# Ignition for all motor GA16???



## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

hey people, i'm planning to go all motor on my GA16 200sx, and i was wondering if ignition is going to get me anywhere. what do you guys recommend? 

this is what i have in mind for my car:
flywheel (fidenza)
cams (JWT)
intake (Place racing, injen, whatever)
bore throttle body 
headers (weapon R, or perhaps my friend may make me a custom 4-1)
catback (2" custom, madrel bends)
polish/port heads (my friend)
pully (unorthodox)
ECU (JWT)
SE-R injectors
ACT clutch (?)
AFC (not sure which one)
wires
11.0-12.0 compression ratio pistons
anything else, i'm trying to get 160hp at the crank (100hp/lt) what do you guys think. turbo is not the answer. i asked here b/c maybe there are all motor experts.


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## psuLemon (Apr 23, 2003)

header- HS, intake-HS, catback should be stromung, you should also make sure you get a 3angle valve job.. and didn't you discuss all this in the ga section and stock ignition all ngk stuff


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

*Huh????*

what do you mean, just like wires and plugs? aren't there coil packs, or something or other????? thats one thing i really dont know about, is ignition, so explain everything and what you would get


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## psuLemon (Apr 23, 2003)

yea, there is stuff like that, but you dont need them, funny that nissan's have insanely good ignitions... if you want to spend money, you can get a msd 6a, but even turboed ga's dont need the msd


most of the stuff you choose is good, but if you want the most out of it, change teh stuff that i changed on your list, thats why i wrote that


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## chimmike (Oct 17, 2002)

don't get cheap parts....i.e. weapon crap header


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## psuLemon (Apr 23, 2003)

chimmike said:


> don't get cheap parts....i.e. weapon crap header


come on chimmike, you know weapson Rice is the hot sh*t :cheers:


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

i dunno, i heard some pretty decent reviews about the weapon r's. they's not the best, i know that, but....


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## Nismo1997 (Dec 26, 2003)

Hotshot is the only way to go. Listen to what they are tellin ya, theres not bs they know what they are talking about. best of luck


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## psuLemon (Apr 23, 2003)

well considering you are tryin to have the most powerful ga, you wont succeed with a cheap knock off. and on a note, no one measures hp to the crank, just dealers. we do wheel hp..


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

you guys definitely have a point on the hotshot... i'll try to get the HS, and i'm trying to get about 135-140 whp, thats my goal. sarah from npm said 150whp is achievable on all motor and is streetable


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

himbo said:


> you guys definitely have a point on the hotshot... i'll try to get the HS, and i'm trying to get about 135-140 whp, thats my goal. sarah from npm said 150whp is achievable on all motor and is streetable


Not going to make 140 whp without a ton of money... you'd be much better off going turbo especially when you compare $ per horsepower


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

myoung said:


> Not going to make 140 whp without a ton of money... you'd be much better off going turbo especially when you compare $ per horsepower


got a point... I'm dropin an engine on weds; flywheel and UD pulley already in place, so with just those, JUST those and the newER engine, I got.. *533*(engine)+*526*(flywheel+shipping)+*207*(pulley, iridium sparks + shipping)=*$1266*.. and I haven't even DROPPED the fuckin' thing. I got the same goal 130-140 whp, but be ready to dish out the green to make it mean. Never schimp man. Only the best, and you'll make it. But as for the turbo.. I'm totaly anti-turbo. At least not yet. see, you may not get the hp ya want, but your mind will explode once you seen your milage go from about 30 highway to like 45-50! Not worth it... psssha.


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## chimmike (Oct 17, 2002)

what the heck makes you think all motor still gets good mileage? lmao.


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

chimmike said:


> what the heck makes you think all motor still gets good mileage? lmao.


 ok, unless your GA16 sucks balls and is all messed up with the timing, you should be getting about 30mpg highway... but if it's not, then you don't wanna drop it to begin with. :loser:


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## chimmike (Oct 17, 2002)

explain to me how an all motor setup is just gonna get better gas mileage than turbo?

do you even realize that a turbo engine is not always in boost? I got over 30mpg with my turbo setup on.

without facts, don't spew bs because you "think" it's right.


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

yo evil, i just got a response from JWT, and they told me that the most they've seen is the 132whp from the sweet 16 project. i also spoke to Jason from JGY Customs (awesome guy!!!!), and he said, while it is possible, it'll probably cost in the range of $4000. i figure, i know some friends who can get me distribtor's discounts, and i'll put the shit on my self and i may still have to pay upwards of $3000. 

so, i decided to cheat, i'm going turbo. much more hp, for alot less $$$$. plus going all motor doesn't mean that you will get better gas mileage, initially, with the better breathing, you will, but after things like injectors, cams, and ECU, you may lose gas mileage. 

trust me, i would have loved to be the first person on the forums to crack 160+ hp off of a GA16, but, i think i'll just settle for a 200Whp turbo.

p.s. our longer stroke, and smaller bore, make it difficult to extract an all motor set up. but, these are the perfect settings for turbo :thumbup: 

good luck, and pm me if i can help you with anything


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

chimmike said:


> explain to me how an all motor setup is just gonna get better gas mileage than turbo?
> 
> do you even realize that a turbo engine is not always in boost? I got over 30mpg with my turbo setup on.
> 
> without facts, don't spew bs because you "think" it's right.


first, I know the turbo is not always on boost, and 30 mpg ani't nothing.. it's just stock, typical, whoopity fuckin' do, no change. The fact is, most people, when they put a turbo in the engine, they change the timing so the exhaust ports are open longer.. longer retard. So they get the boost full place every time. Now, not everyone does that, but it's done get done... and if ya went so far as to PUT a turbo kit, which is like 2 to 3 grand, you wanna use it.

Secondly, you lose gas milage because of the forced induction; because of the boost usage. You want power? well ya gotta pay, everything has a price. Now, if ya never use the boost, why the fuck did ya get a turbo in the first place? 

And finally, if he does all those mods, he will be getting more then 30 mpg. More then stock... more then you and your "monster turbo." Yes yes, you'll kill him on the 1/4 mile... but thats what you wanted to do.


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## chimmike (Oct 17, 2002)

the same goes for n/a. you spend $4000, you wanna use the power. Then your mileage goes to shit.

fact is, you have NO basis for saying that n/a gives more mpg vs turbo. Obviously, a 175whp turbo setup will eat more gas than a 140whp n/a. However, you spend less for that 175whp than you would for even 135-140whp on a GA. far less.

And for N/A setups, you radically increase timing. Run high compression pistons. That requires high octane gas. Which is expensive. And compression, unlike boost, doesn't change. You're always at 12:1 compression or whatever it is you get the pistons made for. So, you're definitely going to burn more fuel. Even if you're not on the gas all the time.

I got over 30mpg on the highway with 190whp. This was using boost to pass, averaging 80mph, and 5-6 on/off ramp hard accelerations. This is on a QG18DE.

Could you even get 190whp n/a on the QG18DE wtihout running insane compression levels and race gas? Doubtful. And if you could, running race gas alone would eat far more money than turbo fuel economy.


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## chimmike (Oct 17, 2002)

so basically, you want to spend at least $2000 more than turbo for less power and probably a less effective powerband than turbo.................for what reason? Really? To be different? Wow. different. So when you say "I spent $4,000 on making 135whp n/a", people aren't gonna say "that's cool man, MADD PROPS!" They're going to say "why didn't you go turbo?" And when you say what you told me, they're going to laugh at you.

What argument do you have? Not fuel economy. Not overall less expensive setup, because as we said, n/a setups are for DEEP pockets. Less overall power, possibly a less useable powerband...etc.


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

himbo said:


> yo evil, i just got a response from JWT, and they told me that the most they've seen is the 132whp from the sweet 16 project. i also spoke to Jason from JGY Customs (awesome guy!!!!), and he said, while it is possible, it'll probably cost in the range of $4000. i figure, i know some friends who can get me distribtor's discounts, and i'll put the shit on my self and i may still have to pay upwards of $3000.
> 
> so, i decided to cheat, i'm going turbo. much more hp, for alot less $$$$. plus going all motor doesn't mean that you will get better gas mileage, initially, with the better breathing, you will, but after things like injectors, cams, and ECU, you may lose gas mileage.
> 
> ...


 you mean I've lost another one?!! LOL... now don't get me wrong, I don't think turbo is wrong, just... along the lines of taken steriods to win a sports event. It's only ok if the other guy is doing it. I only worked on turbos with disels. I don't HATE them.. but I don't like to play around with them. and no, you won't LOSE gas miliage, if you don't USE it. but if ya do, then ya will.

As for me, I'm willing to try for the 130-140whp. I think I can get about 180 at the fly, but that might turn out to be a pipe dream, but I'm preparded for that. I mean, if a freaking stock v-tec 1.9 can push out 200 at the fly, why can't a beefed up 1.6? I'm not building my little girl to kill people on the straight though. She don't have to go that fast, just get in and out of the turn faster then the other guy. I don't wanna have to rev to feed my turbo... instant power man... INSTANT!!! But you know, once ya go turbo, ya never go back. And you become a rabid defender of it, too. Just look as Mike. I knew some guys like that... ALL about his turbo in his little MR2. Mean little MR2... fast, but I think I can get him on a curve track or some kinda sprint with shorter straights once I'm done.


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

chimmike said:


> the same goes for n/a. you spend $4000, you wanna use the power. Then your mileage goes to shit.
> 
> fact is, you have NO basis for saying that n/a gives more mpg vs turbo. Obviously, a 175whp turbo setup will eat more gas than a 140whp n/a. However, you spend less for that 175whp than you would for even 135-140whp on a GA. far less.
> 
> ...


We'll see. I don't think I need to put in 4 grand... but my goal is to get the best engine with out the later. I'll get it the hard way. So if I decided later on to go to the dark side... I'll little GA will be man eater. But I don't think I'll be heading for that. As for our fuel economy banter. Ok, I'll cruch some number... evidently I need to bring some proof before you conceed my point. That's fine, I would want the same. So I'll ask around some people running and running with out, befores and after. We'll see. If I'm wrong, I'm POST IT. With a big ass grin.


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

OK, I think of turbo as ether is to diesel.. crack for the engine... speed, meth... evil angel dust, whateva. yes, it will make ya do some CRRRAZY things, but in the end, your heart will explode. You can't just slap on a turbo... you have to change an aweful lot to take the extra pressure (hense the "kit"). Like I said, if you just want power, power to blaze place throttle responce problems, power to blaze past ignition problems, fuel economy, power to rocket the next guy.. go turbo. Shit, get some nos too while you as it. But damnit, I don't want that. I've been working around trucks too long I guess. With the old trucks, it about longevity, not about instant gradification.


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## chimmike (Oct 17, 2002)

evil_001 said:


> I mean, if a freaking stock v-tec 1.9 can push out 200 at the fly, why can't a beefed up 1.6?




two totally different engines made for two totally different things.

that dohc vtec engine has a better flowing cyl head, more aggressive vtec cam grind, shorter runner intake manifold, etc. it's made for power.

ga16=made for economy.


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

ga16=made for economy.[/QUOTE]


and for boost :thumbup: 

sorry evil, i didn't mean to hurt you  but , i will give you everything that i know about NA if you want. trust me, i would love to go NA. but, like the juicehead athletes, I myself, have become greedy. i want lots of power NOW. Hell, if i had the $, i would be building a 200hp GA16DE, just to mess with RSX-S's. its possible. if you want, great person to talk to is Jason from JGY Customs. yea they deal a lot with SR's and turbos, but that guy genuinely knows his shit. at first he'll try to get you to go turbo, but if you tell him exactly what you want, he'll be more than happy to help you out. seriously. 

plus, you didn't lose me altogether, i still got mad love for the NA motor, you got my backing!


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## psuLemon (Apr 23, 2003)

besides chimmike, you guys need to learn some shit bout cars... honestly, you are sayin some of the funnest shit i have heard.. first nissan and honda are two total different motors... if you are goin to compare the 1.9L vtec, you need to compare it to the sr16ve or sr20ve.. hondas have no torque and not a very good power band, its choppy, nissan has a nice smooth powerband with more usuable power.. second the sweet 16 project produced 132whp which will be the highest until you custom fab a intake manifold and better flowing heads... second, if you turbo a car you do NOT need to change anything to improve the ignition, nissans have very good igntions.. you just have to run good ngk spark plugs and ngk wires..third, evil001, there is no way in hell there a ga16 will ever compete with an RSX type S without a turbo... for gas mileage, more power equals less gas mileage, its common sense, not rocket science... third, when you turbo a car or add more power to any car, you have to make sure your car can handle the power, because you need sufficient brakes to stop all the extra power, forht a good suspension setup will help in its own, fifth, you guys need to get a clue, a n/a ga has no chance in hell to compete with any turbo car.. you might be able to run a low 15 and i gaurentee you that you will be dropping around 4-5k if you want to do it right.. key word, is do it right.. you might want to listen to chimmike, thats why he is sponsored and you aren't guys...


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## lshadoff (Nov 26, 2002)

Here is my experience. I bought my car new, and it got about 30-32mpg on the highway. At about 9000 miles, I started adding bolt-ons. First I upgraded to AD22VF front brakes, ST sway bars, Eibach Prokits and GAB shocks, and Courtesy STBs. Then I went after the engine. 

I ended up with the following mods: 
JWT S2 cams 
JWT ECU 
Place Racing CAI 
HotShot Gen2 header 
GReddy cat-back 

The highway mileage dropped to 24-25mpg. 

The header developed a crack a few years later, and I decided to go turbo instead of replacing the header (leaving all else the same). I got the HotShot turbo kit (Exhaust manifold, T3 turbo, front intercooler, Bosch BOV, and all piping). At the recommendation of JWT, I got adjustable cam gears and decreased the overlap of the S2 cams by 5*. 

Later, I added a 3" cat-back, which did not affect the highway mileage. 

The car gets 30-32mpg on the highway and makes about 210WHP at 9# boost.

Lew


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

yo psulemon, i am willing to bet that with the right amount of internal engine work (pistons, con rods, etc custom of course), a sick top end (built head with crazy valvetrain, custom ITB, manifold, etc), and other things, i think you can extract enough power to butt rape an rsx-s in an NA application. our blocks are hardcore, so that always helps. i dunno if its worth it (it depends on the person, and their wallet size), but i think it is possible. i know my share of information on cars.

but you are right, i'm sure its not that streetable. plus, i totally agree with the things you said about upgrading the brakes, suspension, etc. in order to get a car that fast safely, you NEED to upgrade your shit. 

just don't rip on us!


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## psuLemon (Apr 23, 2003)

and you just proven mike and i's point.. you will be spending shit loads of money to get that power, and you better hope the RSX type S is stock cuz even with a cai, they gain 18 whp and your only chance to keep with one is turbo, highly modded sr20de motor or you get an sr20ve motor..... and its also hard to do extensive valve work on our car cuz there isn't much room for improvement, this is where your ignorance of the motor plays a factor... you need to learn everything bout the motor, i dont yet, but if you study some of wes's post on the heads, go to npm and look at the write ups you wil understnad...

im not really ripping on you guys, you just aren't using valid information or proven facts.. 

ps. power isn't everything, its power to weight ratio, your suspension setup and driver itself and about a million other factors


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

tru dat tru dat... thats why i am crossing over to the dark side, and going with a turbo-riffic setup :thumbup: weeeee

still, there are high potentials for our GA in NA form, its just, the $ makes it value issue. we have vtc, STRONG block, and other things. if someone wanted to invest the $ in the GA, it would be sick motor. IF...


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## chimmike (Oct 17, 2002)

I don't see you getting 160whp without cams that aren't even available to you...let alone insanely high compression, bore/stroking the engine, major headwork.......insane amounts of money.

and I don't see you butt-raping an RSX-S.


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

well, our cars are lighter, and our torque curve would also do us some justice, but i admit, i was exaggerating a bit about the whole but raping thing :thumbup:. 

i will still defend that with the proper NA setup, 200 hp (@ the crank) is achievable. with a shitload of MONEY AND WORK.


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

chimmike said:


> I don't see you getting 160whp without cams that aren't even available to you...let alone insanely high compression, bore/stroking the engine, major headwork.......insane amounts of money.
> 
> and I don't see you butt-raping an RSX-S.


My god!! I've missed alot! Ok... I know about the torwue difference in the V-tec, but I dind't came back to change.. no, correct what I was saying. Shame on me. Think about it.. I'm not just gunnin' for the jucie of thw week... since I've had this horride bitch of a car for like 10 years, 2 of them it's been dead. So, in 8 years of drive that engine, I got 222,000 miles... I got it in my head to aim for a million on the chassi. And I need engine life. SOOOO... I'm hunting down alot of different types of mods, wheel choices, intakes, exhausts, heads, came gears, flywheels, ignition system set ups, SP, grounding.. and MAYBE a turbo, but only after the port polish and piston upgrade. Am I'm gona be able to compete on a 1.4 mile, straight from the gate with a RSX-S? nope... not without that little juice. But, I'm not for that. If I wanted speed and power to the upmost, I would have gone for the upgrade and gotten the 2, and then jumped the turbo, but I didn;t. Shit, it was the same price. 

The disagreements here are small. It's realy funny that every one wants proof, and so far only one person had brought the numbers. Which by the way, was a appricated, even though it hurt my case (FUCKER) :thumbup: 

AS FOR THE SPONSERING.... like I care. A monkey can get sponsership if they know someone. OR just be seen. GO to the damed meets, the shows, race. Someone will remember ya. It happens. Ya look for it, cuz they are looking to. Don't use that argument. Please. And just because someone is new HERE, doesn't mean their new to the hardwear. It's assuming that if you don't have sponsership or 2,000 posts on the NIssan forums, you're mindless and have no knowledge. Like I said, most of my turbo work is on diesel engines. I know that there are fundimental differences between a deisel engine and a gas driven (I've blowen them ALL up MU HAHAHA). I also know about metal stresses. 

Yes yes.. I've already agree with the concept of dollars to hp ratio... a turbo is the way to go. But I don't want to blow *another* engine.


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

himbo said:


> well, our cars are lighter, and our torque curve would also do us some justice, but i admit, i was exaggerating a bit about the whole but raping thing :thumbup:.
> 
> i will still defend that with the proper NA setup, 200 hp (@ the crank) is achievable. with a shitload of MONEY AND WORK.


And why the hell isn't anyone willing to put in the work huh? The cost drops once you do most of the work. Quailty part for ANYTHING< turbo or not, is gonna cost. It's like getting a tat and expecting it not to hurt. Give me a break!


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

evil_001 said:


> And why the hell isn't anyone willing to put in the work huh? The cost drops once you do most of the work. Quailty part for ANYTHING< turbo or not, is gonna cost. It's like getting a tat and expecting it not to hurt. Give me a break!


hey look... I'm triple posting!! Is this thread ever gonna die? :loser:


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

well i dunno why, i was gonna do it, apparently you were too (or so we thought). its cuz we're deranged, and delusional. but thats all gravy :thumbup: :cheers: :fluffy:


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## psuLemon (Apr 23, 2003)

i was never implyin that newbies dont have knowledge, but rather lack the knowledge of this motor to know what you are talkin bout. i dont know everything bout this motor, nor will I ever know as much as some on here. my comment bout ignorance was directed bout the lack of knowledge about our motor.. i say that because many many newbs come into this section or the ga section and claim they are going to hit insane numbers without turbo or nitrous. if you searched i gaurentee you that you would see like 90 other threads talkin bout goin N/A and producing insane numbers. that fact is our motor, like most nissan motors are made to be turboed. honda motors and the VE motors are the N/A motors becaue thier head design.. the ga holds a lot of boost without problem, the sr is even better.. we dont do N/A, its simple.. so if you wanna drop 4k on N/A, custom fabricating parts and then go, UHHHHH i should have gone turbo, dont come back to us and cry bout it.. it is really either your choices to do as you please, we are just tellin you the facts why not to do it.. you will be dissappointed...


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

psuLemon said:


> i was never implyin that newbies dont have knowledge, but rather lack the knowledge of this motor to know what you are talkin bout. i dont know everything bout this motor, nor will I ever know as much as some on here. my comment bout ignorance was directed bout the lack of knowledge about our motor.. i say that because many many newbs come into this section or the ga section and claim they are going to hit insane numbers without turbo or nitrous. if you searched i gaurentee you that you would see like 90 other threads talkin bout goin N/A and producing insane numbers. that fact is our motor, like most nissan motors are made to be turboed. honda motors and the VE motors are the N/A motors becaue thier head design.. the ga holds a lot of boost without problem, the sr is even better.. we dont do N/A, its simple.. so if you wanna drop 4k on N/A, custom fabricating parts and then go, UHHHHH i should have gone turbo, dont come back to us and cry bout it.. it is really either your choices to do as you please, we are just tellin you the facts why not to do it.. you will be dissappointed...



and thats why i'm goin turbo :thumbup:


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

No, I don't think I'lbe disappointed. I don't think I'm gonn have to dump 4 grand to achieve 130 whp. Insane numbers... over 200, yes, but I think goin from like what is it, 87 or something whp, to 130 is not insane. 160 is high, but worth shooting for simple to see it it can be done. As for the boost, different purpose. When I DECIDED that I want sheer power, and I've already upgraded ny suspension, rear disc upgrade, rotor upgrande, cali upgrade... and more then likly go from auto to manual, then I'll rock the turbo. As for the crying... you just don't know man. I guess the fact that I'm so adimite about it right NOW doesn't seem to mean anything to you guys. Always trying for short cuts. And everything I do for the all motor set up would benifit a forced aspiration set up. So, if I wanna... I could, with a turbo, after I've "wasted" my money to achieve the unachievible, I'll give the little bitch her jucie, and rooooock a 230+... at the wheels bitch!


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

thats the way to be :thumbup: . i didn;t realize your car was auto, or that you were going for 130 hp. thats more than doable for less than $4k


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## pete? (Jul 6, 2004)

evil_001 said:


> No, I don't think I'lbe disappointed. I don't think I'm gonn have to dump 4 grand to achieve 130 whp. Insane numbers... over 200, yes, but I think goin from like what is it, 87 or something whp, to 130 is not insane.


you would be surprised. there is only so much you can do NA. i dont know were the cut off is but your deffiantly going to want to check out www.nissanperformancemag.com and www.sentra.net im sure they mantion an estimate of NA HP cut off some were


evil_001 said:


> And everything I do for the all motor set up would benifit a forced aspiration set up. So, if I wanna... I could, with a turbo, after I've "wasted" my money to achieve the unachievible, I'll give the little bitch her jucie, and rooooock a 230+... at the wheels bitch!


That is not true at all. NA set-ups completely for forced induction. With NA you will most definitely need nigh compression to achieve 130hp...its feasible but not with out $$$$$$$ in one off motor work. The reason it will be one off and there for extremely expensive is because the price it takes to go NA is higher than a turbo setup and for fewer horsepower


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

well, you are def. right about the high comp pistons, then, you could only boost like a honda. but, i think overall, i think a lot of mods would benefit a turbo set up, ie flywheel, pulley, etc...


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## pete? (Jul 6, 2004)

yes.......then why not just simply do the turbo friendly mods and then save up alittle longer be content with your peppy mods untill you have enuff $$$ for boost? i dont see the logic in going na waisting a crap load to get to 130hp <like i said im sure it can be done but$$$) then junking the na later to go boost. when you could spend much less in the long run but going boost in the first place


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## psuLemon (Apr 23, 2003)

evil, you really have no clue the extent of work you are goin to have to do with an N/A, especially an auto to obtain 130whp... and you will be spend a load of money on it, whether you would like to think that or not. lets face it, you dont have the R&D to get products to produce more hp then the ones out there.. so even if you can get a discount on HS, JWT or Stromung produces, you will need someone thats knows how to do some good head work, valve work and a whole lot of other work. yea 132whp was obtainable, but you have to know what you are doing... so when you get more than that without juice, then you can show us..


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

yea bro, i would def. agree w. lemon and pete, autos have crazy parasistic losses and other losses at the torque converter. this is especially true with an older transmission. i would at least swap in a stick if i wanted to get 130whp, even if you do get an aftermarket torque converter, it'll still slip, causing you to lose power


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

himbo said:


> yea bro, i would def. agree w. lemon and pete, autos have crazy parasistic losses and other losses at the torque converter. this is especially true with an older transmission. i would at least swap in a stick if i wanted to get 130whp, even if you do get an aftermarket torque converter, it'll still slip, causing you to lose power


oh, I know about the power lose at the torque converter... but I really dont wanna swap out the transmision just yet. I thought about it.. and it's gonna be hard to hit the 130 _TILL_ I swap it, but that's just not something yet. SO 130 at the wheels is gonna be difficult. BUT, I *do* have a clue as how much I'm gonna be working on it. I guess no one really sees I want this to be difficult. I want the hard road. This is my project. This is my expiriment. I got the dough for now. 

Then there's the cost to hp benfit. See, that's all anyone is talking about. However, engine life is a big thing for me, and throttle responce. Engine efficency. POwer comes after it's ready. I'm not doing any turbo NON friendly mods. I just have a goal before I start to consider at turbo. If I decided against a turbo, then I'll stop, but if I decided to go ahead for the boost, I'll have just about al the ground work ready and next to nothing to worry about.

This is gona take me a while, I know. But, I want to. I want something to do that eveything thinks can't be done. And if you turb out to be right, and I still want to get the stupid power, I'll go turbo. What the hell... but not till *I * think* I * am ready. I wonder sometimes. Everyone whats everything to get done quickly.. be easy, or cheap. Sometimes, it's ok for have something slow, hard or even expenive. Call it stubborness, or arrogence, or even ignorance.. shit, call it sentimentality, but I wanna do this.


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

psuLemon said:


> evil, you really have no clue the extent of work you are goin to have to do with an N/A, especially an auto to obtain 130whp... and you will be spend a load of money on it, whether you would like to think that or not. lets face it, you dont have the R&D to get products to produce more hp then the ones out there.. so even if you can get a discount on HS, JWT or Stromung produces, you will need someone thats knows how to do some good head work, valve work and a whole lot of other work. yea 132whp was obtainable, but you have to know what you are doing... so when you get more than that without juice, then you can show us..


And remember, I know 132 is already done... I've heard about 141, but I haven't seen it since.. to my goal is 130... And then, once I'm there, I'll plan it out with some guys I know to see how far we can push it. If I can't..., then.. well, I can't, and I'l be another song bird for the GA16 HP cap.


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

*I forgot!...*

I forgot to tell ya... I got a Japanese engine... so, that does change some things :dumbass: Imisson are gonna be hell, but I know a welder for the custom exhaust.


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## himbo (Sep 20, 2003)

yo evil, i got your back, i would definitely support your cause. definitely talk to JWT and JGY customs. those guys are really nice, and they are very knowledgable. seriously, maybe they can set u up with some custom parts to help you achieve your goal. GO FOR IT!!! :thumbup:


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## psuLemon (Apr 23, 2003)

first, i never said it would be cheap, i know both routes are expensive and time consuming, second, i have heard many riduculous claims of like 150whp without spray or turbo, but no one could produced results. but remember your arguement was you could get more power for around the price of a turbo.. not gonna happen, you could get a level 10 tranny to stay auto.. but its gonna cost immense amounts of money to build up your car... you will never a custom intake manifold for better flow and better valvues and springs... lastly, you know a welder, so do i, if you are tryin to squeeze the hp out of an exhaust, you will want to go stromung, cuz you wont get as much out of the exhaust if you ahve a friend weld it then if you buy the stomung.. remember, there are different variences for metal and metals react different..


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## evil_001 (Dec 3, 2004)

*HAHAHAHAHAHA... it is reborn!!*

Ok... I have to say something to them turbo guys... ok, I was wrong about that whole gas milage thing. The only reason gas milage ever suffers after a turbo is put on if because once the wicked thing kicks in, you jump into a higher furl copnsumption range faster. So it's really about driving style.

Second... I know better then to tr to get more horse power out of the exhast system because I'll lose back pressure which is, to a point, nessicary for a naturally aspirated engine. If I get no pressure, I lose air turbuence and low end power (remember, I wasn't all abou that whole drag thing... and still am not will a little 1.6). 

And I'm sure everyone know's a welder... shit, *I* weld now. Though I don't think I'll be fabin' anything for the little one anytime soon. My point was I could save money with my own piping and tuning with my friends in the shops. I just have to make a decision as to my operating range...but that is something a little different.

Why resurect this post?... so i can live up to my promise... I think 130 is a bit high a goal...I mean, could have done it, but the more I looked, the more if was gonna be a SLLLLOW and expensice process. Unlike turbo which is a fast and expensive.


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## Mauricio Ayala (May 19, 2005)

well i'm not sure of this because in my contry there is not a dyno for calculate the hp, but some friend have GA16 with a good compresion 12:1 and his 1/4 time is low 15s , and the cars don't have JWT cams and not computer. and many of you forget something important what about gear you can make the shift very short at high rpm making the 5 shift in the 1/4 of mile and you take a very fast car doing this


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