# P0420 Catalytic Converter issue...



## Irish06j (Dec 29, 2010)

I have a 2005 X-Trail SE with 227,00 Kms and recently the service engine light came on and when checked by the dealer (in Hamilton) he advised of the Code P0420 reading and that the catalytic converter had to be replaced. He quoted $2400 cost for this with O2 sensors as being an extra $170 each if need to be replaced. I have read about this being an issue for Nissan. Any suggestions on going any where else for this work? Seems to be quite steep at the dealer though not sure if I would be taking a chance with anyone else.


----------



## jdg (Aug 27, 2009)

Reset the code and run with it.
227K Kms isn't all that much for a Cat or O2 sensors unless they've been beat up (i.e. poor engine tune, other problems, etc).
If it keeps coming back, then you might have issues, otherwise, if it doesn't come back, could've been just a bad gas day, or changing weather, phase of the moon, etc.


----------



## Irish06j (Dec 29, 2010)

Thanks very much for the advise - how do I reset it? When I took into the dealer it appears they may have reset it as the light was off when I picked it up but a day later it came back on. Thanks again.


----------



## jdg (Aug 27, 2009)

I say reset it one more time, Autozone, dealer, wherever you can.
If it comes back on during the next day or drive or whatever, well then obviously there's a problem of some sort.
P0420 comes on when the ECU detect the cat not doing it's job. The front O2 sensor should basically jump back and forth between rich and lean while you're driving, the rear O2 sensor, because of the cat's action, should stay relatively steady. If the rear O2 sensor starts outputting a swinging signal, it's likely the cat isn't working anymore. Like I said earlier, 227K Km's isn't too much for a cat, but if it's been beat up, it may have gotten wrecked due to bad gas, bad air/fuel mix, a number of different reasons.
If I had to do the same thing, I'd replace both O2 sensors myself and if the problem still remained, take it in and get the cat replaced. $2,400 isn't a crazy amount, but it isn't cheap. Shop around. You'll probably get that a bit lower.


----------



## Irish06j (Dec 29, 2010)

Thanks again for your advise - very much appreciated.


----------



## MySofty (Dec 30, 2010)

So if I read between the lines I don't have to worry about my cat being blocked as I only have 168,000km on the clock.
In South Africa there are no laws about cats - so I was wondering if it would be worth the cost to remove it. Would I get better performance and consumption?

Thanks


----------



## tbk (Dec 29, 2008)

If you are looking for a place in hamilton to get it serviced, I can recommend Stew's Auto Repair at 550 Rennie St, Hamilton, ON L8H 3P5. I have been going to Stew for about 2 years with my exy. He did the initial inspection on it, plus he did the oil a couple times, transfer case, diff oil, coolant etc. He is an honest mechanic. Ex volvo OEM mechanic. I went to him on the advice of a friend. Was never disappointed with his service. 

I took the car in a month ago, I was sure I had a bad wheel bearing, he took it in, inspected it, drove it and gave it back to me. He said the bearing was fine. No charge.
Nice guy.


----------



## Irish06j (Dec 29, 2010)

Thanks very much for the tip on Stew"s Auto Repair - I'll check him out.


----------



## Irish06j (Dec 29, 2010)

*Thanks tbk....*

Took tbk's advice and checked out the shop he suggested and got great service. Had to replace the catalytic converter but at half the cost quoted by the dealer. Still angry that this problem occurred on a 5 year old vehicle. I had a 1999 Honda CRV that a family member still drives and the only thing that has been changed on it are the brakes and tires - everything else is original. Speaks volumes about Nissan.


----------



## jdg (Aug 27, 2009)

Thing is...it only takes one tank of bad gas, or one good drive with something else wrong with the engine (bad misfire, continuous misfire, something mixed in with the gas, etc) to poison a cat and render it practically useless, or at least bad enough to where the computer calls it bad. So, you really can't blame it on Nissan 'cause, well, in the realm of your average passenger car or truck, pretty much everybody makes their cat's the same way these days.


----------



## tbk (Dec 29, 2008)

My pleasure, glad Stew could help you out.


----------



## windsmith (Jun 28, 2011)

Should have been replied to the post above from jdg

Actually, we SHOULD blame it on Nissan for not programming the system to protect the cat when there's a failure that will damage it. At least have some sort of warning and driver confirmation that "you're going to have an expensive repair if you keep driving. If you want to continue, turn the key on and off 6 times". After that, no whining. You have been warned.


----------



## x-trail extreme (Jul 24, 2006)

My xtrail is at 125K and the P0420 code came up. I've resettled the code a couple times and it keeps coming back. Have any owners here tried to clean either of the O2 sensors or the catalytic convertors?? There seems to be methods online (ie. lacquer thinner, dish soap etc) I’m willing to try, but I wanted to get your opinions.

I've searched for parts (convertors) on ebay and they seem reasonably priced compared to dealer price. Any one recommend them?


----------



## x-trail extreme (Jul 24, 2006)

Just wanted to provide an update.....

Took my xtrail to a nissan dealership today after having called Nissan Canada. Found out that catalytic converter is still covered under warranty (96 months or 130K which ever comes first)! My replacement will be coming in sometime next week.


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Glad to be reminded about the warranty. Not sure I would bother going through the fight with my dealer though. Little blown away by the prices being quoted here. 
I bought both spare 02 sensors ( oem NGKs) off Amazon at the start of the year for $98 delivered ( Price was not each it was for both). I have also considered buying the manifold catalytic combo unit offered for about $350 on ebay. However mine doesnt seem to be on its last legs just yet.


----------



## x-trail extreme (Jul 24, 2006)

quadraria10 said:


> Glad to be reminded about the warranty. Not sure I would bother going through the fight with my dealer though. Little blown away by the prices being quoted here.
> I bought both spare 02 sensors ( oem NGKs) off Amazon at the start of the year for $98 delivered ( Price was not each it was for both). I have also considered buying the manifold catalytic combo unit offered for about $350 on ebay. However mine doesnt seem to be on its last legs just yet.



I thought there would be a fight too, so that's why I called Nissan Canada first. To my surprise I didn't have any issues when I took it to my dealership. I didn't even mention calling Nissan Canada. Still waiting for part to come in though....


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

*Got a code!!*

OK, I used that Maxiscan code reader suggested by Quadraria and it came up with the code on this forum...I will post the readings I got after selecting DTC:

P0420
01/02

Then , when I scrolled again, it read:

P0420 P
02/02

As mentioned in another thread, the light came on after filling with fuel. After a few days, it went off, then came on again. Has been on ever since; I have filled it a few times. I am sure I close the cap correctly.
I did not clear the code. I will wait to see if someone here advises me to do that! It is due for an oil change very soon, so I suppose I can see what they recommend?? Sure as hell don't plan on replacing my cattylikkit conveyor, haha!! 
As usual, I gratefully await comments, suggestions, etc...


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Hi Molly,
Sorry to hear about your further problems. I am glad you got the code reader, but I am still more than a little blown away by what your Toyota dealer told you originally about not being able to read the codes. You now know how easy it is. Sadly some so called professionals like to play the suckers game and take advantage of people, and often times women... In your shoes I no longer go there
It would appear the same code has come up twice now. If you want to google it you can easily learn more, for example
P0420 Error Code: Catalyst System Efficiency Below Threshold (Bank 1)

Its possible that its gas related, but given your mileage your cats and 02 sensors are getting up there in wear. Now its up to you if you want to get it fixed, especially if you do not have to pass an emissions test. That said there is a change the ceramic is crumbling in the front cat and it could pose a serious risk to your engine.

It might be a case of better safe than sorry to have it and your sensors checked.
Then get an estimate so you can try to shop around.
Keep in mind that even if it does not show up on Rock Auto and other data bases the front exhaust manifold with catalytic converter is the same on 02-06 altimas and sentras that used the 2.5 qr25de engine. You can find aftermarket replacement units of varying quality on ebay, and you can even find Nissan oem used ones for totals of between 150 and 350 delivered. 
Silver lining is that you have not described any acceleration problems or really bad gas mileage, so there is a real change that given your 290,000+ kms , your 02 sensors have seen better days. Its where I would start. The best ones to use are NTK's which were the originals on your car.
Front or upstream is NTK 24298
Rear or downstream is NTK 24407

I have a 143,000 kms on ours and will probably change them next year. Saw a deal a while ago on them and bought them just in case. Got them off amazon for $98 us for both. Even Rock auto charges over 215 plus taxes and delivery for both...

Anyway good luck. Clear your code and see how long it takes to come back, and just check every now and then to make sure its not giving you other codes indicating a more urgent problem.


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

Thanks for all that info! Are you a mechanic or how do you know all this?? 
I emailed the Nissan dealer where all prior servicing was done to see if any work in that area had been done, as I can't decipher their work order history. Of course, maybe you can...but each dealer likely has their own system!

It is due for an oil change so I will have those things that you mentioned checked out. Gas mileage is good. I have not noticed any acceleration problems, very peppy in fact, but I do notice something else. Remember when I asked if it had the CVT? The reason I thought it did was I can feel very subtle shifting-like changes while driving. Not constantly, of course, and hubby never seems to notice. What do you think??


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

Oh, I forgot to ask...would any issue with the manifold impact the sensors? Remember I mentioned that it had been replaced awhile back with a used one, that the Nissan dealer said "had issues"? EDIT: I just read this on the link you posted...oh oh!! That is kinda what it feels like, but very slight and very short...

For example, if the substance inside the catalytic converter is broken or failed, it may be restricting the exhaust which will result in a feeling of reduced power output from the vehicle.

Read more at: http://www.obd-codes.com/p0420
Copyright © OBD-Codes.com


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Hi Molly
No I am not a mechanic. I consider myself an interested amateur with good research and critical skills, who likes to understand things. Having owned the X trail for over 5 years, I have gotten to know them in part thanks to this and other forums. I hated the feeling that the dealer was rubbing his hands with glee every time I had problem, and I decided to be a much more informed consumer to even the playing field a bit. Furthermore, overtime I realized I actually enjoy repairing things, so if I can I like to give it a go. If I cannot, because of time tools or skill, I no longer panic that I will be taken advantage of, and I know how to get things done much more cheaply. I answer questions here these days, as my way of giving thanks to those who posted before. It also seems if I do not, many a question would go unanswered these days on this forum....

Re your transmission question, I cannot really help as I dont really have an idea what you mean or when it happens-- ie. in 2wd, auto, or 4wd, when accelerating, decelerating, going up hills... All I have ever done in that regard is change transmission fluid with a couple of drain and fills. 

Re your front exhaust manifold w catalytic converter how can we know what is meant by 
issues? It implies a lot but tells us nothing. When it was installed did they reuse the old upsteam O2 sensor? If they changed it, did they bother changing the downstream back one? Any modern mechanic should be able to verify they are functioning properly. If you read the OBD code page I linked to you will see the code signals a malfunction that could have different underlying causes. 
Bonne chance,
Mike


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

Thanks! I just cleared the code, and will post what I find out after I get a servicing done, hopefully by next week or so.


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Well at least you are now a master at checking and clearing engine codes! Bet you wouldn't have thought that a month ago lol.


----------



## chadn (Jan 28, 2010)

Hey Molly,

Has your x-trail had the fuel filler neck recall done? Mine was throwing the P0420 code about a year ago (August 2013). I replaced the O2 sensors but that didn't fix it. It was still throwing the code occasionally throughout the winter. 

I had the fuel filler neck recall done in July 2014. It hasn't thrown the code yet since July. 

There is a way that you can verify if your O2 sensors are working. You should be able to view the #1 and #2 O2 sensor voltage at the same with your ODB2 reader. The voltage for O2 sensor #1 should fluctuate up and down a lot. The voltage for O2 sensor #2 should fluctuate very little. If sensors #1 and #2 fluctuate at the same rate it can indicate the catalyst in the converter is no good. A totally flat-lined O2 sensor voltage can indicate a failed sensor or problem with wiring. 

Unfortunately, the P0420 is not a simple code to diagnose. 

Good luck.


----------



## janarth (Oct 14, 2004)

Good information, I have the code now! And I haven't done the recall for the fuel filler yet. let me make appointment. 
thanks


----------



## janarth (Oct 14, 2004)

Hi, 
How filler neck replacement is tied to P0420 code? Did you had any other codes read with p0420? A technical explanation would be appreciated
Thanks




chadn said:


> Hey Molly,
> 
> Has your x-trail had the fuel filler neck recall done? Mine was throwing the P0420 code about a year ago (August 2013). I replaced the O2 sensors but that didn't fix it. It was still throwing the code occasionally throughout the winter.
> 
> ...


----------



## chadn (Jan 28, 2010)

The only thing I can think of is that the corrosion in the fuel filler neck made the x-trail think the gas cap was missing. I know that not having the gas cap correctly installed can cause the check engine light to come on. The P0420 code is "cat below efficiency." But the code can be caused by any number of things not related to the cat itself.


----------



## janarth (Oct 14, 2004)

chadn said:


> The only thing I can think of is that the corrosion in the fuel filler neck made the x-trail think the gas cap was missing. I know that not having the gas cap correctly installed can cause the check engine light to come on. The P0420 code is "cat below efficiency." But the code can be caused by any number of things not related to the cat itself.


Thanks for much appreciated information.


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

Thanks, chadn. Yes, the fuel neck filler was replaced a few months ago as a warranty issue. Toyota referred me to the local muffler shop, Fountain Tire, as they are apparently better able to diagnose emissions related issues on a non-Toyota vehicle. So, I will address that after Christmas and let you all know what happens!


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

Well, I took my X-Trail in to Okotoks Nissan for their $39.95 oil change deal, and also to see what they came up with regarding codes. Also a good chance to see if I like them or not! One visit is enough for me! Took 1 1/2 hours. Not the friendliest gal either. When she started it up to get the mileage, she said "Oh! I don't like that grinding sound!" WTH?? I wanted them to pop in a couple new marker light bulbs as I had trouble prying off the lenses, and luckily saw that they were estimating up to $75.00 to do that! Hahaha! I said don't bother.

When they were finished, she gave me the bill and naturally I was charged a half hour for the diagnosis, which was the same code I had on my gizmo. She said it was the catalytic converter and it had to be replaced to the tune of over $2000... Thanks, I said, and left.

Later, I read over the bill again, and saw that she had neglected to point out that they had found a leak on the steering rack and it needed replacing to the tune of $1600. Hahaha! Wow! I called her and asked why she didn't mention it and she said she didn't even notice it! I have been spoiled at Toyota as they always go over the entire bill with me before I pay...I also asked if they actually looked at the converter or did any tests but she said no, that code is what it is, and my engine will get ruined if it is not fixed. I really dislike this kind of fear-mongering, but I am sure they get some business this way from folks that believe everything they are told.

Afterwards, I called both the original dealer where it had always been serviced (Brasso) and the gal was very understanding and assured me they would not automatically presume it was the worst possible outcome before doing other checking first. She suggested getting the next maintenance service done there and they could give it a look then. I also called High River Minute Muffler and this guy spent 10 minutes explaining how all these things worked, and then said they would advise doing a test where they check to see if the O2 sensors are functioning properly, as one of them could be setting off this same code, and would be cheaper to replace. Also, he said if they replaced the cc, it would be around $500. as they just replace that and said Nissan would replace the entire thing, the exhaust and sensors, etc...

Sorry to be so long-winded, but figgered an update was in order! I plan to wait till my next full maintenance service and see what turns up. I would prefer to go to Toyota for that, but maybe I should try Brasso, as they know the vehicle already?? 

We have not noticed any leaks under the vehicle but I guess we will find the PS fluid stick and check it to see...


----------



## chadn (Jan 28, 2010)

Hey Molly. I've had pretty good experiences at Brasso. 

Can you access live streaming data from your ODBII dongle? If so, you should be able to look at the voltages coming off of the 2 oxygen sensors the x-trail has. O2 sensor 1 should fluctuate quite rapidly while O2 sensor 2 should fluctuate but not nearly as much as O2 sensor 1. If one sensor is flat lined it has probably failed. 

There are other things to check but I'd start with that.


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

Thanks, chadn, but mine only gives a code. So, you are saying that the O2 sensors can be diagnosed with a better code reader? That muffler shop said they put it through a test that takes about 2 hours and uses propane, etc...and costs $200. I guess Brasso could just check this when I bring it in for my maintenance service.
What would be the symptoms of sensor failure, if any? Quadraria had mentioned that if my mileage was poor, that could be a sign of converter issues, but my mileage is good.


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Hi Molly,
Sorry to hear about more troubles. Chadn is referring to units that arent strictly code readers. When I originaly posted about alternatives for you I included a couple of bluetooth cheapo units off ebay that would have such capability but require you to use a laptop with scan tool software. Are there no good simple garages around you with a decent mechanic? All you want done is to have your 02 sensors checked to see if they are operating normally as they may be the source of your check engine code.
Sounds like that first Nissan dealer likes to go fishing for suckers. What a great non diagnosis--just replace everything...
Re the steering rack leak-- has anyone pinpointed where exactly its leaking? Again you may not have to replace the entire thing. Get some Nissan automatic transmission fluid or equivalent and keep its reservoir topped up. Its on the passenger side towards back of the engine. I love how the dealer ignored the primary safety issue.
Lastly re the rough starting sound, did they tell you what that was?
Ignore your side marker lights till spring. They are a little tricky but they do pry out as per the service manual. Only requires a flat blade screwdriver covered with a bit of tape. Its a 2 to 3 minute job once you have the hang of it.


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

Hey quad!!
There are a couple plain old garages around; that may be the thing to do, rather than wait for another 5500 km till my next oil change!
The service "advisor" said the mechanic told her the rack itself was leaking, but not really bad yet, and the only solution was a full replacement. I looked it up and see there are two different hoses and some seals, but supposedly that isn't it. I got the manual in so we will check the levels, and get some fluid if we need to top it up. Have not seen anything on the snow yet. The muffler guy explained that even if it is the rack itself, after replacing, a flush should be performed as the fluid left could have filings in or something...
I have not noticed any issues at all with steering...As I mentioned before, Brasso did a maintenance service on it last September, just over a month before we bought it, and they would have made a note of any issues at that time, according to their much friendlier service gal...


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Check this out for the flush. I did it to mine a couple of years ago. Will do it again this summer
UK Nissan X-Trail Owners Forum ? View topic - Power Steering Fluid Changed (with pics)

and my source for this link
AUSTRALIAN X-TRAIL FORUM :: Fuel & Oil :: Power Steering Flush | Runboard

All you need is your turkey baster. Available for one dollar at most dollar stores. May as well get a clean one after all.
Here is what I used for it and transmission
Castrol Import Multi-Vehicle Automatic Transmission Fluid, 1 qt - Walmart.com


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

If its only a seal problem you might want to try some Lucas power steering stop leak after you have done your flush. However if the issue is more serious it wont work and you will be back to having to replace the whole thing anyway. I have never used the stuff but in your shoes I would be tempted to try it out. Maybe someone else can chime in on what to do.
But I would think the fact you are not noticing steering problems or groaning sounds from it, is a pretty good sign that your problem is not that advanced.


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

quadraria10 said:


> Lastly re the rough starting sound, did they tell you what that was?
> Ignore your side marker lights till spring. They are a little tricky but they do pry out as per the service manual. Only requires a flat blade screwdriver covered with a bit of tape. Its a 2 to 3 minute job once you have the hang of it.


When she mentioned the "grinding sound", I said "what grinding sound?", and she said "you didn't hear that?" and I said "no!"...She never mentioned it when I paid up, however, and made no note of her "concern" on the work order. No one else has commented on it...sounds fine to me, but I will ask the next mechanic I see, just in case, haha...
Ya, we can wait on those lights. I also have a bulb for the map light at the front, and was having trouble taking out the old bulb. I'll let hubby try as he is more patient...


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

*Update!*

Well, finally, the issue of the P0420 code was solved, after my Toyota guy advised me to go to Minute Muffler as they specialize in exhaust issues and cost a lot less than they do. So, it was diagnosed as a failed 02 sensor, upstream of the CC, and they showed me the broken sensor. OK. Got that fixed. Including the diagnosis, it was almost $900., because apparently the X-Trail CC is built into the manifold and harder to access, etc. Ouch, you betcha. 
Then, the next day, the light comes on again. They said it could just be a hiccup which often happens, and so I clear it, and after it does this a couple more times, I took it back today so they could look at it again, as it is warrantied. They pressure tested everything again and found the CC is fine, which is good news, and the downstream 02 sensor needs replacing as apparently these "get lazy" when the upstream ones go, and then do not give proper readings on the fuel mixture, yadayada. I get an estimate for $191.00, incl. 1/2 hour labour. So, I think I should get this done, but maybe I should buy an 02 sensor myself and just get them, or someone, to install it...
The one they quoted is $110.00. It is made by Blue Streak. I see Quad mentioned NKG, which I can get for quite a bit less, and Minute Muffler just called me and said they just started a promotion for $25.00 off a repair job. And Toyota said they would install one I bought elsewhere. How many sensors are there? One on each end, or two?
Thanks in advance!!


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Hi Molly,
I am not sure what to say. Sounds like they are fishing to me, and the prices are nuts. For 900 I would have thought you could replace the whole front manifold with cat and the 2 o2 sensors. Parts would be approx. 500 or less for aftermarket and then probably about 4 hours labour. Pretty sure it could be done for less and with less time. How could they charge 900 using an aftermarket part??? 
The NGK are the oe part and are an identical replacement to the originals. And as you know there are two sensors--one upstream and a second downstream one. You can get both at Rock Auto or Amazon for approx. 100 including delivery.
I have no clue what they meant by access because to get at the top one you do not even require a lift. You can access it with the hood up, a breaker bar and an 02 socket. Apparently can be hard to remove without breaking the bung that the sensor screws into. The only reason I could think of that your repair could have been so expensive was if Minute Muffler busted it and then had to fully remove the front manifold in order to weld a repair to the broken bit.
For what its worth from what I have read the downstream one is possibly harder to extract because of its position on the bottom of the vehicle which makes it more susceptible to rusting in place. Did a code for the back sensor ever pop up? Because if it was the exact same code I would think you could have a problem with the new blue streak sensor. I had never heard of them by the way, and have no clue why they would be more expensive than a premium brand such as NGK or Bosch.
I considered changing mine last fall as preventative maintenance but it got too cold and I didn't want to risk breaking anything needlessly. I was at 140,000 km with no engine fault codes. A mechanic suggested why mess with it until there is a problem. So, I have the two sensors in my workshop awaiting the day somewhere in the next 50,000+ kms they will be in need of replacing. I suspect I may replace the front manifold w cat at the same time when that day comes. Good luck.


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Last question for fun-- how much is Minute Mufflers labour rate? 191.00 for a half hour including a part that you can get for about $35? How did they justify over 800 in labour to replace your front sensor?
Watch this to understand. Identical engine to ours. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouN66I6MMPo

and here is another showing the complete replacement I would have though you could have had done for less than 900
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5R0fsWjS9Q


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

Well, I got my bills mixed up as hubby had his truck in there for an inspection and new front brakes and rotors, and that was a $900. hit...oops!! My big bill included a new serpentine belt which they had to take out anyway, apparently, so there was no labour. That was $91. The charge to diagnose the exact cause of the code was a flat fee of $155., supposedly they do a pressure test, and some test involving propane. As the manifold in there is a used one, apparently it is a bit warped so they replaced the gasket and that set cost $27. The sensor cost $140. which is more than the one they quoted yesterday (110.00). And the labour cost $249., which is 2 hours. And a new air filter for $30. So that came to $758. Which is still quite a bit! 
We had an appointment yesterday for them to confirm why the code kept coming back and we were kept waiting quite a while, which was annoying. I think I will just pick up the sensor at Napa ($58.) and have Toyota put it in, which they said they would do and thought a half hour sounded right. Or do you think I should just leave it alone for awhile? The Minute guy said, of course, that if it is not replaced, the fuel mixture will be wrong, etc., and then the CC will go next...
We have a friend who had the CC removed from his Dodge truck; it cost quite a bit and I can't recall the details, but now his truck gets way better mileage. Why do these newer vehicles have these annoying expensive things in there...ya right, save the planet! Can the CC and 02 sensors be taken out of a Nissan, and just have a regular exhaust in there? Not that I would do that now...


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

When I was in there getting it diagnosed, they took me back there and showed me the damaged sensor...that little cage thingy on the end had broken off, and supposedly bits of it were knocking around in there, but did not damage the actual CC. But yesterday my hubby asked me why did they not just offer to change both sensors the first time...would not the downstream sensor have acted the same as it did yesterday? I guess they just wanted me to come back!


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Last thought, reading this and other forums, it is not unheard of for aftermarket 02 sensors that were not oem to cause problems. At least with the NTK's you could rule out that possibility. If the blue streaks are not communicating well with the ecu, its doubtful that installing another will fix anything. I am not saying its a bad idea to replace the second, but I think you should consider insisting they replace the blue streak they installed with a proper NTK, and seeing if that resolves the issue. I would also speak to the manager or someone at head office of Minute Muffler, and provide them with the Nissan o2 sensor change video. You need better justification for why they charged you almost $800 in labour to change the upstream sensor...


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Did it break off prior to them removing it? and did they remove the broken tip cage? Obviously if they diagnosed it while you waited it didn't take them hours to remove the broken sensor. Once out, putting the new one in is a 10 minute job. Did you have a brake job done or a muffler change at the same time. I do not understand your bill. All I can imagine is they decided to spend 7 hours fishing inside your cat with a magnet to get the piece out.


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

So, after watching those videos (thanks for that!)...it appears that the belt was just slipped off but not actually removed....correct? So they made money by selling me a belt that was not really that bad, and claiming it had to come off anyway?
They are not willing to install a customer supplied part, so I doubt they will replace the Blue Streak sensor with an NKG and not charge me. 
I am totally annoyed at the moment!!! :|


----------



## molly (Oct 31, 2014)

quadraria10 said:


> Did it break off prior to them removing it? and did they remove the broken tip cage? Obviously if they diagnosed it while you waited it didn't take them hours to remove the broken sensor. Once out, putting the new one in is a 10 minute job. Did you have a brake job done or a muffler change at the same time. I do not understand your bill. All I can imagine is they decided to spend 7 hours fishing inside your cat with a magnet to get the piece out.


No, the brake job was done on our truck that same week, so I got the amounts mixed up. The labour on my car was 2 hours. They said the tip was broken off, and they did get some small pieces out of there but I did not see those pieces.


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

Ok hadn't fully read your newer post. Now makes more sense, though still pricey. So they did remove the manifold w cat 
to do it. Wonder if they needed to. Was the gasket defective? Anyway, I still think you should insist that the problem could be with the sensor they chose for you and try to replace it with an NTK. Sounds like you and your hubby can now be qualified as good customers for the shop considering the 2 big jobs you just had done. They should be willing to make you happy.


----------



## quadraria10 (Jul 6, 2010)

If they didn't get all the pieces, its potentially a recipe for disaster. Maybe someone else can chime in, but one of the problems affecting our engines is the possibility of broken cat material getting sucked back into the engine and destroying it. Leaving loose pieces to bounce around in there does not sound like a great plan.
Last thing was the original code caused by a leaking manifold gasket letting extra air into the system, hence the bad readings from the upstream o2 sensor? Guess maybe it was sensor seeing it was physically defective. Anyway I hope you get it all sorted without much more expense. I really think you need to find a good private mechanic. Forget the dealerships and large budget muffler franchises.


----------

