# Took the B12 Autocrossing !!!



## astreamk1 (Apr 16, 2004)

Had a chance this weekend to take the car out for a day and see how she'd do when pushed a little. Didn't do too bad over all, but wasn't breaking any records. Turned a lot of heads, I almost felt like I was driving a classic due to the amount of newer cars there. I think a lot of people were surprised to see such an old Nissan tearing up some blacktop !!! I think next year I may need to get another set of wheels and tire strictly for racing and whatever. That stuff is just too hard on your everyday tires.


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## lshadoff (Nov 26, 2002)

Moved to Motorsports


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## MShorten (Jul 19, 2004)

astreamk1 said:


> Had a chance this weekend to take the car out for a day and see how she'd do when pushed a little. Didn't do too bad over all, but wasn't breaking any records. Turned a lot of heads, I almost felt like I was driving a classic due to the amount of newer cars there. I think a lot of people were surprised to see such an old Nissan tearing up some blacktop !!! I think next year I may need to get another set of wheels and tire strictly for racing and whatever. That stuff is just too hard on your everyday tires.


Very cool! Looks great! What kind of times were you running? 

I should post some of my livejournal entries on my practice and race runs on my 91...

Regards,
Michael


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## astreamk1 (Apr 16, 2004)

MShorten said:


> Very cool! Looks great! What kind of times were you running?
> 
> I should post some of my livejournal entries on my practice and race runs on my 91...
> 
> ...


Well, my times were nothing amazing. I pulled a consecutive 49 seconds on almost every run. went from a high 49 on the first to 49.000 something on my last run. I would say most of the cars were somewhere in the mid 40's that day. I have never run this car at all in anything like that, so i guess i could have done worse. didn't hit one cone or go off course, so i guess all and all, wasn't bad for a first try with probably one of the lowest HP cars there.


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## Crazy-Mart (Jul 14, 2002)

you might want to get a better breaking system too... that kind of competition is fading the brake fast also  thats pretty cool


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## astreamk1 (Apr 16, 2004)

Crazy-Mart said:


> you might want to get a better breaking system too... that kind of competition is fading the brake fast also  thats pretty cool


I started collecting parts for upgraded calipers, rotors, and lines, but won't get to that until winter probably. surprisingly the OEM stuff does ok autocrossing. I want to take it out on an open track one day, but definitley not until the brake are upgraded.


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## Matt93SE (Sep 17, 2003)

Ummm, if you have problems with brakes at an autocross, then you have a problem with the system. any OEM brake system should be capable of making it around a 1minute autocross course without fade..


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## B11sleeper (Oct 15, 2003)

You need a stiffer rear end!
Controlling body roll will help you stay on the throttle too.

To be honest, on my b11 with oem brakes I've never faded them in a rally cross. The only thing that makes them fade is coastal mountains, Bigger mountains don't have so much vertical change.

I'd worry about stiffening up the suspension and putting more air in your tires. if you want handling get 15" rims and 50 series tires. 70 series tires just aren't 'sporty'.


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## astreamk1 (Apr 16, 2004)

Actually, my brakes worked just fine. I think Crazy was just suggesting that a brake upgrade was a good idea. Stopping a B12 on an autocross course is not much of a challenge, even for it's puny stock brakes. 

I actually have front and rear Pulsar SE sway bars already, Sprint Springs, Tokico Struts, and front and rear strut braces. My tires I am running now are 205/50/15's. Not a bad setup for that car really. After seeing how much the car looks like it was rolling in that picture, is really hard to believe because the control was not bad at all. I think if I could change one thing, I would get tires that were a bit more sticky.


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## asleepz (Feb 24, 2004)

Yeah I did tried a bit of that in my 300ZX. Forgot the take the T-tops out of the hatch and had one hit me in the back of the head. Nice lil car you got there.


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## sunnydet90 (Sep 10, 2004)

damn nice job bro and props to you on the car itself it looks clean as hell


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## Flying Vv (Apr 10, 2003)

they wouldnt let you run if you went to tech with those back in there, therefore its your own dumb fault.

my spec-v does about mid pack in the STD class, though i did well in STE last time.

the tire, suspension tune is key in auto-x, but the driver is the most important. i improved my lap times by working on my braking and turn in points, also on a FWD i found it easy to late apex, lift the throttle and do a little thottle-lift oversteer. ate the hell out of my tires though


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## astreamk1 (Apr 16, 2004)

Flying V said:


> they wouldnt let you run if you went to tech with those back in there, therefore its your own dumb fault.
> 
> my spec-v does about mid pack in the STD class, though i did well in STE last time.
> 
> the tire, suspension tune is key in auto-x, but the driver is the most important. i improved my lap times by working on my braking and turn in points, also on a FWD i found it easy to late apex, lift the throttle and do a little thottle-lift oversteer. ate the hell out of my tires though


I pretty much came in last in STS, but not very far behind a BMW and a Civic. I would almost guarantee I was the lowest HP in class. I need a little more seat time too. This was only the first time with this car and only my third time ever autocrossing. 

And V agree with you totally on the tire thing, eats them up like crazy. If i was going to do this on any regular basis, I'd definately invest in some race tires....


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## MShorten (Jul 19, 2004)

astreamk1 said:


> I pretty much came in last in STS, but not very far behind a BMW and a Civic. I would almost guarantee I was the lowest HP in class. I need a little more seat time too. This was only the first time with this car and only my third time ever autocrossing.
> 
> And V agree with you totally on the tire thing, eats them up like crazy. If i was going to do this on any regular basis, I'd definately invest in some race tires....


Lucky you. I have to run with "stock" tires, can't go below a 70 aspect ratio. This sucks when you're thinking about going to 14" wheels so you don't have to shift from 2nd to 3rd... this is for oval track racing.

TOTALLY agree about seat time. I had no idea how important this is. I've also found that there is just no substitute for actual racing experience, it's far different to be practicing around the track than to be in the middle of a race, watching everyone else whip around the corners and you're trying to figure out how to keep up...

Heh.
Regards,
Michael


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## astreamk1 (Apr 16, 2004)

MShorten said:


> Lucky you. I have to run with "stock" tires, can't go below a 70 aspect ratio. This sucks when you're thinking about going to 14" wheels so you don't have to shift from 2nd to 3rd... this is for oval track racing.
> 
> TOTALLY agree about seat time. I had no idea how important this is. I've also found that there is just no substitute for actual racing experience, it's far different to be practicing around the track than to be in the middle of a race, watching everyone else whip around the corners and you're trying to figure out how to keep up...
> 
> ...


Would stock for you include any tire that car originally came with ? If so, couldn't you jump to a 185/60/14 as the SE-R's came with ? Technically that would still be a stock size correct ? I was running the 185/60/14's on my car before and it was a huge advantage over the 175/70/13. See if your glovebox or your owner's manual lists both sizes as an option. That way if someone argues with you, you'll have it in print.


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## MShorten (Jul 19, 2004)

astreamk1 said:


> Would stock for you include any tire that car originally came with ? If so, couldn't you jump to a 185/60/14 as the SE-R's came with ? Technically that would still be a stock size correct ? I was running the 185/60/14's on my car before and it was a huge advantage over the 175/70/13. See if your glovebox or your owner's manual lists both sizes as an option. That way if someone argues with you, you'll have it in print.


Wish I could...

_"TIRES AND WHEELS: REQUIRED: Stock type wheel with broadline street tire with a maximum cross section of 195 millimeters and aspect ratio of 70, 75 or 78 only (i.e. P195/75R14) no regrooving, shaving, recaps, or chemical treatment is allowed. Tire must have at least 2/32nds tread remaining in at least two grooves. Maximum rim diameter 15”. No aftermarket wheels. Same size and profile required on all four corners._

Could I get away with it a couple of races? Maybe, but then if I start to do really well, I'm going to get tech'd and there you go. 

I took a look at that Miata tire size comparison calculator and I forget the exact measurements that would be "OK" with an aspect size of 70 - we'll see - I'm probably going to find some steel used 14"ers, throw some cheap tires on them and run around the track and see if it's worth playing with the body a bit to get them to work. 

Always something and gotta work, work, work to run with the top dogs...

Regards,
Michael


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## Matt93SE (Sep 17, 2003)

I doubt they'll let you get away with it on the oval track. that's dirt I assume, isn't it?
probably the reason they're requiring such a large sidewall is protection on the rim from hitting ruts or dumps in the track. do that on a low profile tire and you'll hook a rim into the dirt and flip the car. used to do a lot of IMCA and mini-sprint racing with friends back in high school and I can't even count how many times we flipped that sprint car after hooking a rim. grrrrrr.

thus, the tires are often one of the many things they check pretty regularly at the track.


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## MShorten (Jul 19, 2004)

Matt93SE said:


> I doubt they'll let you get away with it on the oval track. that's dirt I assume, isn't it?
> probably the reason they're requiring such a large sidewall is protection on the rim from hitting ruts or dumps in the track. do that on a low profile tire and you'll hook a rim into the dirt and flip the car. used to do a lot of IMCA and mini-sprint racing with friends back in high school and I can't even count how many times we flipped that sprint car after hooking a rim. grrrrrr.
> 
> thus, the tires are often one of the many things they check pretty regularly at the track.


The track is concrete/asphalt, banked. I can see what you're saying, last practice, I had a hard spin in the middle of the track and I "felt" the tire "give" - best I can explain it, but it was definitely "folding" or doing something strange. 

Yea, I'm fine with stretching things as far as they'll go within rules, but I'm not going to risk running on tires that aren't good for the car/track. We'll see about the 14"ers... figure it's always worth taking a spin in them and seeing how it goes...


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