right away... the 2min is the only time you have to get out of you car when setting the reservation mode...



Thanks for confirming that X-Trail-R6  


I was able to get a second LCD remote for the XTy on ebay  It's the White Turbo Timer version.


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

Neat. Did you sync the codes yourself or did you have to go back to Visions and have them do it?


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Winterpeg said:


> Neat. Did you sync the codes yourself or did you have to go back to Visions and have them do it?


Thanx  I can sync the remote to the car myself. It requires placing the key in the ignition and turning it off/on 5 times with in 7 seconds and pressing a button on the remote.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

My second Auto remote came in the mail today. It programmed flawlessly.










Both remotes seem to work nicely together in that they do not communicate with each other, however regardless of the status of last command executed by a remote, if the other remote is used, it will query the the truck for status and update both remotes. Very cool


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

What's that plastic thingy attached to your keychains? Extra battery?


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Winterpeg said:


> What's that plastic thingy attached to your keychains? Extra battery?


Those are LED flash lights by Photon Microlite. They are really handy and put out a lot of light. Using a small watch battery, they last for years.





















http://www.photonlight.com/

I bought mine at MEC (Mountain Equipment Co-op), I think you have one in Winnipeg.


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

Cool. We have a membership at MEC, so I'll have to go check them out.


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## Winterpeg (Jan 31, 2005)

ViperZ,
One more question. Did your system come with a knock sensor? (I think Compustar calls it the "Remote Paging System"). I pulled this blurb from an E-bay page:

_"Compustar includes this knock sensor in their kits but most shops do not take the time to install it. If someone is trying to locate you they simply knock at the spot this sticker & sensor are placed. The sensor will trigger the Compustar system to page you. Your transmitter will show a paging feature without alarming you someone is breaking in your car. You tell a few of your friends about this feature and they will find out how simple it is to get your attention real quick."_

If so, where did you get Visions to place yours?


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## mfreedman (Jun 13, 2004)

Winterpeg said:


> Cool. We have a membership at MEC, so I'll have to go check them out.


Maybe we can get a group buy together.


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## ViperZ (Feb 9, 2005)

Winterpeg said:


> ViperZ,
> One more question. Did your system come with a knock sensor? (I think Compustar calls it the "Remote Paging System").
> If so, where did you get Visions to place yours?


Yes, my system came with the remote paging knock sensor. I told them to not install this as I figured it could get annoying real fast. If anybody I knew really wanted to get ahold of me, they know my cell number


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