# KA24E Timing Chain Error



## rbo1577186 (Jan 16, 2005)

We tackled this yesterday. I got the help of a more expirienced person to help out (he owed me a couple anyway). Anyway we get to a point to crank the motor. Air intake still out, radiator/Power Steering/all belts still out. We turned the engine over by hand several times to make sure everything sounded good. 
So we put the plugs/wires back in and turned the key. There was a slight buzzing sound that lasted for app. 2 seconds coming from the passenger side firewall area. Coming from something that has to do with the emissions system?? After this buzzing sound the engine would turn over for a second or so and stop..... We repeated this a couple of times. We look over our literature some more. 
We drop the oil pump back down and I didn't had the two knoches lined up. After this she would turn over a while, but never fire up. There was some confusion as to pull the distributor or not. We didn't pull it/mark anything because the FSM didn't say anything about it. 

Anybody got any ideas where we may have went wrong?


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## Humanure (Feb 15, 2007)

rbo1577186 said:


> We drop the oil pump back down and I didn't had the two knoches lined up.


I am guessing this is where your problem started. I changed my timing chain for first time a few years ago. From what I remember, the oil pumps shaft end fits into the shaft end of the distributor. The crank rotates the oil pump and in turn, the oil pump shaft, connected through those notches, rotates the distributor. I have a feeling the timing is off since the motor was "turned over" a few times while the oil pump shaft was not rotating the distributor.


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## rbo1577186 (Jan 16, 2005)

Well we wound up tearing everything back down to double check ourselves. Glad we did,

1. Tension side guide didn't have any play. We used the original factory bolt and then it would move from left to right a little.

2. Lined up the silver links on the chain to the timing marks on the sprockets. Buddy said he didn't know why this would matter, but did it anyway. 

3. Pulled the oil pan to make sure we had a good seal. Yesterday we loosened all bolts, removed the front bolts to let the front hang a little. Had a slight leak when we bolted it back up.

4. Lined up oil pump shaft as shown in FSM diagram, #1 piston at TDC(TDC was done at the beginning), got rotor set to fire on #1). He said he didn't change anything as far as the way the sprockets were lined up. 

Turned the key.... The first two times it turned over for a second and stopped (Like yesterday). Then on the third try it fired up!! *Sounded AWFUL...* It ran without sputtering or anything, just really loud (Like the rattle sound on a dry start). Killed the key, turned it over by hand again to listen for anything out of whack. *STILL SOUNDED GOOD BY HAND. WHEN #1 IS AT TDC ALL VALVES ARE CLOSED.* Turned the key again thinking the oil pump hadn't built up pressure. Let it run for 5 seconds, and killed the key. He said he had no idea what was wrong. We're taking a break.

I'm going to pull the oil pump to see if it's full. If something was hitting we should be able to hear it by turning the motor over by hand, correct (with the valve cover off and spark plugs out)?


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## rbo1577186 (Jan 16, 2005)

One more thing he mentioned was the timing marks. He said he didn't like the was it was done on the Nissan. Anybody got anything to add/tricks? KA24E 97 HB


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## rbo1577186 (Jan 16, 2005)

Another thing I noticed... The crank pulley marks are supposed to line up with the pin on the block at 0 degrees (the second mark on the pulley). I line up with 15 degrees (next to last mark on the pulley)

I didn't think this would be a huge deal. Could this mean I'm one or 2 teeth off on the sprocket?


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## Humanure (Feb 15, 2007)

Just to let you know, when I got mine all put back together and got it started, it sounded like ass. It was very noisy just like your situation. I thought for sure I ruined it but I said "F it" and let it run. After a while it began to quiet-down and finally sounded normal. I hope someone else chimes in to help you.


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## rbo1577186 (Jan 16, 2005)

Humanure, 

How long is a while? Thanks for posting, it makes me feel a little better.

I'm gonna double check the oil pump before I do that, but I might try letting it run.


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

If there's any air in the oil port to the tensioner, it will take a few minutes usually to purge the air out. Until that happens, there will be some chain rattle until the tensioner is fed with enough oil pressure to put the proper tension against the "slinger" chain guide. Also, in cases where the engine has been apart awhile, you sometimes encounter noisy hydraulic lifters if they've bled down, but these,too, will usually "pump up" after several minutes.


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## Humanure (Feb 15, 2007)

Sorry to be vague. Just like smj mentioned, it takes a few minutes.


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## rbo1577186 (Jan 16, 2005)

OK compression test came out good. 190 ish on all 4 cyls. I'm not worried any more, whew..... I'm gonna turn it over with the starter for a few and let it cool, then repeat. Thanks to all who posted.


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## rbo1577186 (Jan 16, 2005)

Well I just about give up........

I put everything completely back together, coolant air intake and all. Fires right up but is still loud as hell. I let it run for about 10 minutes at idle it seemed like it got a little quieter, but not much.

I'm guessing oil pressure is good, no red oil light. I can take the fill cap off and my hand gets lightly splattered with oil while holding my hand over the fill hole.

It did miss every once in a while, I'm guessing because I haven't got the ignition timing set??

With my timing light at 0 degrees... I'm on 10 degrees according the the marks on the crankshaft pulley. I twisted the distributor trying to get it better, but that's the best I could get with the distributor turned counterclockwise as far as it would go.

I'm going to drop the oil pump and realign it with the distributor as a last ditch effort. It looked good according to the picture in the service manual, but I'm ready to do anything but break it back down and if I can't find anything wrong, pull the head.

I did find a little piece of metal on top of my oil draining pan. It's round, about .400 in diameter and it has a little ding on one side of it. I'll try to put up a pic later. This scares me....


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## rbo1577186 (Jan 16, 2005)

OK She's good to go. Everyone was right about the lifters. It took a *LONG* time for them to bleed. 

We turned it over by hand several times before we crunk it the first time.

Again by hand after we broke it down again.

Turned it over with the starter for app. 45 seconds the turned it over by hand with the spark plugs out for 3-4 minutes.

Let it run for 10 minutes Wednesday.

Let it run for 20 minutes today and it did get a quieter. (20 minutes per FSM)

Let it cool down for a few minutes, ran it again for 2-3 minutes and now back to normal. *WHEW*. Sounds great.

It just took a while. Sorry about the ranting (frustrated slightly panicking), I knew you said a while, but damn.

The metal I found appears to be an oil galley plug, I'm guessing it's been in the oil pan since it was built in the factory.


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## Humanure (Feb 15, 2007)

Sweet! Congrats!


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## mootsman (Oct 21, 2006)

How can it take 45 minutes for the oil to fully circulate through the engine. Doesn't that do a lot of damage?


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## rbo1577186 (Jan 16, 2005)

I had oil pressure. Just some air in the hydraulic lifters. The rattling sound is slop from the air in the lifter. With the air in the lifter it has a bit of slop to it. After air is purged out no more slop, therefore no more rattling. I imagine I wouldn't run it under a load like that though. 

Trust me, it the red oil light would have been on, I would have shut the engine down.
I even pulled the valve cover and turned the key. The puddle the cam sits in never got dry and there was a rooster tail of oil flying off the timing chain around 18 inches high. I had oil circulating!! I may invest in an oil pressure test kit one of these days......

The only thing I noticed I may have done wrong is that the FSM said to let engine run at 1000 RPMS for up to 20 minutes to purge the air out. I let it idle, roughly 850 rpms. I did rev it up to app 1500 rpms a few times right before it really started to get quiet. Maybe this built up enough oil pressure to finish pushing the air out. Maybe coinsedence, I don't know. You could actually hear the lifters begin to bleed down. From a lot of lifters, to a few, then you could hear the last 2, then one, then good to go.

I crank the engine tonight after sitting for over 24 hours, the rattle at cold start up is gone. My truck is running fine, I'm happy.


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