# Picked up 1992' 240SX today, planning RB25DET!



## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

After searching for a while I finnaly found a perfect candidate... a 1992' 240SX with a garaged (read: perfect) straight body and very very nice white paint. It is the KA24DE with an auto. 

I am in the process of getting rid of my American car, a twin turbo camaro (www.geocities.com/kingtaling) and will use the money to procure an RB25 front clip. Im also tossing around the idea of the SR, but its just been done and re-done by locals here in miami so often that just about ever 240 has one now. 

Anyways, I did start the thread for more reason than to just brag, I have a few questions. Ive searched the board for months now, decided I wanted an S13 a while back, and I already know a few things about it, but I have a few questions now that I cant seem to find on the boards. lets start with the Odometer, It says 147K miles, which I thought was odd when I checked out the car, its nearly pristine inside and out. The oil also comes out looking as clean as it goes in, the motor is not as dirty as I would expect a 147K car to look. I buy it anyways, and on the drive home, I noted something odd. 

The MPH guage reads about 30% higher than I am actually going. This explains the oddly high mileage on the Odometer, I think. What would cause this? It is not consistant, after resetting the trip meter it seemed to stop doing this, for about 5-8 miles, now its back again!

My next question is, this car will be the daily driver while I sell my camaro. It was just "tuned up" (wires, cap, plugs) by previous owner, and I changed the oil today, changing fuel filter and pcv tommarow, but... 
I hear a click noise coming from the valve cover, I assume it is the dreaded "timing chain guide" being slapped by the chain. A local 240 enthusiast says, dont worry about it, pull the valve cover, remove that guide, and forget about it. I am worried the other guides or tensioner in the motor may be bad as mentioned in the recalls/service update guide I read a while back. After some more searching, I could not find part numbers for the items that need replacing. has anyone done this replacement, or know if the 92' was subject to the tensioner failure, or guide failure, or knows the part numbers of what I need to buy? A trip to pepboys revealed no worth while information, they carry "timing overhaul kit" and "timing chain kit" and a few other weird-special order things. Ideas here? 

Next issue is ... starting. Tonight, car hot, I grabbed some food with a friend, and car would not start coming back out. didnt click, didnt do anything. I tried 3 times. thinking the car had maybe it had to do with the little "shift release" button (dont know why it occured to me) on the shifter, I pushed the button down and played with the shifter. the car proceeded to start normally. Is there a parking safety switch on this vehicle that may be going bad? Its the only thing I can think of. 

The car needs better breaks. A friend has some rear spindles (S14 5lug) and I was going to get the RB front clip (which I THINK you can use the front 5 lug items from.. .?) I was thinking of doing this all the way around and using the S14 stuff. Is it worth it? I hear alot of, use 300ZX stuff, on this site. what do you think? 

the next issue is... well nothing. other than those few things, the car is perfect. I am surprised at the suspension, Never driven one of these before, so im not sure how it is supposed to handle, but I am impressed. even my camaro with upgraded shocks/struts/bracing etc... did not handle this well. 

Since I plan on a motor swap anyways, I dont plan on spending gobs of money on a tired KA. but I do want it to last about another 5-10K miles, which it probably would without touching it ever again, but nevertheless if there is a problem inherent in this motor I would like to fix it before my oil pan floods with coolant  

Ill get some pictures, so far out of 15-20 cars I have seen, this was the nicest, most well kept, and the cheapest!!! $1,000 it was mine, cash. almost a shame to tear into it... Almost.


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## Joel (Jun 11, 2003)

You think it handles well now, wait till you get some coilovers, bush kit, swaybars and some decent width 17's!


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## Nizmodore (May 9, 2003)

Joel said:


> You think it handles well now, wait till you get some coilovers, bush kit, swaybars and some decent width 17's!


What does Handle mean  lol, (hell I'm a Commodore driver, I don't know the meaning of the word!)

Still the best handleing car EVER is the old Alfa Sud 1500 with a 1200 TI gearbox in it


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## Yeahkillah (Jul 19, 2004)

lame..what are you going to do with all that rb25det canyon mob? if youre talking about handling


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## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

<b>lame..what are you going to do with all that rb25det canyon mob? if youre talking about handling</b>

Well my primary goals are drivability, power, handling. In that order, too. If anyone seriouselly thinks the RB25 is going to destroy my drivability please let me know now!

As for power, From what I have read so far, the RB25 has a 1000RPM higher redline than the SR, supports more power on the factory bottom end, and is 1/2 Liter larger. 

Since I plan on maintaining drivability I dont plan on any head/cam/intake work, or even opening the motor unless its necessary to fix something on the inside... 

If anyone has an opinion that the SR would be a better choice, speak up. I would much rather spend the less $$ getting an SR clip and dropping it in than going through with the RB, but like i said before everyone around here has an SR powered 240 already. 

Can anyone answer any of the questions in my first post by any chance?


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## Chuck (Nov 19, 2003)

well theres a reason behing everyone doing an SR20.. because its cheap, if it blows up, its replaceable, reliable, quick, light, and a crapload of mods availible for it.. if you get an SR, it will cost less to drop it in, as well as be lighter.. you wont need a custom driveshaft, but, its all dependant on do you want an SR20, or a RB25. sure, the sr20 doesnt cost as much, and doesnt make as much power.. but if you spend the extra money you would on getting an RB25, on mods for the sr20.. you would be up to the RB25's power pretty quickly


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## SteveMcNash (Aug 15, 2004)

Both engines would work for drivability, they are both good motors. As others have said you'll get more power out of the box from the RB25DET, after all there is no replacement for displacement, but it's going to be more costly then the SR20DET. Putting an RB25DET into an S13 chasis will take a lot of money, and a lot of time. Along with that aspect i don't believe you can keep power stearing or AC, but i could be worng. At the very least if you want those two things it will not be cheep. The SR20DET was designed to fit in the car, so having it be a perfect fit, with all the trimmings is easier. So it all depends on how much time and money you have to spend. 
These links might be helpful

http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/tech/0309scc_hybrid/ <-RB25DET into 240sx

http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/tech/0205scc_silvia/ <-SR20DET into 240sx

Good luck! 
Hope this is helpful


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## Nizmodore (May 9, 2003)

SteveMcNash said:


> Both engines would work for drivability, they are both good motors. As others have said you'll get more power out of the box from the RB25DET, after all there is no replacement for displacement, but it's going to be more costly then the SR20DET. Putting an RB25DET into an S13 chasis will take a lot of money, and a lot of time. Along with that aspect i don't believe you can keep power stearing or AC, but i could be worng. At the very least if you want those two things it will not be cheep. The SR20DET was designed to fit in the car, so having it be a perfect fit, with all the trimmings is easier. So it all depends on how much time and money you have to spend.
> These links might be helpful
> 
> http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/tech/0309scc_hybrid/ <-RB25DET into 240sx
> ...



You can keep A/C and power stearing


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## 180SX-X (Sep 21, 2003)

SR or RB either way is fine...you dont seem on going for pure handling, and you own a camaro, so if you put a RB in your 240, i still think handling will be better than your camaro. if you plan on doing a 5 lug conversion with z32 brakes and whatnot, this link will help you decide on what you want to do...
http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/projectcars/0211scc_projsilvia/


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## mudder (Aug 9, 2004)

You might consider the RB20det as well, still plenty of power, a bit easier install, and right now they're cheaper to get than SR20's. As far as handling you should take into account how much difference in weight the motor are, I think the 6 cyl is a couple hundred pounds heavier than the SR, which changes overall balance and handling.


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## 2Fass240us (Aug 2, 2004)

mudder said:


> You might consider the RB20det as well, still plenty of power, a bit easier install, and right now they're cheaper to get than SR20's. As far as handling you should take into account how much difference in weight the motor are, I think the 6 cyl is a couple hundred pounds heavier than the SR, which changes overall balance and handling.


It's about 110 pounds, per reasonably-trustworthy published data.

Don't do RB20DET...if you get an RB motor, at least get the RB25DET. The RB's are less tolerant of pump gas, and the weight delta between the SR20DET and RB20DET is not worth it considering it has the same displacement as an SR.


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## Joel (Jun 11, 2003)

An RB20 is a hell of a lot cheaper than an RB25


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## Kelso (Apr 29, 2003)

i dont think opium has had any problem with his rb20 on pump gas right? rb20 is one of the cheapest swaps you can do, and not too hard to do either.rb25 could give you a bunch of problems on installation but for some people, its an easy swap...

sr20 is a higly overrated swap with tons of hype on the engine. nobody really knows a whole lot about it.everyone just goes dude you can put a silvia motor in your car! the uhh....ohh i heard it in fast and furious....oh ya sr20!
its actually not that cheap when you put it in the ring with the rb20 and ca18...


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## OPIUM (Aug 18, 2002)

nope... no problems due to pump gas what so ever....


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## 2Fass240us (Aug 2, 2004)

And the RB20DET isn't that cheap when you look at better mounts to locate the engine more favorably, a kit to re-do the intake piping so it doesn't obstruct your spark plugs, harness work, etc.

Why do people hate on the SR because it's popular? :thumbdwn: Ever stop to think that there's a reason for the popularity outside of ricekidz wanting to be cool? FYI: my good friend is in the Marines and served 3 years in Japan, and said he *never* saw a S13 with a RB20DET. And he owned a R32 GTS-T! If he advocates the SR, then why shouldn't I?!?!

I'm not even going to talk about current aftermarket support for the RB's stateside versus SR aftermarket parts availability...

Anyways, my $0.02: if funds allow, go SR or RB25. IMHO, if I could only afford the RB20, I would save my money until I could afford either the SR or the RB25. But maybe I'm just a retard...


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## Kelso (Apr 29, 2003)

lol...nobody is hating on it just for its popularity.my thought is this: it has lots of aftermarket parts for it and has been the current jdm engine for a few years now. i could make a fairly accurate assumption to say that more people have 91-94 240's and those are the cars that the red top drops in with no problem. 89-90 it drops in too but youll have a few small things to work out, no big deal. but most people want it cause its newer also.and like i said, overseas the rb isnt held at high regard, but here, when you look at the 2 choices, the rb will likely reign supreme...


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## 2Fass240us (Aug 2, 2004)

Kelso said:


> and like i said, overseas the rb isnt held at high regard, but here, when you look at the 2 choices, the rb will likely reign supreme...


Hehe...if you looked up the word "subjective" in the dictionary, you might find something like this!  I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here. I will say this though: RB's are great engines. They have excellent power potential as many have shown, and are great platforms to build upon (or even leave stock). But if it were me, I would get the SR if I wanted something 2.0L.


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## mudder (Aug 9, 2004)

I wasn't recommending the RB20 over the SR or 25, simply offering another option. As far as spending for motor mounts and piping, it's not that bad if you know someone who can do the welding. 
I think lots of folks naturally assume that if you have a 240, you've swapped in an SR20. They've seen plenty of those and just aren't as interested as seeing an RB25. No one is hating on SR20s, just looking for something new.


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## 2Fass240us (Aug 2, 2004)

mudder said:


> I think lots of folks naturally assume that if you have a 240, you've swapped in an SR20. They've seen plenty of those and just aren't as interested as seeing an RB25. No one is hating on SR20s, just looking for something new.


If people wanted something "new," they wouldn't be looking at 240's with JDM turbo Nissan motors...

As far as I'm concerned, someone getting a RB2_DET for that reason is doing it for the wrong reason entirely.


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## mudder (Aug 9, 2004)

2Fass240us said:


> If people wanted something "new," they wouldn't be looking at 240's with JDM turbo Nissan motors...
> 
> As far as I'm concerned, someone getting a RB2_DET for that reason is doing it for the wrong reason entirely.



If people weren't looking for "new" things to do with their 240sx they wouldn't have started swapping SR20s into their american 240 to begin with. Or doing sylvia conversions. Or wide bodies or coilovers or any of the stuff that didn't come from the factory. The search for new and different things has led this crowd to where things are today. For the better. For every Sil-eighty with an SR20DET conversion there is someone out there wanting something different.


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## 2Fass240us (Aug 2, 2004)

mudder said:


> If people weren't looking for "new" things to do with their 240sx they wouldn't have started swapping SR20s into their american 240 to begin with. Or doing sylvia conversions. Or wide bodies or coilovers or any of the stuff that didn't come from the factory. The search for new and different things has led this crowd to where things are today. For the better. For every Sil-eighty with an SR20DET conversion there is someone out there wanting something different.


The point is that swapping in any Nissan motor, especially a JDM turbo one, is hardly ingenuous. To me, a smallblock Chevy, 13B, or jet-frickin-powered engine is "new" in terms of a powerplant for the 240.

I do appreciate however, the trailblazers who brought the 240 to where it is today.


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## mudder (Aug 9, 2004)

I agree.


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## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

*great*

So it sounds like the SR is a better situation motor, where the RB is a better awe factor motor. persoanally, i was going with the RB for power and awe factor, but if im going to rebuild the motor anyways, the smaller / lighter SR seems a better choice for me, especially when it comes to parts availability and drivability when modified situations. 

I see great potential in both motors, and even after coming up with costs to install each the RB25 was still only about $600 more to install than the SR (unmodified longblocks). 

anyways, this is the reason the post was started, and my questions were 90% answered. I think I will be happier with the SR, now that I know what I know. I have searched plenty, but i guess this proves that searching doesnt always answer the personal aspect of a question you have.


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## TheNose247 (Jun 19, 2004)

i'm goin to put a 3-rotor in my fastback...well not really but just a thought, i have copyright on that folks


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## OPIUM (Aug 18, 2002)

TheNose247 said:


> i'm goin to put a 3-rotor in my fastback...well not really but just a thought, i have copyright on that folks


 It's been done


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## TheNose247 (Jun 19, 2004)

how did it perform....then i'll get a 4-rotor


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## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

Ok I decided pretty much what Im going to do now. I will be picking up a blacktop S13 clip from a local place in miami next month. Ill stick a clutch and intercooler on it, and run it like that for a bit to make sure all is well with the motor. 

Eventually, I will probably go with one of enjuku's manifolds and turbos, they are making some good numbers with that setup, well over 350whp on the stock intake/cams/head/bottom end, with a nice powerband. Ill do 770's, and a ROM tune to compensate. Should run pretty good, i think, from what I have seen and read so far!


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## Nizmodore (May 9, 2003)

Ha! the SR isn't that much smaller......around 140mm.....why not a CA18? I'd prefer one of those to a SR.....

Still If your in the states, and well I sorta have an Idea of what your aftermarket scene is like, I'd go a SR.....If you lived out here, well no question, go the RB....

And the handeling argument? Probably made up by people who couldn't afford the RB......


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## BoostsFed (Oct 20, 2004)

if you're coming from a tt comaro, you would be happier with the rb25det. one of NICO forum member put down over 580HP on a stock rb25det motor, and it's not yet maxed out.

i have been drving my rb20det-s13 for awhile and it's been nothing but fun. if i had to do it over again, i would do the same (rb20/rb25/rb26....)


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## Nizmodore (May 9, 2003)

BoostsFed said:


> if you're coming from a tt comaro, you would be happier with the rb25det. one of NICO forum member put down over 580HP on a stock rb25det motor, and it's not yet maxed out.


Sorry but that would be on the limit in my experience......Stock, you mean stock internals? So many times at dyno comps you see a RB25DET putting out just over 300kw (400hp) at the treads, and bamm there goes a conrod out the side of the block.....

Still if he did get that much from a stock motor, well kudos to him! I would be really interesed to know how he did it....

That is one reason I'm building a 3 Litre RB.....


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## BoostsFed (Oct 20, 2004)

Nizmodore said:


> Sorry but that would be on the limit in my experience......Stock, you mean stock internals? So many times at dyno comps you see a RB25DET putting out just over 300kw (400hp) at the treads, and bamm there goes a conrod out the side of the block.....
> 
> Still if he did get that much from a stock motor, well kudos to him! I would be really interesed to know how he did it....
> 
> That is one reason I'm building a 3 Litre RB.....


stock as in stock internal, turbo were upgraded, of course. show me taht "so many time" deal!!! can we say bad tuning???


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## Nizmodore (May 9, 2003)

BoostsFed said:


> stock as in stock internal, turbo were upgraded, of course. show me taht "so many time" deal!!! can we say bad tuning???


Not really, thats with the tuning spot on......Did he use a thicker head gaskit to drop the compression ratio?


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## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

picked up motor yesterday, picked up clutch bov boost controller pump today, going to start the swap this weekend. should be done in a few days ? we will see. I am following the guide on heavythrottle.com, are they leaving anything out? 

also, bought a profec B-type2, I understand the controller is not a "fuzzy logic" deal, and I am considering returning it and upgrading to a fuzzy controller. suggestions? Is anyone happy with the profecB -2?


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## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

*Woo fun*

Well guys heres an update! 

I put in a redtop SR20DET and put 2200miles on it, until last week when I found a super-clean low mileage blacktop, It checked out to be a 98' from a 180SX with a J4 ECU and 54C pistons... So I picked it up! 

I put it in last week, 400 miles on it so far. Gave the redtop back in trade with some $$$. Running good, but I think i ripped a silicone coupler, it wants to miss and stutter at anything more than 8PSI of boost, and fuel economy is hurting. Havnt had a chance to check it out though, still at work. 

Anyways, just though i would share. So, 2 motor swaps in 1 month, what fun! I even took the redtop to the track, but I could only trap 100MPH with my shoddy 1.68 second 60' times


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## OPIUM (Aug 18, 2002)

I wouldn't call 1.68 60' times "shoddy" at all. That's really friggin good. That's basically unheard of if you have an open diff. What other supporting mods do you have with your SR now? And congrats on the swap. It's one thing to talk about it all day, but totally different when you finally get to drive the thing.. way to much fun.


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## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

OPIUM said:


> I wouldn't call 1.68 60' times "shoddy" at all. That's really friggin good. That's basically unheard of if you have an open diff. What other supporting mods do you have with your SR now? And congrats on the swap. It's one thing to talk about it all day, but totally different when you finally get to drive the thing.. way to much fun.



HAHA oops. I meant 2.68 60' Times. LOL  It took me a minute to realize why you were saying that was so good, man its been a looong weekend.


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## OPIUM (Aug 18, 2002)

Oooooooh okay... 2.68  now that sounds a little more like it. I'm not one to call :bs: on people because anything's possible for the most part, but yeah 2.68 is ALOT more like it hahaha. Yeah keep workin on it. I would suggest an aftermarket LSD in the near future if you like to drag race. I read of one guy on another forum that took .5 seconds of his 1/4 time after he installed a kaaz 2way. So it should be something to look into as well as a 1 piece driveshaft.


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## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

OPIUM said:


> Oooooooh okay... 2.68  now that sounds a little more like it. I'm not one to call :bs: on people because anything's possible for the most part, but yeah 2.68 is ALOT more like it hahaha. Yeah keep workin on it. I would suggest an aftermarket LSD in the near future if you like to drag race. I read of one guy on another forum that took .5 seconds of his 1/4 time after he installed a kaaz 2way. So it should be something to look into as well as a 1 piece driveshaft.


I was SOOO close to buying a 1piece driveshaft when I hear that sometimes they cause problems with vibrations because of the off-set geometry it causes. I know that on a car with pinion angle a different height suspension or driveshaft angle can give you improper pinion and ruin your launches. So the 1 piece is ok?


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## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

And another thing, As i stated before I think i have a boost leak, but now I am not so sure. It seems as though the computer is ignoring my TPS sensor, I verified 5V at WOT going out on the white wire though. Why do i think its ignoring it? I unplugged it and drove the car, observing no change in its drivability. Does anyone have a pinout for the J4 ECU? 

The problem is it begins to stutter and miss, after 4000rpm or so. it gets worse on high boost. doesnt seem to want to make power... fuel pressure is good. Im wondering maybe the tps is wired in wrong, keeping the fuel or timing incorrect. Also, the car will idle at 1500rpms with the IACV plugged in. I have it unplugged now, because the idle simply will not come down, unless the car runs for like 30 minutes and really heats up, then it will drop the idle to 800 where its supposed to be. I unplugged and re-plugged the coolant temp for the ECU (2 wire) and noted a change in idle, so I know the ECU is seeing the temp sensor, only thing i can think of is maybe the ECU is in some sort of SAFE MODE ignoring the TPS and making it run rich and idle high? I cannot check for codes because I dont know which wire is the CEL and how to jump it to flash codes?


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## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

Ok I am a retard. after purchasing a new sensors, checking my wiring, changing my plugs, building a boost pressure tester to pressure test for boost leaks, etc... I got into my car and turned the key and all the lights went out...

I went under the hood, sure enough, loose positive terminal connection. tightened it down, 

Problems are all gone. 

Just call me RETARD from now on, okay?


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## OPIUM (Aug 18, 2002)

hahahaah, well its good to hear someone else did something equally as stupid today. Today I couldn't get my motorcycle to start. Only to find out a good half hour later that the kill switch was engaged.. DURF!!! hahahaha! Your in good company. At least it was a simple fix.


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## Kingtal0n (Aug 3, 2004)

Oh it gets better! Last night I got beat on by several cars I shouldnt have. Lost to an M3, 550i, S2000, C5 vette, and even a G35. I was like, how could this be! 

So i went home and checked for boost leaks. 
2 ripped couplers, 1 leaky BOV flange, 1 leaky brake booster, 1 leaky Fuel pressure line, and 1 leaky boost guage later... ITS LIKE A NEW CAR! 

Maybe this time I will do better at the track! just for fun, I went out today and found a G35 and toasted him. Made my ego bigger!


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