# wheel spacers and longer studs



## MCHNHED (Dec 22, 2002)

i noticed the rear of my 200 has a smaller track width than in the front, which kinda bothers me, even though it is FWD, and that the rear is noticeably recessed.

i think the spacer/stud combination would increase cornering capability and make the overall look nicer, but i have 17" wheels with 205/40 tires. would i have a problem with fender side-wall clearance? what are some opinions on this setup (preferrably from people who have delt with it before)?


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## ltcassio (May 7, 2004)

sweet jesus son, don't you feel the pull on your engine?

and, from what i've heard, spacers shouldn't give you much of a problem, but that was from 4 different people with 16"s... so i don't know a/b yours...


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## nizzan4u2nv (Apr 14, 2004)

What width and offset are your wheels? I have 17x7.5 and 5mm spacers in the rear, and it rubbed. I had all the fenders rolled after that.


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## MCHNHED (Dec 22, 2002)

hmm... i have 17x7 Miglia Mille MM11-2 wheels and a 96 200SX SE, but i don't know the offset. how do i find this out? mine don't rub now but i'm afraid if i widen it that it will rub


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## ltcassio (May 7, 2004)

*grunt* i _think_ the offset is 40mm, i could be totally wrong and it's 35, i don't remember


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## azkicker0027 (May 31, 2002)

well, i'm thinking of getting some spacers too for wider track, cause the heliums are at 40, my streets are at 38, and with the streets, i seemed to have done better at the track. "wider is better"??


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## MCHNHED (Dec 22, 2002)

azkicker0027 said:


> .... "wider is better"??



exactly what i was thinking. i remember some older pontiac commercial with a grand prix (or grand am?) driving through what was portrayed to be alaska. then some alaskan guy says "ee-ah-ho-la-ula" at the end, which supposedly means "wider is better" in some alaskan language 


so should i just not worry about widening the track unless i start using this on the track?


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## Greg200SE-R (Feb 5, 2003)

Spacers are one of the first mods I wanted to do to my car after buying it, I hated how "set in" the back wheels were, made the car look weak. Heres my car after putting on H&R 25mm(!) spacers. Made a huge difference in the way it looks, much more aggressive. 










I would recommend no more than 15mm though, because of rubbing. with 17x7 and 205/40s and an aggressive drop, you may not have to roll your fenders, depending on how "square" your tires are. Even with round-shouldered Falken 512s, fender-rolling is mandatory with my 25mm spacers. 

As far as handling, the wider track is probably not better, since our cars tend to understeer from the start. Widening the track will give the rear even more grip, and at the same time effectively reduce your rear spring rates (very slightly tho). I compensated with higher spring rates and a rear sway bar. The looks far outweigh the drawbacks though and the spacers are one of the best mods I did to my car i think. good luck.


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## Jaralaccs (Jan 18, 2004)

that looks freaking amazing. im ordering these when I get home


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## Radioaktiv (Feb 12, 2004)

who sells them?


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## Jaralaccs (Jan 18, 2004)

I froogle'd it and only saw 5mm and 15. plus the website that sold them wasn't even working
greg where did you get yours?


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## MCHNHED (Dec 22, 2002)

Greg200SE-R said:


> I would recommend no more than 15mm though, because of rubbing. with 17x7 and 205/40s and an aggressive drop, you may not have to roll your fenders, depending on how "square" your tires are. Even with round-shouldered Falken 512s, fender-rolling is mandatory with my 25mm spacers.


I have 17x7 Mille Miglia MM11-2 wheels and Kumho Ecsta 711 tires, which are pretty "square". I also have the Eibach Pro kit (1.4 inch drop front/rear) and KYB AGX shocks. I love the way those spacers make the car look, and I want to buy this kit, but I don't want to buy/install it only to find out that i'm rubbing the fenders and have to roll them. (i have fiberglass fenders and i think that might be a problem anyway)  is it not worth the trouble?


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## Radioaktiv (Feb 12, 2004)

i just bought 8mm spacers on ebay (yay)
we'll see how it works out

only paid $17 for 2, so it wont be a big loss
linkage > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=7915808376&category=33749


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## nizzan4u2nv (Apr 14, 2004)

Greg200SE-R said:


> Spacers are one of the first mods I wanted to do to my car after buying it, I hated how "set in" the back wheels were, made the car look weak. Heres my car after putting on H&R 25mm(!) spacers. Made a huge difference in the way it looks, much more aggressive.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I really like the way that looks. I would get bigger spacers but that puts a lot of stress on the hub.


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## Greg200SE-R (Feb 5, 2003)

MCHNHED said:


> I have 17x7 Mille Miglia MM11-2 wheels and Kumho Ecsta 711 tires, which are pretty "square". I also have the Eibach Pro kit (1.4 inch drop front/rear) and KYB AGX shocks. I love the way those spacers make the car look, and I want to buy this kit, but I don't want to buy/install it only to find out that i'm rubbing the fenders and have to roll them. (i have fiberglass fenders and i think that might be a problem anyway)  is it not worth the trouble?


you have a body kit? I don't know how much clearance you might ahve but you can have someone bounce the back of the car up and down by standing on the trunk latch area and watching the tire clearance. Bounce the car evenly, cuz that's when they rub most. Looking at the wheel like a clock, pay attention to the 12 oclock area as well as the 9 and 3 oclock areas (whichever is toward the front of the car). Surprisingly I only rubbed the side of the wheel well right above where my sideskirts ended.

With stock fenders, a drop, square tires and 17x7/40mm offset wheels, up to 10mm spacers are safe. 15mm spacers *might* need very slight rolling of fenders but 15mm wouldve been safe on my car. 20mm and up look damn good but you need to roll 'em at least a little. Rolling fenders is easy, and not so bad for the paint since they won't be rolled more than 45 degrees up. 

I got H&R Trak+ spacers from www.sixautoworks.com. Theyre not on the site, but give them a call and they should be able to help you. H&R makes the best spacers out there, but will cost you around $100 a pair (includes studs). 

Regardless of where you get them from, if you get H&R be sure to mention wheel stud sizes. The studs have shoulder splines on them (ribs that hold them in the hub) and H&R makes studs with 2 spline sizes - 12.xx and 14.xx millimeters. B14s need the 12.xx mm size. MAny dealers don't know about this and WILL send the wrong size if you don't mention this. The spline size is denoted on labels which seals the H&R boxes. Post pictures up if you guys put spacers on! 

Oh yeah, nizzan4u2nv is correct, spacers do place more stress on the hub but even with huge 25mm spacers I've had no problems at all (w/disc brakes).


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## Jaralaccs (Jan 18, 2004)

awesome, thanks. you just did your rear tires right?


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## Greg200SE-R (Feb 5, 2003)

I have spacers on the front too, but I put them on after lots of debate. 
In the end, I decided to put them on because of the way it looks. 

I normally care more about performance than looks, and the spacers in front do somehow affect handling, though I can't feel a difference yet. The offset of a rim is carefully engineered and throwing all of that off can affect things like the "Dave point" (Dave Coleman of SCC named it), which in turn can affect handling dynamics and stability. 

But, I figure a front-wheel drive has so many limitations anyway, what the hell. So I slapped spacers on for the looks.

Ever notice how dropped Hondas with 40mm offset wheels have their stance and offset just perfect? Honda has been thinking of things like this for a long time, damnit. I hate spending money to fix problems on my 200 that shouldn't be there in the first place! We shouldn't need things like spacers and shortened strut bodies to bring our cars up to par.


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## Radioaktiv (Feb 12, 2004)

well
i put my ebay spacers on yesterday

they were only 8mm
and im glad, because if they were any longer I would have felt unsafe keeping the stock lugs.

the track of course was widened _slightly_, and the wheels pushed out more flush with the rear fenders (i could tell...but it was only a bit)

overall Im happy with my $17 upgrade


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## Jaralaccs (Jan 18, 2004)

any pics?


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## Radioaktiv (Feb 12, 2004)

i'll be doing an update in the member rides section in about a week or 2.
i'll post the pics then

dont have any right now :thumbdwn:


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## bahearn (Jul 15, 2002)

Theoretically, a wider track will reduce body roll in a turn. In the case of the Sentra, the track difference with a spacer isn't enough to cause a noticeable change in roll rate.

With some wheels and spacers, the amount of lug thread available may be too short. Ideally, you want lug length = to half the nut height protruding above the nut when seated. Realistically, as long as the stud is at least flush to the top of the nut you should be okay. If the stud doesn't reach the top of the nut, get longer lugs. NISMO makes 50 mm lugs that fit perfectly. They make 60 mm lugs, too, but several people have had problems with those, including me. Only downside is $8 per lug.


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## Greg200SE-R (Feb 5, 2003)

bahearn said:


> Theoretically, a wider track will reduce body roll in a turn. In the case of the Sentra, the track difference with a spacer isn't enough to cause a noticeable change in roll rate.


This is true. However, there is a difference between the B14 and B15 rear beams that is interesting to me. The B15 seems to have about an inch wider track in the rear than B14s. I know this to be true, by comparing a friends B15 and my 200. Because of this, reputable suspension company Tein seems to think this difference is enough to warrant an increase in spring rate for the B15 - their basic coilovers come with 336lb (6kg) rear springs while B14 basics come with 280 (5kg) spring rates. Not so with the SS coilovers tho. I took this into consideration and bought 336lb replacement rear springs for my SS setup to help with both the spacers and overall f/r balance as well. "Mike's Garage" mentions this difference in B15 track width also. 




bahearn said:


> With some wheels and spacers, the amount of lug thread available may be too short. Ideally, you want lug length = to half the nut height protruding above the nut when seated. Realistically, as long as the stud is at least flush to the top of the nut you should be okay. If the stud doesn't reach the top of the nut, get longer lugs. NISMO makes 50 mm lugs that fit perfectly. They make 60 mm lugs, too, but several people have had problems with those, including me. Only downside is $8 per lug.


Any reputable company that makes spacers should include a full set of replacement lugs. Even though 5mm spacers wouldn't necessarily require new lugs, H&R will include a new set anyway. Eibach makes spacers as well, and should include brand new lugs also.


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## superfro86 (May 15, 2002)

where did you get the h&r spacers and what other sizes do they have available? about how much does it cost to get the fenders rolled anyway?


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## Greg200SE-R (Feb 5, 2003)

H+R spacers from www.sixautoworks.com, you can try them. read a post earlier in this thread about spline sizes on the studs first tho. Looks like H+R only makes 5, 15, 20 and 25mm spacers for 4x100 pattern.

Rolling fenders doesn't cost anything. jack up the rear of your car, place a baseball bat between tire and fender and lower the jack till the bat is wedged in there and pushing up on the fender lip. now roll the bat slowly, putting pressure on the lip. lower the jack slightly as needed. Take it slow and stop when the lip is about 45 degrees up. any more and you take your own risk warping the fender or cracking the paint.


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## kenshin138 (Aug 28, 2004)

So I could probably get away with a 5 or 8mm spacer on the rear with no problems? I have a 98 SE with 205/45/16 tires and TEIN basics (pretty low).


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## Greg200SE-R (Feb 5, 2003)

Yup. up to 15mm should be ok unless your tires are totally tucked


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## superfro86 (May 15, 2002)

seems like to much room to fuck up with that bat thing but which would you use metal or wood? and what would be a good spacer or spacer size for some 17x7's with a 42 mm offset??


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## 1CLNB14 (Apr 30, 2002)

superfro86 said:


> seems like to much room to fuck up with that bat thing but which would you use metal or wood? and what would be a good spacer or spacer size for some 17x7's with a 42 mm offset??



Some automotive places rent fender rollers.

I plan on pushing the fronts out 8 mm and the rear 25mm.

Greg200SE-R, I checked out that site, but could not find any info on spacers.


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## Radioaktiv (Feb 12, 2004)

1CLNB14 said:


> Some automotive places rent fender rollers.
> 
> I plan on pushing the fronts out 8 mm and the rear 25mm.
> 
> Greg200SE-R, I checked out that site, but could not find any info on spacers.


couldnt you just cut the fender and use the flares (i read you're getting some)...versus rolling the existing fenders?


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## 1CLNB14 (Apr 30, 2002)

I was suggesting the fender roller to those that did not want to use the baseball bat method.

We do plan on cutting the rear fenders to accomidate the wider stance.

I may also run some crazy offset wheels in the rear.


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## Radioaktiv (Feb 12, 2004)

oh ok

cant wait man
sounds bad ass


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## Greg200SE-R (Feb 5, 2003)

1CLNB14 said:


> Some automotive places rent fender rollers.
> 
> I plan on pushing the fronts out 8 mm and the rear 25mm.
> 
> Greg200SE-R, I checked out that site, but could not find any info on spacers.


The site doesn't list them anymore, probably because H&R spacers are order-only items. H&R seems to be very strict about how they distribute their spacers and when they do ship, the boxes are sealed with a label - once the label is broken you can't return them.

Sixautoworks gave me the best prices I could find on everything I ordered from them. They are distributors for much more than what's on their website, so you gotta call or email them for the Trak+ spacers. Very trustworthy and they ship fast.


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## 1CLNB14 (Apr 30, 2002)

Right on, thanks for the info.

The car is scheduled to be back from the body/paint shop around the end of January, then I have a few months to put it all back together.

The new wheels will not come until later, but I still want to widen the stance.


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## JayL1967 (Apr 30, 2002)

1CLNB14 said:


> Right on, thanks for the info.
> 
> The car is scheduled to be back from the body/paint shop around the end of January, then I have a few months to put it all back together.
> 
> The new wheels will not come until later, but I still want to widen the stance.


Let me know if u want to sell ur old rims....I need them for mid February....My car is going to be paint next month (new body kit too) :fluffy:


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## off_da_meter (Sep 2, 2004)

1CLNB14 said:


> I was suggesting the fender roller to those that did not want to use the baseball bat method.
> 
> We do plan on cutting the rear fenders to accomidate the wider stance.
> 
> I may also run some crazy offset wheels in the rear.


I was planing to do something similar, cuuting fenders and molding in fender flares to them :cheers:


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## 1CLNB14 (Apr 30, 2002)

JayL1967 said:


> Let me know if u want to sell ur old rims....I need them for mid February....My car is going to be paint next month (new body kit too) :fluffy:


I don't know how soon, or if I ever will, sell the Velox's.

They will make nice "non-show" wheels once I get the 18's.

If I do ever part ways with them, I will be sure to contact the few people that have shown interest.


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## JayL1967 (Apr 30, 2002)

How about this spacers? Are they good?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=4511075390&category=6755


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## Greg200SE-R (Feb 5, 2003)

JayL1967 said:


> How about this spacers? Are they good?
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=4511075390&category=6755


^^^ These look pretty solid and well-engineered. but if you think about it, you can also get a set of guaranteed, German-engineered H&Rs for $150, tho they're twice the cost of less reputable spacers. not that eBay spacers won't work perfectly for you, its just that those who are willing to spend the extra money, should go with H&Rs. IMHO the less things to worry about the better, an extra $75 is worth it in this case.


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