# Experience using 16'' rims vs 17'' on the X trail



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Well got the new to me slightly scuffed 16'' 5 spoke rims with 215 65 16 Toyo Gi5 winter tires put on the X today, and I must say after using 17'' ones all these years, and especially today after changing from 225 55 17 all seasons, the 16'' ones absorb the cracks and ruts in the Gatineau area roads much better. What have I been missing? The old girl seems to like the extra sidewall.
Of course, she had to remind me of the joys of the frozen doors. I had to climb in through the passenger side! But as per usual after heating and directing the vent on the locking mechanism, it freed up after a 20-minute drive. Mind you its not the first time after an almost 20 degrees swing in temperature since it had been used. But heck I am so happy it's running great that its part of its charm.
I am at a real quandary with it. I don't really want to have two vehicles. But as you all probably know I am attached to this car. It's driving great, everything works, AWD in a Gatineau park snow-covered parking lot rocks with the Toyos. Even my fear about the coolant loss is finished, it has not moved from the full line in a week and the heat is great. I swear its driving as well as when we bought it 10 years ago. Brakes are fantastic, all the cv joints and boots are good
In addition to the new plugs, fuel injectors, throttle body, and fresh synthetic oil change, the coolant was changed in the spring, same with the transmission fluid upgraded to synthetic, rear Brake pads I renewed the Bosch Quietcast, as one of my caliper pins had seized, and did a full front and rear brake service Replaced the blower motor and its amplifier with new good quality ones. Brake fluid replaced last year, as well as the rear struts. All the bearings are good and top quality. Every bit of the suspension from control arm bushings, front and rear struts, front control arms, end links, all 6 of the rear multi-link suspension arms have been replaced by me over the past 3 years. Body, paint and glass are all in good shape It really should be good for the next few years. It doesn't even have an exhaust rattle.
Do I keep it for the cost of gas, and $25 a month or so for registration? Do I pass it on?. I think I would have to ask something like 3K or 3.5K for it. The 1K to 1.5K ones seem to have issues, neglect, rust and 100K more mileage. Of course, once again the X trail is in a class apart in that neither carfax or Kelly black book includes it in their valuation calculators. Until the end, the X will always be the exception!


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## X-hale (Apr 17, 2017)

Mine has 16" wheels winter and summer. The hwy 105 is one of the roughest roads in any developed nation and low profile tires are out of the question. At the end of the highway lies Gatineau, home to the roughest roads in any modern city.
I had my drivers door apart last spring for a lock problem and lubricated everything thoroughly. I hope it opens all winter without issue. The other 3 will likely to continue to cause grief. The X is the first car I've owned that has this problem constantly.


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## freewayjoe (Jul 20, 2018)

quadraria10 said:


> Well got the new to me slightly scuffed 16'' 5 spoke rims with 215 65 16 Toyo Gi5 winter tires put on the X today, and I must say after using 17'' ones all these years, and especially today after changing from 225 55 17 all seasons, the 16'' ones absorb the cracks and ruts in the Gatineau area roads much better. What have I been missing? The old girl seems to like the extra sidewall.
> Of course, she had to remind me of the joys of the frozen doors. I had to climb in through the passenger side! But as per usual after heating and directing the vent on the locking mechanism, it freed up after a 20-minute drive. Mind you its not the first time after an almost 20 degrees swing in temperature since it had been used. But heck I am so happy it's running great that its part of its charm.
> I am at a real quandary with it. I don't really want to have two vehicles. But as you all probably know I am attached to this car. It's driving great, everything works, AWD in a Gatineau park snow-covered parking lot rocks with the Toyos. Even my fear about the coolant loss is finished, it has not moved from the full line in a week and the heat is great. I swear its driving as well as when we bought it 10 years ago. Brakes are fantastic, all the cv joints and boots are good
> In addition to the new plugs, fuel injectors, throttle body, and fresh synthetic oil change, the coolant was changed in the spring, same with the transmission fluid upgraded to synthetic, rear Brake pads I renewed the Bosch Quietcast, as one of my caliper pins had seized, and did a full front and rear brake service Replaced the blower motor and its amplifier with new good quality ones. Brake fluid replaced last year, as well as the rear struts. All the bearings are good and top quality. Every bit of the suspension from control arm bushings, front and rear struts, front control arms, end links, all 6 of the rear multi-link suspension arms have been replaced by me over the past 3 years. Body, paint and glass are all in good shape It really should be good for the next few years. It doesn't even have an exhaust rattle.
> Do I keep it for the cost of gas, and $25 a month or so for registration? Do I pass it on?. I think I would have to ask something like 3K or 3.5K for it. The 1K to 1.5K ones seem to have issues, neglect, rust and 100K more mileage. Of course, once again the X trail is in a class apart in that neither carfax or Kelly black book includes it in their valuation calculators. Until the end, the X will always be the exception!


My truck came with the 16'' rims and tires. The all seasons it had were good condition and fine for rainy/dry roads but i needed something sure footed when the temp dropped below 7C and occasional , rare winter snow dump. So i had put on a very good lite truck all weather tire and have never needed to swap after change of seasons. But to answer your last question about you keeping or selling your own xtrail.....maybe time to sell it. I mean, it really all depends on if you do not mind spending any money on monthly insurance and any possible future maintenance costs on a near 14 year old vehicle. Other reason is it depends on if you will actually use a spare second vehicle or if it will just sit there 95% of the year. I say that from personal experience as twice before i was in the position of owning two used vehicles and i ended up paying the insurance on both, rarely ever drove the other. When i did drive the other vehicle, was more for the novelty and change of routine. Some people have the extra money for maintaining two vehicles and can afford the insurance and upkeep, maybe they have a spouse or teenager that needs to use the second vehicle or it is a small pickup truck needed for errands and hauling, if you are in that category, keep it.....all a very personal choice .


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## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Thanks for your thoughts freewayjoe. I am thinking that I will have to rotate it into use if I am going to keep it. Just thinking do I want to be shuffling it in the driveway regularly, and having to clean it off. No maintenance should be needed on the X for another 5 months or so, and insurance and registration are not an issue. What I am thinking I should do is just keep it for the next couple of months, as insurance in case some unexpected issue pops up with the Subaru. It would be nice to recoup some of the money I have spent, but its not like I have any real financial need to move it


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## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Well just spoke with a guy I know who used to have an X trail, which sadly got T-boned last year. He would go by our place with his dog and always remark what a great vehicle it was. Anyway got talking and said I was thinking of selling for 3.5K, but maybe 3 for someone I knew. Well, the world moves in mysterious ways because he had just been talking with a friend who needs a good small truck for going up steep roads in and around Wakefield. He was telling me how this guy marveled at the X trail's winter climbing capabilities when he had his. Anyhow he just called me up to say he is going to advance the money for his friend and buy the car for 3000. Coming into town on Friday for it. 
Its all kind of a sudden. I haven't even advertised it but for a private sale with 224,000 kms its a pretty good price to get.
Still kind of torn, but I know it would be getting out of the city, and getting the kind of longer drives that would be good for it and not be in stop and go traffic as much. Sounds like I am putting a good horse out to pasture.


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## otomodo (May 23, 2008)

I always had 16 inches and found them very soft. 
Good for you. You won't miss the rusted rotors and jammed calipers.
Even with the xtrail as a daily driver the rear calipers seize. 

I ve installed my winter tires this weekend and what a job!!!
Lucky i had my grinder and my belt sander to get the rear rotors up to good shape.


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## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

HI Otomodo
I know your pain. Near as I can tell the problem is usually one of the rear caliper pins seizing. Regarding the tires, I did go from 225 55 17s to 215 65 16s and yes the handling is not quite as good, but going down streets I take every day I noticed the extra sidewall helps with all the cracks and ruts in the roads around here. Mind you its also colder and the winter tires are softer than the all seasons, and have a lower speed rating, and so are stiffer to begin with.


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## otomodo (May 23, 2008)

Even my hybrid had a seized pin. 

I guess i have to mind myself this is my winter beater and i love to get my hands dirty. 
A jeep wrangler is on my wishlist,can you imagine the time i would spend on repairs?
As long as i can repair it, it'll be fun to do it.





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## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Well the X is sold, and the transfer will happen on Tuesday. Long may it live but I have done my decade with it. I am just sad by the state of Nissan today. Still pretty pleased I found someone who knows the value of the vehicle, and wants it for its particular abilities to go up steep hills in slippery conditions. It's his friend who walks his dog by my house who told him about it and he has already put down a 2500 deposit for him and he will pay the 500 balance next week when we do the transfer. Not only have I not advertised it, the guy has not even test-driven it. Easiest used car sale in my life.


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## otomodo (May 23, 2008)

He won't be disappointed, with all of the maintenance you ve done to it. 

Wishing you the best of luck with the forester.

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## freewayjoe (Jul 20, 2018)

quadraria10 said:


> Well the X is sold, and the transfer will happen on Tuesday. Long may it live but I have done my decade with it. I am just sad by the state of Nissan today. Still pretty pleased I found someone who knows the value of the vehicle, and wants it for its particular abilities to go up steep hills in slippery conditions. It's his friend who walks his dog by my house who told him about it and he has already put down a 2500 deposit for him and he will pay the 500 balance next week when we do the transfer. Not only have I not advertised it, the guy has not even test-driven it. Easiest used car sale in my life.


''
''Not only have I not advertised it, the guy has not even test-driven it. Easiest used car sale in my life.
[/QUOTE]''...good on your end, but the buyer and driver of your Xtrail should at least sit and test drive it before spending his cash on it. Not your problem, but a person should do their part and at least sit, test drive, try out the options, likes/dislikes, etc . Hopefully they buy it and never once whine to you about something they dislike or ''wish you told them'' blame game...you know what i mean?


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## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

I know what you mean, and do find it unusual, but he lives outside the city and the money was paid by his friend who used to own an X -trail, and the guy has been in one before. I am sure mine is at least as nice as that one would have been. Still, I will go over it all with him on Tuesday and I am sure he will be far more pleased than disappointed.
Here is some of the service history
Engine related

02 sensors upstream and downstream changed May 27, 2015 (NTK)
Camshaft and Crankshaft sensors changed May 2016 (Nissan OE)
Serpentine belt and belt tensioner replaced June 2017 (Gates)
Ignition coil boots replaced june 2017 (NGK) and PCV valve Nissan)
Oil cooler gaskets replaced (Nissan parts) at Speedy Jan 2018
Engine air intake hose replaced, and MAF cleaned May 2019
Engine air filter replaced May 2019 (Denso)
Fuel Pump replaced August 2019
Spark plugs last changed Sept 2019 (NGK 5018 Platinum)
Fuel injectors replaced with OE Nissan Oct 2019
Intake Manifold gaskets replaced
Throttle body replaced Oct 30 2019 with Hitachi OE part
Engine air idle relearn performed at Hull Nissan Nov 2019



Fluids (last change dates and mileage)
Oil and filter changed Oct 2019 Mobil 1 5-30 and part Valvoline synthetic high mileage
Transmission fluid Drain and fill with Castrol full synthetic Transmax June 2019
Radiator coolant full flush 2014 at 140,000 km drain and fill (prestone) June 2019
Brake Fluid replaced July 2016 
Power steering fluid changed at 150,00 and partial drain and fill at 210,000
Front Transfer Case and Rear Differential Gear oil Valvoline semi-synthetic 2013


Other
Battery replaced and upgraded Jan 2014 Motomaster Eliminator
Headlight bulbs changed July 2016
Complete vehicle rustproofing done at Can Tire Oct 2013
Head unit with sat nav and back up camera installed 2018
Custom seat covers for front and back Oct 2018
In cabin blower motor and amplifier replaced, as well as cabin filter (Denso) May 2019



Suspension
Rear struts replaced with KYB Excel G April 2019
Rear left hub and wheel bearing replaced (NTK) Aug 2018
Left hand front control arm, cv boot and outer tie rod and sway bar link
Right side inner and outer tie rods replaced (Nissan)
Right front hub and wheel bearing, and right rear wheel bearing (Timken) July 2017
All six rear suspension arms replaced Nov 2016 (Febest OE line)
Right hand front control arm replaced July 2016 (Beck/Arnley)
Left front sway bar link and both right and left bushings replaced
Front Struts and mounts left and right replaced (KYB) July 2015
Both front wheel bearings and left hand control arm replaced March 2015
Both side rear sway bar links and control arm bushings replaced June 2014

Other than the subframes every single part of the suspension has been replaced over the past 5 years


Brakes
Rear brake pads (Bosch ceramic) and full brake front and back brake service May 2019
Right hand rear caliper and flex brake hose replaced July 2018
Rear rotors and pads changed June 2017 (Bosch ceramic)
Front rotors and pads changed (Raybestos ceramic) July 2017
Left hand rear caliper replaced May 2011


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## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

Well, congratulations on such an easy deal!! Nice friend that guy is, fronting the money...wish I had a friend like that, haha! Your comment on hill climbing is seconded by me.... I have gone up some pretty steep hills when snowy, a bit icy just in 2WD. Plowed through some unavoidable drifts the other day, too. Anyway, I see you are still dispensing advice on here, which I hope you will continue to do once in a while! Cheers!!


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## freewayjoe (Jul 20, 2018)

*quadraria10*
Thought i'd ask, had you ever previously considered the Suzuki Grand Vitara ? the one i liked was the 2010-11 GV with the 3.2V6, 4 wheel drive. Rated at 230 horsepower, that be great...except the mpg at 17mpg city, which would be a great shock to my system compared to the 4 cylinder Xtrail. The GV i road tested back in 2006 had 2.0L inline four (156 hp), 2.7L V6 (185 hp) options, i test drove the 2.7 V6 and it drove fine but i recall it was nothing special in terms of acceleration. At 2010, it got a GM sourced 3.2V6. I do recall the vehicle had a nice enough ride, a very good 4x4 system, nice interior. One thing not fond of is the rear door like hatch with a potential rattling outside plastic spare tire carrier ( similar to when toyota rav4 had that rear hatch door/spare tire combo on the back end). Spoke to a few Vitara owners in the pas and they seem to be well liked little 4x4s, durable and fairly troublefree . One issue similar to the Xtrail i discovered was the lack of aftermarket parts and being stuck with buying new parts or limited accessories from a suzuki dealership. Sometimes in the end it just becomes more economical and less hassle to go buy a used Rav4, Forester, Outlander, etc ....any opinion on the grand vitara?


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## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Nothing wrong with the later Grand Vitaras, solid vehicles, but I think you are right that finding parts for them must be its own bit of fun and probably worse than for the X trail. I don't even know if there is still a Suzuki dealer here? 4 cylinders are fine with me and my needs. Quite liking the Forester. It's similar enough to the X to feel familiar, but its also different enough to feel new to me. The visibility in them is fantastic, the seats are more comfortable, and the drive and handling are terrific. With the safety features, they have you can see why they have their fans. 
Last thought about the Vitara is that the fact they were never a huge seller means there are not tons of used examples to compare. A bit like going for the later Saturns. Of course, if you really want to be brave you can get a heck of deal on a used Tiguan!


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## freewayjoe (Jul 20, 2018)

quadraria10 said:


> Nothing wrong with the later Grand Vitaras, solid vehicles, but I think you are right that finding parts for them must be its own bit of fun and probably worse than for the X trail. I don't even know if there is still a Suzuki dealer here? 4 cylinders are fine with me and my needs. Quite liking the Forester. It's similar enough to the X to feel familiar, but its also different enough to feel new to me. The visibility in them is fantastic, the seats are more comfortable, and the drive and handling are terrific. With the safety features, they have you can see why they have their fans.
> Last thought about the Vitara is that the fact they were never a huge seller means there are not tons of used examples to compare. A bit like going for the later Sa0turns. Of course, if you really want to be brave you can get a heck of deal on a used Tiguan!


i think you did a wise decision with getting the Subie. The Forester is a vehicle i wanted to buy previously, but at the time the Xtrail came up next door where i Was employed and i did a trade in plus cash to get it. My first suv and i really like it, comfy, peppy, dependable , great visibility, nice balance of engine power and fuel economy. In the near future ( 2-3 more years, we see!) So the Forester i would consider is from 2014 and up. Mind you by the time i'm ready to buy one, it will most likely be a 9-10 year old vehicle and hopefully much more affordable used price point for me. The 2014 i was reading got the CVT transmission and the mpg was greatly improved. I believe Subaru had a lot of issues with the engines pre 2014 and had excessive engine oil consumption that angered a lot of consumers. They apparently addressed that oil consumption issue from 2014 onwards...new engine block i believe. Check out this Edmunds 2011 forester review and read the first page of consumers likes/dislikes...many mention excessive engine oil consumption. https://www.edmunds.com/subaru/forester/2011/consumer-reviews/......and then the 2014 ... https://www.edmunds.com/subaru/forester/2014/consumer-reviews/


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## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Yup, I am aware of the oil consumption issues. It is mainly due to the nature of the engine in them and 0w20 oil. It only really affected NA ones and it's only here and the US that they specified that weight for mpg savings. It affected manual versions more than automatics as they were more likely to be run in higher rev bands where the consumption occurs. You can keep an eye on it and add oil to top off between changes, and/or change to a heavier weight oil which reduces the issue a lot. 
One winter about 4 or 5 years ago I used 0w30 in the X trail, and it consumed more than it ever did with 5w30. Anyhow at least the 2011 and 2014 share the newer engine with a timing chain. Supposedly their CVT is less problematic but 2014 was the first year with it so I guess in a couple of years you will have a better sense of how they age. I know auto journalists like to rag on the ''old tech'' of a 4AT, but I have never minded them and in my mind, they have the benefit of proven long term reliability. At least the X trails with them never had the transmission issues of the Rogue.


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## freewayjoe (Jul 20, 2018)

quadraria10 said:


> Yup, I am aware of the oil consumption issues. It is mainly due to the nature of the engine in them and 0w20 oil. It only really affected NA ones and it's only here and the US that they specified that weight for mpg savings. It affected manual versions more than automatics as they were more likely to be run in higher rev bands where the consumption occurs. You can keep an eye on it and add oil to top off between changes, and/or change to a heavier weight oil which reduces the issue a lot.
> One winter about 4 or 5 years ago I used 0w30 in the X trail, and it consumed more than it ever did with 5w30. Anyhow at least the 2011 and 2014 share the newer engine with a timing chain. Supposedly their CVT is less problematic but 2014 was the first year with it so I guess in a couple of years you will have a better sense of how they age. I know auto journalists like to rag on the ''old tech'' of a 4AT, but I have never minded them and in my mind, they have the benefit of proven long term reliability. At least the X trails with them never had the transmission issues of the Rogue.


i think it is great my 06 Xtrail has a tried and true 4 speed auto transmission. Shifts great, smooth, 4 years driving my truck and changed my tranny fluid once , so smooth and never a leak or any issues. I have a hunch the 4 speed auto in the Subaru is just as good and reliable. I am leery of CVTs, some are better then others, but one never really knows till 4-5 years in use and some online data comes available to compare and decide if a safe bet. On the other hand, not all traditional automatics are sturdy and trouble free ( jeep 8,9 speeds, some hondas, even the newest Toyota Rav4...). As i mentioned, i think you did a smart with getting a Forester, nice vehicles overall. After i posted my reply above, i started researching a bit on other potential japanese suvs i may want one day . The Mitsu Outlander v6 GT awd comes to mind. Remember i mentioned a friend of mine has three Mitsus ? a 2018 outlander V6, a 2014 outlander 4 cylinder and a 2010? mitsu RVR.....he very pleased with his 3 mitsus, very reliable , very good daily drivers. I personally favor the 2016 Mitsubishi outlander GT awd V6.....230 hp, 6 speed auto. Nice balance of power and mpg, well built, roomy, awesome awd system, great seats/stereo, led headlights, blah blah. For fun, i just looked up a 2016 outlander gt awd on autotrader.ca.....yikes, anywhere from $23,500 to $27-27 grand. Just wondering with depreciation at the 10 year mark how much one might go for ....maybe $12-13,000 ? taking a gamble on a ten year old suv, high mileage, accident history etc.....but not much else one can do if not willing and able to shell out $35,000 and up for a brand new suv.....


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## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

I have a friend who has had a couple of Outlanders. He likes the towing capacity of the V6. The fact that most compact SUVs have gone to CVT really limits his choice.
A 2011 Outlander should run somewhere between 5K and 7,000. I just saw this 2010 for 1900 with 210,000 kms on it. Its got the 6 cylinder
https://www.kijiji.ca/v-cars-trucks/ottawa/2010-mitsubishi-outlander-xls-suv-crossover/1475801280. I cannot speak to its overall condition, but in terms of the economics you could get a younger more powerful vehicle for the same money you could sell the X trail for. And in this particular example, we are talking the top of the line model with all the bells and whistles.
Its wild that you could pay 1900, put 2500 into a repair fund and the total would be comparable to the sales tax total you would have to pay on 30K.


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## freewayjoe (Jul 20, 2018)

the 2011 Outlander between 5 to 7 K?.....that seems really cheap. Here in BC, i did a quick online check for a 2008, 2010 Outlander for 4wd, 4 cyl, ES models and about $8500- 10,000.The top line GT awd v6 i believe when new ( in various years up to 2019) sold for about $28,000- $33,000 plus. Just a guesstimate, a 2019 GT awd when it is ten years old and say 150,000 klms on it ( basing on average 15,000 klms X 10 years) and hopefully clean/no accidents ....$13K to 14,500 plus dePending on the mileage . An ES about 10-11-12K. Basing this on a dozen 2010s GTs & ES's for sale at dealer lots in BC.....sadly, Everything is expensive out this way. Anyways, be a few more years when i'm ready to buy, this is all just for fun.


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## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

That explains it. BC car prices always seem to be way higher than in Ont or QC, and that goes for the X trail as well. The link I provided was for the top of the line 2010 XLS with 6 cyl being sold as is for 1900.








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