# 75 shot on GA16DE can be done



## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

Ive been running a 75shot for over 3 months now ive gone through 4 bottles. Running 1 step colder plugs and Timing is set 3* under stock. No detonation or ill effects to engine. No loss of compression. THe only thing that has broken has been the drivers side C.V. joint and thats due to a bad transmission mount. new axel and polyurethane mount on the way.

Going to Dyno soon just to see how much power i should be putting down. Cams and UR pulley should be next and im curious to see the gains with the nitrous and cams.


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## chimmike (Oct 17, 2002)

I could've told you it can be done 

Sounds like you did it right, good job. Looking forward to the numbers!


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## Nuskool (Jan 5, 2004)

Sounds cool...I was running a 65 shot with all of my bolt ons, curious to see how much it will make on the dyno...Good luck


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## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

CAI, Header, Exhaust, 2 inch all the way back and now i got solid motor mounts.... and the nitrous kit.........


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## NOS_PSR_NOS (Nov 9, 2004)

Bryan200sx said:


> Ive been running a 75shot for over 3 months now ive gone through 4 bottles. Running 1 step colder plugs and Timing is set 3* under stock. No detonation or ill effects to engine. No loss of compression. THe only thing that has broken has been the drivers side C.V. joint and thats due to a bad transmission mount. new axel and polyurethane mount on the way.
> 
> Going to Dyno soon just to see how much power i should be putting down. Cams and UR pulley should be next and im curious to see the gains with the nitrous and cams.


wet or dry??


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## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

NOS_PSR_NOS said:


> wet or dry??


Wet kit i would never try this on any sort of dry kit. Thats asking for a new engine.


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## Nuskool (Jan 5, 2004)

I ran 65 shot on a dry for 5 months ran great...All I did was change e plugs... I had fidanza flywheel, ACT clutch. Stromung 2 inch exhaust, Hotshot header, Injen CAI, Zex dry kit, Short shifter, and the timing was set back..

Would have loved to dyno it...To bad its time for a turbo..


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## Skoodles (Jul 31, 2004)

did you ever get a dyno done with your 75 shot?


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

Skoodles said:


> did you ever get a dyno done with your 75 shot?


good Question


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## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

waiting on the next Dyno Day by my house i havent had time to even think but i will post the chart when i do i get 3 pulls for $40 im going to do 2 pulls with the 75 shot and one with a 100 shot an pull back on timing for the 100 shot. 

Will keep you posted


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## Davepf (Feb 22, 2005)

Can you tell me at what Rpm are you spraying your nitrous?

Thx

Dave


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## tony200 (Mar 23, 2005)

i think the best set-up for nitrious is the full throttle where it automatically sprays w/o the push of the button.


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

Bryan200sx said:


> waiting on the next Dyno Day by my house i havent had time to even think but i will post the chart when i do i get 3 pulls for $40 im going to do 2 pulls with the 75 shot and one with a 100 shot an pull back on timing for the 100 shot.
> 
> Will keep you posted


100 shot... I think that's pushing your luck..


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## tony200 (Mar 23, 2005)

100 shit is too much. dont push your luck. i think the highest you could go is prolly a 85 shot. please correct me if im wrong though.


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## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

100 shot has been done before. If i do it correctly there should be no problem with a 100 shot. There is guy that dose not post on the forums that has this done in his GA and he has not had any problems. The only thing different in his set up then mine is an RPM window switch. We will see regardless when i started my nitrous project i also picked up an engine from a buddy of mine so worse case scenario i just pull my blown engine.


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## tony200 (Mar 23, 2005)

what a relief. at least you have a spare engine


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## DanTheMan (Jan 12, 2003)

*100 wet shot?*

I wanna go with a zex wet kit (for price reasons) and it doesn't use a manual activation switch (which can move around or fall off etc..) it uses an electrical signal directly from the tps.
Can I run a 75 shot on the zex WET kit (yes they have wet and dry) with stock fuel pump, hotshot cai, hotshot header and timing retarded to 5BTDC?
I'm currently set up for all motor with timing at 12btdc on my ga16de. I also have a slightly bored out TB honed into a funnel-ram shape, a koyo radiator, an additional cooling fan, ES motor mount, 2 1/4" exhaust with SE-R cat for more flow, "turbo" muffler (straight through, no core). Iridium plugs, 91-92 octane pump gas and a venom 400 for WOT program (more stoich at WOT) confirmed with a/f meter. This is a manual trans. Konig 17's with nitto zr17's and pacesetter short-shifter. UR Crank pulley. JWT flywheel. Oh yeah, and a hyper-ground kit, gold batt terminals with a 0.5 and a 1.0 farad capacitor in-line for the stero stuff...

I know to NOS the venom has to be turned off, the sparks have to be changed and the timing retarded back to 5 below stock (stock is 8btdc so like 3 degrees btdc? is that right? I have to run 91 with nos (even with retarded timing right?).
Do I have to have an aftermarket ignition? (which one is best for ga?)
Will I have to upgrade fuel pump if it's a wet system? for a 75shot?

P.S> Thank you for the help in advance....

Nos is like sex, dry is very very bad


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

DanTheMan said:


> I wanna go with a zex wet kit (for price reasons) and it doesn't use a manual activation switch (which can move around or fall off etc..) it uses an electrical signal directly from the tps.
> Can I run a 75 shot on the zex WET kit (yes they have wet and dry) with stock fuel pump, hotshot cai, hotshot header and timing retarded to 5BTDC?
> I'm currently set up for all motor with timing at 12btdc on my ga16de. I also have a slightly bored out TB honed into a funnel-ram shape, a koyo radiator, an additional cooling fan, ES motor mount, 2 1/4" exhaust with SE-R cat for more flow, "turbo" muffler (straight through, no core). Iridium plugs, 91-92 octane pump gas and a venom 400 for WOT program (more stoich at WOT) confirmed with a/f meter. This is a manual trans. Konig 17's with nitto zr17's and pacesetter short-shifter. UR Crank pulley. JWT flywheel. Oh yeah, and a hyper-ground kit, gold batt terminals with a 0.5 and a 1.0 farad capacitor in-line for the stero stuff...
> 
> ...



You should just get the JWT ecu to control the nitrous.. :thumbup: 

The stock fuel pump gives up the ghost when you get to about 200 WHP, with your setup I think it would be sufficient. Ignition is not needed, the stock one should be fine, it fires through boost on my car just dandy. 

Not sure what that entire mod. list has to do with the nitrous (the audio and wheel bits anyway) and what do you mean by more stoich at WOT? And is that a narrow band AF meter?


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## DanTheMan (Jan 12, 2003)

Well, because jwt won't touch obdII ecu's and It has to be tunable on the fly not by mail order. (please stop trying to sell me on a jwt ecu) I am not rewiring an ecu for the prior model year and maybe failing emissions, PERIOD!
If all you want is a weekend racecar great! Do whatever you want to your computer. I want a legal, drivable car that I can register and pass emissions with. (OBDI will not pass an OBDII scan diagnostic, duh) Anyway, a progressive controller and an ignition plus the nos kit together are probabally still cheaper than a new ecu!

I was thinking ignition because you have to have aftermarket ignition to setup an RPM window switch and nos cut before fuel cut. (without jwt ecu management). Plus the ignition might be good for a few ponies off the juice.
Where is the JWT rpm window set for? How low an rpm can I squeeze at?
And can you break that down by gear?

More stoich at WOT means when the ecu goes into wot mode the venom400 keeps the fuel trim closer to stoich by lying to the ecu. The stock fuel map is very rich at WOT and just wastes gas and lacks power. The more perfect combustion adds power and saves gas. I know, you personally don't like piggyback ecu's, that's your preference. The a/f guage is hooked directly to the headers O2 sensor and no it's not a UEGO wideband, it's the standard a/f sensor the car sees it's just got a guage for me to see now, and at wot I see one light over stoich (just a drop rich for safety) with the stock program I see like 4-5 lights over stoich at WOT (waste of gas, lost power). I also feel more power. I mention it because the leaner mix may be a bad idea while squeezing (plus it will advance the timing) so I thought hey, maybe I should switch it off while running Nitrous, thats all.

The alternative to the zex wet I was thinking of is a direct port setup on the lower half of the intake plenum, but unless I can make it safe with the ignition window switch and nos cut I won't do either. Just can't afford to pull a block right now or fry rings etc....
Who here has been running nos without any problems on a ga16de?

Oh yeah, WES, if you're not addressing the question(s) please don't address the post. And yes I have a JWT product, the flywheel I mentioned in the prior post (please read the whole post).


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## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

DanTheMan said:


> Well, because jwt won't touch obdII ecu's and It has to be tunable on the fly not by mail order. (please stop trying to sell me on a jwt ecu) I am not rewiring an ecu for the prior model year and maybe failing emissions, PERIOD!
> If all you want is a weekend racecar great! Do whatever you want to your computer. I want a legal, drivable car that I can register and pass emissions with. (OBDI will not pass an OBDII scan diagnostic, duh) Anyway, a progressive controller and an ignition plus the nos kit together are probabally still cheaper than a new ecu!
> 
> I was thinking ignition because you have to have aftermarket ignition to setup an RPM window switch and nos cut before fuel cut. (without jwt ecu management). Plus the ignition might be good for a few ponies off the juice.
> ...


If you want to do it right you can get a SAFC and a wideband if you want to stay away from JWT. With out a wideband o2 sensor you really don't know where your A/F really is. I Have seen those A/F sensors be off by alot. What you need to do is set your timing -5. Gap your plugs correctly and get 1 step colder plugs. Get rid of those iridiums and get some NGK coppers. Your going to have to change your plugs every so often any way. 

I have never heard really good things ZEX. I would personally go with NX their solenoids are rebiuldable. With the little ZEX box you have 2 tiny solenoids in there. The NX ones are Huge compared to that box.

You can spray right after 3000 rpm. Set up the WOT at the pedal but only to activate when you floor it. That way you can still launch the car and only spray when you mash the pedal. That way you can always be sure your over 3K. 

Toss the Venom computer and get an MSD digital 6. You can adjust your timing to automaticaly retard for nitrous. You can set it up to run advanced timing when your N/A and retard when you spray.


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

DanTheMan said:


> Well, because jwt won't touch obdII ecu's and It has to be tunable on the fly not by mail order. (please stop trying to sell me on a jwt ecu) I am not rewiring an ecu for the prior model year and maybe failing emissions, PERIOD!
> If all you want is a weekend racecar great! Do whatever you want to your computer. I want a legal, drivable car that I can register and pass emissions with. (OBDI will not pass an OBDII scan diagnostic, duh) Anyway, a progressive controller and an ignition plus the nos kit together are probabally still cheaper than a new ecu!
> 
> I was thinking ignition because you have to have aftermarket ignition to setup an RPM window switch and nos cut before fuel cut. (without jwt ecu management). Plus the ignition might be good for a few ponies off the juice.
> ...



Do you honestly think I was serious when I mentioned the ECU? I mean after your PM would I be that silly? :thumbup: 

You wouldn't fail emissions, and I doubt the entire setup would be cheaper. But hey apparently you have it worked out. FWIW my car passes smog making the power it does through a factory cat, is still regtistered and daily drivable. I am not trying to sell you the ECU, just trying to dispel the myth your putting out there about a product that you have no personal experience with.... (or so it seems). 

As far as posting I DID in fact post info. relavant to the thread. About the fuel pump and ingition. The ignition will yield little to no power over the stock setup when OFF the juice. But it will be useful for other things and fo rthat it may be worth while. Granted the JWT ecu can control the nitrous however you want, two separate maps for spray and NA, controlled activiation, but obviously you want to be able to tune like Paul Walker so it's not for you...I would upgrade the fuel pump for piece of mind, although I doubt it will make 200 WHP with a 75 shot so that is questionable. 

And I asked about JWT products in the PM not in this thread, obviously I read this AFTER you sent me the PM that you never responded too anyway, you were supposed to provide me a link to the thread you mentioned...

Honestly man if your going to be such a shit talker pull your head out of your @SS AND CORRELATE BETWEEN DIFFERENT POSTS. Don't just lump crap all together so that you feel like you have something to post for everyone to see.


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## 1punchKO (May 26, 2005)

<- I did 100 shot for a a long @#$ time until it shattered a piston (from the 1st ring land through the skirt!!!)... it would have lasted longer but I was on the button like all day every day.. also I was running a stock ecu and the jet spread was all weird.. I was using a direct port from NOS using the soft plume foggers... for most 4 cyl cars (per wady now @ nitrous supply) 24/16's were a 100 shot.. my spread panned out to 24/18's or 20's (don't remember exactly) w/ 45psi @ idle. I personally don't recommend an ecu @ 100 shot because as long as it's tuned mechanically it throws a bunch of possible bugs out the window.. also for the amount you spend on an ecu you can just take it to a dyno and get your a/f ratio perfect rather than "safe w/learning and adjusting thrown in the mix" and paying 2-3 times more.. but like I said i firmly believe that the motor wouldn't made it a lot longer if i figured out the jet spread that much faster.. I also tried pulling fuel from different spots to see if it made a difference (originally I was pulling fuel right off my regulator then went to before the injectors- I was told politely by a couple of people @ nos at the time that side feed systems suck compared to the top feeds =( but we all knew that anyway and it did help a little) my a/f ratios were a lot more stable when initially engaged.. but long story short I ended up building the motor with arias pistons and shot peened rods upped the nitrous to 120 and blew it right up the 1st time to the track cause I had tranny/slick issues - automatic,open ex-manifold, on 22x9's-it wasn't the nitrous' or motor's fault just circumstance.. if you have a 5speed I highly recommend it - squeezed dry then direct nearly daily before it went and like it said it was due mostly because how long it took to tune (when first starting out with the normal jet spread I was surprised it made it through that first pass- I pulled a plug and nearly jumped out the window) ... but doubling the hp out of the GA @ the pull of a trigger is the shate!!!!!! the car boogies!!! :hal: I highly recommend it, I would just start out with fat jets and work backward in the tuning process and keep it simple & effective, the reason why I say this is because I thought things had to be a done a particular way to make it safe and effective and later found out I just wasted a gang of $$$ that didn't really help me in the long run... good luck with your project bro and let us know how it goes.. :thumbup:


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## 1punchKO (May 26, 2005)

DanTheMan said:


> Well, because jwt won't touch obdII ecu's and It has to be tunable on the fly not by mail order. (please stop trying to sell me on a jwt ecu) I am not rewiring an ecu for the prior model year and maybe failing emissions, PERIOD!
> If all you want is a weekend racecar great! Do whatever you want to your computer. I want a legal, drivable car that I can register and pass emissions with. (OBDI will not pass an OBDII scan diagnostic, duh) Anyway, a progressive controller and an ignition plus the nos kit together are probabally still cheaper than a new ecu!
> 
> I was thinking ignition because you have to have aftermarket ignition to setup an RPM window switch and nos cut before fuel cut. (without jwt ecu management). Plus the ignition might be good for a few ponies off the juice.
> ...


progressive controller + ecu = big waste of $$$!!!

I had a controller and got rid of it - it takes all the fun out of it and kills your time @ the track not to mention beats the spit out of the solenoids...

ecu- please don't fall into this trap.. yes it can help on and off the nitrous but not best efficiency and not in all cases.. please keep in mind that all our motor are running in different conditions (alt, ocatane rating, volumetric eff, etc... ) so no matter who it is, unless your using something like a MOTEC or AEM with true time lambda controls and a 5 wire 02 , your just getting a chipped box... for a lot less you can: rent a dyno and have the car tuned for both NA & on the button, any dyno shop'll carry at least a horriba.. that way you can tune your car down to the specifics and get a lot more out of it for a lot less money!!! The way I did mine was I carried a punch with me @ the time of tuning, the shop I worked for didn't have a dyno yet so we used a Dan White Horriba-starting @ stock settings I marked the distrib & cam camp, then tuned it for NA and marked the cap again, then on nitrous and marked the cap again... and just had to remember the fuel settings.. yes it not as "on the fly" but a lot more effective and lighter in the pocket.. it's not track specific depending when and were you tune but it's a lot more specific and effective when you comapare to a box that doesn't know: altitude, humidity, fuel specifics, etc..... it's common sense that a car tuned @ say sea level in CA ain't gonna run the same in CO (mile high) or FL (sea level but super humid) and you haven't factored in: the effieciency of the motor, what's done the motor and so on... a lot of chipped boxes will start by fattening up the fuel.. this will help on NA and also on the Nitrous (some will even go as far as creating a "pillow" to keep things safe)... but keep this in mind would a track athlete were super baggy jeans vs. a running singlet?? yes it keeps the legs warm but not @ it's best efficiency, does it fit? yes but not good as it could & wouldn't perform no were near the same..... and after owning a K&N, autometer, & rsr led a/f gauge and comparing it to a quality piece... they're all useless and far off the leds just look cool bouncing back and forth (which should also tell you something right away) @ idle and low cruising speeds.. :thumbdwn: I first tried tuning on my own using these and later found that they may have been a major player in the motor going south.. 
- surprisingly enough Nissan builds a stout GA motor for what it is (especially when compared to something like a single cam Honda motor... When pulling the motor apart the rings were in good shape kinda.... they were the only thing holding the piston together.. but other than that they really did look as if they weren't fried or anything.. the problem is the fact that the GA piston has a high silicone content. This silicone is used to make the motor keeps it quiet, but after high temp the silicone in the piston turns brittle & cracks (in my case shatters)... a lot of ford guys with the hyperutechtic (hope I spelled that right) pistons experience the same thing.

I had a hi-6 with my GA/direct port set up. I didn't feel a thing on the motor but I'm sure it made a difference on the nitrous... 

plumbing under the manifold is cool but on that manifold and with trying to tune/figure the right jet spread - good luck, I hope you have a lot of patience and don't mind either taking off the manifold or getting under the car as often as I've hit the space button while typing this..


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

Good posts, lots of useful info. I notice one difference though. You appear to have the proper resources and requisite knowledge to make all of that work. The difference is that not everyone does, so an all in one solution is not the WORST way to go if you have limited knowledge and resources!

However from your standpoint it makes no sense to use something like that! My point is, there is a steep learning curve with Nitrous setups. 

More than doubling the power output is something the GA can withstand, however I believe the stresses of nitrous will continually destory rings/lands at that power level. What broke on your built motor and what were you using on the auto tranny.? I KNOW that stock trany was giving up the ghost...


A couple of us have more than doubled the rated HP with turbo's....


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## 1punchKO (May 26, 2005)

wes said:


> However from your standpoint it makes no sense to use something like that! My point is, there is a steep learning curve with Nitrous setups.
> 
> More than doubling the power output is something the GA can withstand, however I believe the stresses of nitrous will continually destory rings/lands at that power level. What broke on your built motor and what were you using on the auto tranny.? I KNOW that stock trany was giving up the ghost...
> 
> ...


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

Sounds like you gave that motor the old 1punchKO....


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## blownb310 (Jun 10, 2002)

Well, how did it work? Did it go boom?









edit: sorry, I didn't see that there was a page 2.


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## E-serious B-12 (Aug 18, 2005)

*con rods*



1punchKO said:


> wes said:
> 
> 
> > However from your standpoint it makes no sense to use something like that! My point is, there is a steep learning curve with Nitrous setups.
> ...


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## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

Holy old thread ! BATMAN


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## blownb310 (Jun 10, 2002)

Bryan200sx said:


> Holy old thread ! BATMAN


That's what happens when one searches.


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## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

blownb310 said:


> That's what happens when one searches.


Its cool just felt like jokeing a little. :cheers: 

Let me know if there is anything i can help you out in.


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## b13nissan (May 1, 2002)

Bryan200sx said:


> Its cool just felt like jokeing a little. :cheers:
> 
> Let me know if there is anything i can help you out in.


Did you ever get your car on the dyno?


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## thestunts200sx (Jul 11, 2005)

Yea, I'm interested to see the results ....I have been meaning to ( which is a common phrase of mine ) . I had purchased one recently, and never got it....long story.

Is your car an auto or manual ?
Cause i have a 96 200sx se auto ....

Keep us updated.


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## E-serious B-12 (Aug 18, 2005)

Bryan200sx said:


> Holy old thread ! BATMAN


I had some good cylinderhead information I was goingto share but fuck it,it mightbe an old thread and you already know it all so I won't waste our time!


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

E-serious B-12 said:


> I had some good cylinderhead information I was goingto share but fuck it,it mightbe an old thread and you already know it all so I won't waste our time!


Not sure how you took it but what he posted had really nothing to do with the useful info. you posted.


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## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

E-serious B-12 said:


> I had some good cylinderhead information I was goingto share but fuck it,it mightbe an old thread and you already know it all so I won't waste our time!


Talk about touchy....

Did the post about me saying i was joking just fly by you?


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## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

b13nissan said:


> Did you ever get your car on the dyno?



No shortly there after i got another car and its been burning a hole in my pocket. 

The 200sx is almost back to stock.

I really got into Auto-X and scca events so i bought an SVT focus. I sold everything from the nissan and its been put into new rims and tires as well as an LSD for the focus.


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## Loki (Jan 12, 2004)

friend of mine has a SVT Focus....always gets smoked by this lil old Nissan


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## Bryan200sx (Jan 23, 2003)

maybe

But thats a 240 way different when it comes to way the suspension of a b14.

It would have taken me a whole lot more money to get it to handel like the SVT in the stock form.

Also unless you have modified brakes after about 2 hard laps in a roadcourse your times will start to go down due to brake fade. Something that i have yet to experience with the SVT's stock brakes. 

To each his own.

BTW what was the whole point of bashing the SVT? No one has even mentioned a 240? 

No interesting topics in the 240 forum?


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## Loki (Jan 12, 2004)

Bryan200sx said:


> maybe
> 
> But thats a 240 way different when it comes to way the suspension of a b14.
> 
> ...


yeah they are, just saying the SVT isnt nothing special down here, and the owner of it even admits that it sucks overall on every single thing...gets smoked so easy by the IBIZA FR and the Clio Sport....also my S13 has all basic bolt ons, but either way.....that 2.0 6speed just doesnt feel strong at all, not even on the corners (yes ive driven it.....) RWD all the way :cheers:


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## shift_of_legend (Jun 2, 2004)

man I am so dissappointed...this info is so good I was really looking forward to more, because I am planning to nos with a 55 shot on mine and use a jacobs progressive controller...but it seems you guys are dadvising against that. I allso have sr20de injectors and safc. I need some advice on whether I need them.

Any body have any supportive info on the jacobs?

I was really finding the e16 lowering compression theory very interesting


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## nismo jimmy (Dec 16, 2005)

i currently run a 100 wet shot with various bolt ons and the motors fine with uprated cyl head bolts and a soft hit set up through a controller.


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