# Blinking SES/MIL/CEL (whatever) but no code



## dsibinovic (Jun 12, 2010)

Hi All,

For starters 2004 Altima 2.5s 185k miles. 

Looking for something here. I have been combing the forums trying to find an answer. About a week ago cruising on the freeway about 75-80, approaching an uphill ramp I gave it a little gas to maintain to due to the uphill and the car bogged a little and then freaked me out with the blinking light. Before I could get WTF out it stopped blinking and car seemed fined. Next day changed oil and filter and air filter just cause it was time. Car ran fantastic for the next 3 days. I'm talking best probably in the 4 years I've owned it. Now it gets weird.
Driving down the freeway on day 4 same thing happens. Cruising along at about 65 this time and same thing with the flashing MIL/SES but this time the misfire is more noticeable and the light stayed flashing longer but went off and all is good in the universe for the moment. Later that day when I got a chance I ran by the parts store and had them pull the code. 
NO CODE! What? How can that be? :wtf:
Can't do a thing without a code. Here we are today. And low and behold this morning got the flashing MIL/SES for about 15 seconds and then it went out and that's it. So I went home tried the gas pedal method and got NO CODE. So I took it to another parts shop and they couldn't find 1 either. 

I am not imagining the blinking light or the misfires but what the heck can I do without a freaking code??

Only thing I can think of is to go to the stealership, but I don't wanna. I'm no amatuer with a wrench. Replaced the crank & cam sensors, front wheel bearings, Struts and springs, tie rods, radiator, thermostats, water pump to name a few things. 

Replaced parts that have impact here:

oil, oil filter, air filter 200 miles
O2 sensor upstream (had code) 5k miles
Bosch Platinum2 plugs 10k miles
Alternator 35k miles
Cam and crank sensor ?? miles couple years now

I did realize that these misfires were happening about 10 minutes during the first drive of the day and the car was fine for the rest of the day.

Anyone got a clue what to do next?


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

When the MIL is flashing, it is an indication of a problem that can cause damage to the catalytic converter. Almost always, this is caused by an ignition system related misfire. I agree in that there should be a stored code; perhaps a scantool might have better success. The typical causes of these problems are usually due to a bad ignition coil pack, or packs, oil in the spark plug well, incorrect or bad spark plugs or failing cam position or crank position sensors. The one thing I've learned in my 16 years with Nissan is that when it comes to ignition components, it is always best to stick with genuine Nissan or OEM manufacturer parts, like NGK, Hitachi and Mitsubishi. In your post, you mention that you have installed Bosch Platinum spark plugs. These plugs, for whatever reasons, have had a long history of not performing well in Asian-based engines. First thing I would do is replace the Bosch spark plugs with the original NGK PLFR5A-11 spark plugs. At that time, I would check for any oil in the spark plug wells, which would indicate a leaking spark plug tube seal that could potentially cause a short between the plug and the cylinder head. If there's oil, you will have to replace the valve cover on this particular engine. If it's clean, then inspect the boots on the coils for white marks, which could indicate a burn hole, or other signs of damage and replace as necessary. See if this fixes your problem. I would also question the cam and crank position sensors: were they genuine Nissan sensors or aftermarket? I've seen aftermarket versions of these sensors come bad in the box or have failed in short time after being installed. I usually replace these with the "sensor kit" used in the Nissan recall. They are cheaper than buying the sensors individually from Nissan; if you use these sensors, not the sensor with the white dot is the crank position sensor. Only aftermarket sensors I would use would be Hitachi parts. The fact that the problem occurs in the first 10 minutes (when the engine is still cold) or when going up a hill makes sense as these are times when the ignition system is under a greater load, as opposed to when the engine is up to normal operating temperature or cruising down a flat road.


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## Outkast (Jan 29, 2006)

Like he said, swap out those horrible Bosch plugs.


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

For my money, there is no better plug than NGK. Denso's are also a good plug, but I've got NGK's in every gas engine I own, regardless of year or make. Chain saws, lawn mower, generator, three Nissans, a 65 Mustang, a power washer and a leaf blower...all are running NGK's!


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## dsibinovic (Jun 12, 2010)

I have finally gotten a code 0302 through the use of no tool. You know patting my head and rubbing my belly 5 times while pushing the gas pedal. JK. But I did get the code. I have pulled the plugs and looked at them and they are all pretty spotless. Switched the #2 AND #4 coil to see if/when the blinking returns if I then get 0304 for the code and go from there. 
Never had a problem with Bosch plugs in MR2, Supra, Celica or Altima for that matter until maybe now. I'll look into it.
I missed the comment about the engine cold and it's not by this point. My engine is up to temp quick probably due to the fact that the low temp is 55 around here. I also don't start it and fly out of the garage. I give it a moment usually cause I forgot something and have to go back inside to get it.

Thanks for the help and I'll post results as I get them


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

I had a customer bring in a 92 240SX with a KA24DE and an intermittent misfire. He said he had just installed a set of Bosch platinums because the guy at the parts store told him they were the best plugs for the money. I replaced the plugs with original type NGKs and the misfire was gone. Now, this was over ten years ago, so maybe they have gotten better, but I guarantee you ask any Nissan tech what are the best plugs to put in your Nissan engine and they will tell you to stick with the original NGK's that came in it. As far as the 0302 misfire code you got, it could very well be a bad coil pack. Swapping the coils is a good idea to see if it transfers to the other cylinder.


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## Outkast (Jan 29, 2006)

smj999smj said:


> I had a customer bring in a 92 240SX with a KA24DE and an intermittent misfire. He said he had just installed a set of Bosch platinums because the guy at the parts store told him they were the best plugs for the money. I replaced the plugs with original type NGKs and the misfire was gone. Now, this was over ten years ago, so maybe they have gotten better, but I guarantee you ask any Nissan tech what are the best plugs to put in your Nissan engine and they will tell you to stick with the original NGK's that came in it. As far as the 0302 misfire code you got, it could very well be a bad coil pack. Swapping the coils is a good idea to see if it transfers to the other cylinder.


I'll answer that, HELL NO!!! I can't wait to see the cheap knock off iridium plugs in a few years that'll cause the same problem


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## dsibinovic (Jun 12, 2010)

*Ignition coil*

Well after about 50 miles today it did its light show and shut off but wait after being off for a little while it started back up and this time it stayed on. Would anyone like to guess the code it threw?

Yep 0304. So after swapping 2 and 4 when it threw 0302 it now has 304 and so simple enough once you get a code to figure these damn things out. Only thing is I know I should replace all 4 but with Holidays $400 is not the easiest thing to throw down especially when you're thinking you could limp through the end of the year just replacing the 1. At least thats what they want locally for Hitachi. Actually they want $110 each.

Anyways gonna replace the coils and put NGK plugs in and thanks for all the help and advice. If Something should arise I'll keep you posted but I think this is gonna do it this time.


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

I would just replace the single coil, myself. Rockauto.com has Hitachi coils for $62 each. The only time I replace a set of coils is when I get a P1320 code and can't identify the misfiring cylinder(s).


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## dsibinovic (Jun 12, 2010)

*I'm Back *

Well it's been about 10k miles since I had the old misfire issue and I'll start with; it has been the worst 10k miles of the car's life. After replacing the coil pack and plugs and everything seemed to be golden the car started to burn thru a little oil. Like half a quart at the 3k oil change. Whoopie right not bad but it got worse at the next oil change. That's when the fit hit the shan.

The car started to loose power and develop a really weird rattle around 3500 rpm which would make me lift off the gas to shift. And low and behold the SES lights up and anyone wanna guess the code. P0420. The light doesn't stick around so I'm thinking must of been a glitch but the power loss and rattle are still there so I'm not driving a lot or far. Store, vet and only out of necessity till I figure it out. Couple days of not driving or very short trips P0420 comes back so I take a look at the cat. Take off the manifold and look to find a nice sooty black coating. Read about the self destructing cats so i figure since its not working (code) and off the car to gut it. Put it all back together and still got P0420. Found out you need spacers on the 2nd O2 to fix that. Cool No problem. You think everything would be good. NOPE

Still had power issues and now blowing smoke out the rear. So I take by a buddy who has a shop and after driving it asks if I had the exhaust checked to see if the cat is clogged and I said I just ripped the front one out. To which he says and the back? So out comes the back cat.

Now this fixed the power issue which is great but it sounds like hell, blows smoke and after about 200 miles needs a quart of oil. Compression test shows all 4 cylinders low and wants to die at idle but once you get her going she seems fine except for the smoke screen when accelerating and the smell.

Seems the misfire caused the cat to go bad and plug up the exhaust which then caused the cat material to be sucked back in to the engine and TA DA smoky stinky engine that wants to die. And thats where we are today. I still drive it and at times at the light I have to put it in Neutral and give it gas to keep it going till the light changes and will continue to do so for another 3k miles. This car will hit 200k and then I don't know what I'll do with her.
:crying::crying:


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## CMax03 (Jan 17, 2009)

Could be a failed Headgasket....


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