# Clutch question



## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

Has anyone heard of any problems with the 350Z clutch.

I have a 2004 Roadster with only 8,000 miles on it and they are telling me the clutch is gone, flywheel burnt. Doesn't sound like this should have happened?


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## Zen31ZR (Mar 24, 2004)

Who told you, the dealership? How does the car drive. Clutch slip a lot?


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

Took car in because when driving it sometimes, Not all times, it seemed to lose power. yes the dealer told me it was the clutch all at the tune of $2600. the clutch was not slipping.


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## 0341TODD (Nov 15, 2003)

How many miles did your car have on it when you got it? Was it a demo or did you get it brand spanking new with like 10 miles on it?


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

0341TODD said:


> How many miles did your car have on it when you got it? Was it a demo or did you get it brand spanking new with like 10 miles on it?



My car was brand spanking new I drove it off the dealers showroom. I dont think it even had 10 miles on it.


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## Zen31ZR (Mar 24, 2004)

tgunn said:


> Took car in because when driving it sometimes, Not all times, it seemed to lose power. yes the dealer told me it was the clutch all at the tune of $2600. the clutch was not slipping.


 Sounds like BS to me. Get a 2nd opinion. A totally burnt clutch and flywheel would not put hardly any power to the ground. And slip quite badly when pushed hard in a high gear. Besides, how can they tell the flywheel is burnt if they haven't removed the transmission. Or have they........ 
Losing power and having a toasty clutch are 2 quite different things.


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> Sounds like BS to me. Get a 2nd opinion. A totally burnt clutch and flywheel would not put hardly any power to the ground. And slip quite badly when pushed hard in a high gear. Besides, how can they tell the flywheel is burnt if they haven't removed the transmission. Or have they........
> Losing power and having a toasty clutch at 2 quite different things.



Well they told me it would cost $500 just to look and see what was wrong. After that they called back yesterday to say it was all that I mentioned above and the cost would be $2600.

So, if I get a second opinion now that the car is tore down who would I call. I think something stinks about this whole situation. When did clutches start burning up after one year with only 8,000 miles.

I learned how to drive on a manual car when i was 12 and drove many cars my dad owned (never had a clutch burn) and eventually my own 4 speed so now I'm 48 so I guess I got dumb and forgot how to drive one.


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## Zen31ZR (Mar 24, 2004)

tgunn said:


> Well they told me it would cost $500 just to look and see what was wrong. After that they called back yesterday to say it was all that I mentioned above and the cost would be $2600.
> 
> So, if I get a second opinion now that the car is tore down who would I call. I think something stinks about this whole situation. When did clutches start burning up after one year with only 8,000 miles.
> 
> I learned how to drive on a manual car when i was 12 and drove many cars my dad owned (never had a clutch burn) and eventually my own 4 speed so now I'm 48 so I guess I got dumb and forgot how to drive one.


Heck I'm over 30 but still drive like something of a maniac and can't burn a clutch down in 8000 miles, so yeah something is very fishy. Sounds like they assumed and tore down your car without even thoroughly checking it out. I hate new car dealerships with a passion, most of their money is made in the repair shop, not on the sales floor. I would demand to see the parts they pulled out. Of course, that's no guarantee they are _your_ parts.....
AT this point a second opinion is worthless, what with it already in pieces. They can always put it back together with a burnt out used clutch and send you on your way......just to prove they were right. If you can afford it, get it done, but make it a point to not ever go back to that dealer again.


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## Spongerider (Nov 18, 2002)

tgunn said:


> Well they told me it would cost $500 just to look and see what was wrong. After that they called back yesterday to say it was all that I mentioned above and the cost would be $2600.
> 
> So, if I get a second opinion now that the car is tore down who would I call. I think something stinks about this whole situation. When did clutches start burning up after one year with only 8,000 miles.
> 
> I learned how to drive on a manual car when i was 12 and drove many cars my dad owned (never had a clutch burn) and eventually my own 4 speed so now I'm 48 so I guess I got dumb and forgot how to drive one.



Be honest, has your daughter, son, and/or wife been driving your Z? If so that is why unless you are not telling use how you really drive the Z?


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

Spongerider said:


> Be honest, has your daughter, son, and/or wife been driving your Z? If so that is why unless you are not telling use how you really drive the Z?



Only me and the wife drive it. Actually its her car and she drives just fine.
Bad of you to think only us guys can drive


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## 3-fity (Nov 1, 2002)

Spongerider said:


> Be honest, has your daughter, son, and/or wife been driving your Z? If so that is why unless you are not telling use how you really drive the Z?


Sounds like a sh!tty dealership to me. I would think they should cover the cost under warranty. Call Nissan USA about it and see what they have to say. Always scares a dealership when the local Nissan rep gives them a call.


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## Spongerider (Nov 18, 2002)

tgunn said:


> Only me and the wife drive it. Actually its her car and she drives just fine.
> Bad of you to think only us guys can drive


 Ok, you can have them work on the Z but tell them you want to see the parts that they will replace before installing the new parts. This way you can see for yourself if it has high speed glaze on it or not.

Also you might want to check around to see if there are any Z shops in your area that will do your clutch?


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## Zen31ZR (Mar 24, 2004)

Spongerider said:


> Ok, you can have them work on the Z but tell them you want to see the parts that they will replace before installing the new parts. This way you can see for yourself if it has high speed glaze on it or not.


Having worked in the repair industry and knowing exactly what these guys are capable of, that won't do much good either. That clutch being used by several different cars and trucks, they probably have a few burnt out ones laying around. They can just pull one out as exhibit A and return it to it's pile after they've convinced him to spend the money. I worked for several shops that practiced such tactics, it would be even easier for a dealership.


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

Spongerider said:


> Ok, you can have them work on the Z but tell them you want to see the parts that they will replace before installing the new parts. This way you can see for yourself if it has high speed glaze on it or not.
> 
> Also you might want to check around to see if there are any Z shops in your area that will do your clutch?



What is a high speed glaze??? Not familiar with that term.


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## Zen31ZR (Mar 24, 2004)

tgunn said:


> What is a high speed glaze??? Not familiar with that term.


 Somewhat akin to what happens to your brakes if you ride them all the time. The outer layers heat up and constant overheating causes them to glaze over, become hard and shiny basically. Same thing happens to a clutch if "ridden" or slipped a lot.


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## Spongerider (Nov 18, 2002)

High speed glazing leaves a blue tint to the flywheel.









http://www.bfranker.badz28.com/fbody/clutch.htm


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## Zen31ZR (Mar 24, 2004)

That's about the worst example I've ever seen.


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

*Thank YOU ALL*

Hey Guys,

Thanks a lot for all the fast response and good advice. They knocked off $500.
I called around and got other dealer quotes on the replacement of a clutch and fly wheel. You all have been very helpful. I pick up the car on Thursday.

One last question, how long did this problem occur to have messed up the clutch? What should I have noticed before now?


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## 2005 350Z SUPERBLACK (Dec 14, 2004)

YOU GOT TO BE KIDDING ME. A NEW CLUTCH AFTER 8K? I DON'T CARE IF YOU'RE A GREAT CLUTCH DRIVER OR SIT THERE AND BURN THE CLUTCH UP AT EVERY RED LIGHT IN TOWN. I KNOW NISSAN DOESN'T COVER WEAR AND TEAR ITEMS, BUT AFTER ONLY 8K SOMETHING MORE IS WRONG HERE. NISSAN SHOULD COVER THE TOTAL COST. THAT'S WHAT I THINK AND HOPEFULLY IT NEVER HAPPENS TO ME.


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## asleepz (Feb 24, 2004)

I'm pretty much counting on having to get another flywheel. How tough are they?


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

2005 350Z SUPERBLACK said:


> YOU GOT TO BE KIDDING ME. A NEW CLUTCH AFTER 8K? I DON'T CARE IF YOU'RE A GREAT CLUTCH DRIVER OR SIT THERE AND BURN THE CLUTCH UP AT EVERY RED LIGHT IN TOWN. I KNOW NISSAN DOESN'T COVER WEAR AND TEAR ITEMS, BUT AFTER ONLY 8K SOMETHING MORE IS WRONG HERE. NISSAN SHOULD COVER THE TOTAL COST. THAT'S WHAT I THINK AND HOPEFULLY IT NEVER HAPPENS TO ME.



Well you and I are definitely thinking alike, but how in the heck do you prove it's not driver error. Picked up the car on Friday. The new clutch feels really mushy(soft to the touch). The original clutch was hard (tight) and springy. How does yours feels? I have been smelling a rat here at NIssan.


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## Zen31ZR (Mar 24, 2004)

tgunn said:


> Well you and I are definitely thinking alike, but how in the heck do you prove it's not driver error. Picked up the car on Friday. The new clutch feels really mushy(soft to the touch). The original clutch was hard (tight) and springy. How does yours feels? I have been smelling a rat here at NIssan.


Take it back. Keep taking it back and complaining about it til they get it right.......


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> Take it back. Keep taking it back and complaining about it til they get it right.......


Waiting until the snow melts then I'm gonna take her for a real ride to see what's really up. I cant believe this whole episode I really feel dicked!!!!! :banhump:


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## Zen31ZR (Mar 24, 2004)

tgunn said:


> Waiting until the snow melts then I'm gonna take her for a real ride to see what's really up. I cant believe this whole episode I really feel dicked!!!!! :banhump:


I would suspect with a spongy clutch pedal that they may have either not reinstalled the clutch system properly IE needs to be bled to remove air bubbles, or they gave you a slightly used clutch disk...... At the very least, take it out and do as we suggested before , placing the car in a higher gear and accelerate hard, if it slips take it back. 
Yes dealerships are pretty much only good for screwing people, one reason I will never buy a brand new car , or ever get my car serviced by a dealer. Intersting that they knocked $500 off the price, it's pretty much an admission of guilt right there........


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

*Need that test drive*

I am still waiting for the snow to melt so I can take my Z out to test the new tranny. So, here's my question for the day.... How does your clutch feel? Is it tight, springy, etc??? I know for a fact that mine is not tight and springy like it use to be so I dont know what is good or bad. Tight or spongy?????


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## maximZ (Dec 9, 2004)

If you've only got 8k miles on your car, they should be covering that under warranty. I realize they can tell you it's your fault but honestly, who can burn out a clutch in only 8k miles?

Take it to another dealer and see what they say.


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## 2005 350Z SUPERBLACK (Dec 14, 2004)

My Z has 2K on it and the clutch graps good and tight, not spongy. But it seems to chatter sometimes. When cold, like in the 20s, second gear is a bitch to shift into.

I've own several high performance vehicles with manuals. I usually trade vehicles in berfore 50K, but I've gotten 60K + (traded that car in with 60K) miles out of them and I drove it hard. My brother had a 1993 240SX SE and he traded that car in with 125K and the orginal clutch. 

So what the hell is wrong with yours? I would skip the dealer and ask for the Nissan Service Rep for your area and bitch at him. Nissan should provide you with more answers.

Good luck.


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## BadBoy91 (Jan 21, 2005)

I am a Nissan technician certified on 350Zs. your clutch should not be slipping at 8k. As far as the Spongy thing goes your independent shop skrewed up somehow, they probably used the original presure plate which may have been your problem in the first place. Does it still slip? if so DO NOT TELL THEM YOU TOOK IT TO AN INDEPENDENT NISSAN WILL DENY THE CLAIM MOST LIKELY. if it doesnt slip anymore there may be air in the clutch lines, but im pretty sure you shouldnt have to bleed or even open the hydralic systemSuperblack is right, you need to take this above the dealer level. call nissan and complain until they make it right, and they will.or take it to another dealer and see what they say. 
I would also like to stand up for new car dealers, not all of them are shady!


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## BadBoy91 (Jan 21, 2005)

2005 350Z SUPERBLACK said:


> My Z has 2K on it and the clutch graps good and tight, not spongy. But it seems to chatter sometimes. When cold, like in the 20s, second gear is a bitch to shift into.
> 
> I've own several high performance vehicles with manuals. I usually trade vehicles in berfore 50K, but I've gotten 60K + (traded that car in with 60K) miles out of them and I drove it hard. My brother had a 1993 240SX SE and he traded that car in with 125K and the orginal clutch.
> 
> ...


 as far as the hard second gear goes it is normal in cold conditions for a manual to feel crunchy until the tranny and fluid warms up.


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

BadBoy91 said:


> I am a Nissan technician certified on 350Zs. your clutch should not be slipping at 8k. As far as the Spongy thing goes your independent shop skrewed up somehow, they probably used the original presure plate which may have been your problem in the first place. Does it still slip? if so DO NOT TELL THEM YOU TOOK IT TO AN INDEPENDENT NISSAN WILL DENY THE CLAIM MOST LIKELY. if it doesnt slip anymore there may be air in the clutch lines, but im pretty sure you shouldnt have to bleed or even open the hydralic systemSuperblack is right, you need to take this above the dealer level. call nissan and complain until they make it right, and they will.or take it to another dealer and see what they say.
> I would also like to stand up for new car dealers, not all of them are shady!



I took the car to Nissan Dealer to have the repairs done cause I figured everything should still be under warranty.


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## Zen31ZR (Mar 24, 2004)

BadBoy91 said:


> I am a Nissan technician certified on 350Zs. your clutch should not be slipping at 8k. As far as the Spongy thing goes your independent shop skrewed up somehow, they probably used the original presure plate which may have been your problem in the first place. Does it still slip? if so DO NOT TELL THEM YOU TOOK IT TO AN INDEPENDENT NISSAN WILL DENY THE CLAIM MOST LIKELY. if it doesnt slip anymore there may be air in the clutch lines, but im pretty sure you shouldnt have to bleed or even open the hydralic systemSuperblack is right, you need to take this above the dealer level. call nissan and complain until they make it right, and they will.or take it to another dealer and see what they say.
> I would also like to stand up for new car dealers, not all of them are shady!


If you would have read the thread, you would have seen that the car was _taken to _ a dealership. I hate people that just pop in and spout off when they don't even know whats going on....


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## ACTman (Dec 16, 2003)

Spongerider said:


> High speed glazing leaves a blue tint to the flywheel.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Overheating will do that to a flywheel. That one got pretty hot. I have seen a lot worse though.


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## ACTman (Dec 16, 2003)

♣Zen31ZR♣ said:


> Somewhat akin to what happens to your brakes if you ride them all the time. The outer layers heat up and constant overheating causes them to glaze over, become hard and shiny basically. Same thing happens to a clutch if "ridden" or slipped a lot.


You are little mistaken, but this is a common misconception. Glazing to a smooth surface is normal for a clutch and it will look "hard and shiny". Once broken in properly to a smooth lapped in surface, the clutch will wear very slowly but hold a little less power than it does new. It is friction, not roughness that is suposed to hold the power. If the clutch won't hold the power when it is "hard and shiny" then most likely you need more clamp load.

When you slip the clutch a lot it actually does the opposite because of the intense heat. The resins that hold the friction material together boil out and work more like a lubricant than a bonding agent, leaving the clutch disc looking really torn up. When it gets really bad the friction material will become a bunch or cat fur in the pressure plate and belhousing. Not pretty at all!


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## tgunn (Jan 14, 2005)

*No resolution*

As you all know I had to get a new clutch at 8800 miles and was charged for it. I called Nissan consumer affairs and they said that the shop manager told them it was due to wear and tear. Ok, how would you know if a clutch has been misused? What kinds of things would show up? All of the sudden the clutch started slipping and when I took it in thats when I heard about the clutch needed to be replaced? Wouldn't there have been symptons sooner and what would they have been? I just dont get how I learned how to drive on a car that had a shift on the steering column and never burned those clutches out and believe me I was young then. Actually I have been driving manuals since I was 12. So what gives, is Nissan making a sorry product. Any input will be appreciated.


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## ACTman (Dec 16, 2003)

tgunn said:


> As you all know I had to get a new clutch at 8800 miles and was charged for it. I called Nissan consumer affairs and they said that the shop manager told them it was due to wear and tear. Ok, how would you know if a clutch has been misused? What kinds of things would show up? All of the sudden the clutch started slipping and when I took it in thats when I heard about the clutch needed to be replaced? Wouldn't there have been symptons sooner and what would they have been? I just dont get how I learned how to drive on a car that had a shift on the steering column and never burned those clutches out and believe me I was young then. Actually I have been driving manuals since I was 12. So what gives, is Nissan making a sorry product. Any input will be appreciated.


Did you get your so-called bad parts back from the Nissan dealer? Sorry I didn't reply sooner but I didn't have instant email notification set for this thread. You can email me directly if that helps.


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## am3rican (Feb 26, 2005)

what dealer did you go to so i know not to go there? 

In all honesty, I wouldn't have gotten the clutch replaced. I would have called Nissan consumer affairs and complained. If they refused to cover it, id call back. if that doesnt work, try compromising with them. Say you'll cover half the cost. My buddy has an '88 civic with 202K miles on it with the original clutch. So obviously, at 8K, it'd sound awfully ridiculous for a clutch to go.


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