# converting truck to Propane



## billygg (Jul 29, 2005)

Hey Guys, 

Lately with the price of gas rising, and global warming taking over, i have been doing some research on converting my truck to either natural gas or propane. This is a very doable project, and from what i read, there is no difference in hp. Actually, running off gas is way more efficient, costs less, and does not polute nearly as bad. Check out this link:

http://www.motherearthnews.com/top_articles/1972_May_June/Convert_Your_Car_To_Propane 

just paste it in a browser. 

So what do you guys think of this. Seeing the frontie is a gas hog, with the latest global warming issues, i really am debating either selling my truck, or changing the way it runs. BUT I LOVE MY TRUCK .


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## Centurion (Sep 5, 2002)

blah...less HP, more weight, terrible availability for refilling, increased complexity and etc. No thanks. I heard though that it burns so cleanly that the oil almost never has to be changed. Interesting nonetheless.


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## msubullyfan (Jul 24, 2005)

Centurion said:


> blah...less HP, more weight, terrible availability for refilling, increased complexity and etc. No thanks. I heard though that it burns so cleanly that the oil almost never has to be changed. Interesting nonetheless.


That can't be true. The heat and friction from the engine is what causes much of the vicosity changes and thermal breakdown in the oil. Going to propane won't change any of that.

I do agree with you on everything else. If the fuel regulator isn't set right, the engine could suck in too much fuel and blow the engine (search the Internet -- that's a documented problem for these vehicles. It's especially bad if you're the guinea pig and a good experience list for your vehicle hasn't been developed yet).

There's one big issue that the article doesn't address -- if you ever get any kind of fuel line fitting leak in a propane- or natural gas-powered vehicle, it will be MUCH more dangerous than a gasoline leak in a garage -- just like a natural gas leak in a home can cause an explosion.

My company has a lot of propane-powered maintenance vehicles. We have a requirement of how close they may be parked next to each other and they are NEVER to be parked in an enclosed environment. We're always checking and tightening fittings on the fuel lines.


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## Gerald (May 23, 2005)

No way I would do that for all of the reasons already stated. You will have to mount the tank in the bed of your truck so you not only gain a few hundred pounds weight you also lose some precious bed space.

In my younger days I worked for an oilfield trucking company one summer. We knocked the valve off of a 500 gallon LPG tank that was half full. That was a hair raising experience for all of us. The reason I know it was half full is that you could see the frost line on the tank.

When I was in highschool a friend of mine fueled a fleet of LPG equipped trucks. He had to wear gloves as the fittings would frost over when you disconnected the fueling hose.

A funny thing, while I was entering this post a news story came across stating that the
global warming is blown all out of proportion and that man is not as responsible as nature.
That is debatable and this is not the place to do that, but I definitely would not equip my
truck with LPG.

OkieScot


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## billygg (Jul 29, 2005)

Putting the gas issue aside, many people think that the global warming problem is blown out of porportion, its pretty funny. They have never seen the artics melting faster. its gonna be funny in 10 years when florida is under water, cause people just dont give 2 shits. Its pretty obvious the earth is warming, you can look at all the cat 5 hurricanes and mass flooding in the last couple years to confirm that. My whole purpose behind this post was to look for a better way to get around without destroying the one place we live. You guys opened up the light to propane. I did see they have been testing natural gas cars. even honda has a new civic that runs on it. the civic gx. pretty sweet shit. I personally wouldnt mind not being dependant on fuel, seeing our country is.


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## peters1977 (Jun 19, 2006)

I agree with you on the global warming issue. As far as natural gas powered vehicles many cars are converted in Europe. My cousin has a VW which he converted 2 years ago and he never had a problem, and as you can imagine the cost of fuel has gone down for him. Another plus of doing this in Europe is the fact that the gasoline is much more expensive there than here, and there are many more natural gas stations. It's a very popular alternative there.
As we all know Oil companies have huge amount of influence on US economy and I don't see the government looking and enabling average citizens to have access to reasonably priced alternatives. Sure you can buy an electric car (bad choice) or even a hybrid (much more expensive), but until these alternatives are actually cheaper than currently used technology most people will not use them.

A month ago I switched from Celica GT 1.8L V4. Great gas mileage, and a good overall commuter car, I bought a Frontier because I need the bed for home projects. I don't regret it at all, yet if I didn't need it I would have never bought a car that gets only 20mpg estimated on the highway.

Just my thoughts...


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## jerryp58 (Jan 6, 2005)

billygg said:


> Putting the gas issue aside, many people think that the global warming problem is blown out of porportion, its pretty funny. They have never seen the artics melting faster. its gonna be funny in 10 years when florida is under water, cause people just dont give 2 shits. Its pretty obvious the earth is warming, you can look at all the cat 5 hurricanes and mass flooding in the last couple years to confirm that. My whole purpose behind this post was to look for a better way to get around without destroying the one place we live. You guys opened up the light to propane. I did see they have been testing natural gas cars. even honda has a new civic that runs on it. the civic gx. pretty sweet shit. I personally wouldnt mind not being dependant on fuel, seeing our country is.


I'm still not convinced about global warming (at least people being the cause). The earth has been through many drastic climate changes long before man started "polluting". And, 10 or even 100 years of weather observation is just a blip on the timeline. But, I guess we, or our children, or our children's children, or... well, you get the idea... will find out someday.

Anyway, I wouldn't put aside the "gas issue". It irritates the heck out of me that we consume so much of a product which is sold to us by people who use the profit from those sales against us. I've been using E10 for a couple of months now and I'm not sure if it or the fact that I've been using my AC quite a bit through this hot summer may have affected my MPG negatively just a bit, but I don't care. I'd be using E40 (the highest I beilieve I can run in my truck) if it were available in my area just to use less gas.

So, I say if you're that interested, do the conversion and tell us what you think. I looked at the link you gave briefly and it seemed they underestimate the cost (I thought it was better than $1k to convert). Availability on the highway might be tricky (a GPS with camping way points might help), but most towns have someone pumping propane (at least they did before the tank swapping started). We had some propane vehicles (trucks and mini-vehicles and fork lifts) at our facility a while back. I'm not sure that we have anything but propane fork lifts left (the mini-vehicles went electric) but I remember talking to some of the propane truck drivers. They were impressed with the trucks and said they ran pretty much like a gas truck.

Just some thoughts.


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## mitchell35758 (Oct 21, 2005)

Most all zambonis are run with either propane or natural gas, and most all the ice rinks I have been to and played ice hockey at have garages within the facility where they keep them parked. I'm sure there might have been instances throughout the nation, but I have never heard of any problems with an explosion or fire because of an gas leak. 
We did have one time when one of the ice plex's zambonis was leaking gas(no explosions or fires etc.) and we all played horrible, nobody had any energy and we couldn't very straight. My wife, mother, and sister were there that nght watching me and my father play, and I guess because of where they were sitting, it affected them worse, but they were pretty sick though the next morning. Of course nobody had figured there was a leak until later that night...pretty damn sad they didn't have any monitoring devices to catch a problem like this. They do now though
I don't think it is much of a big deal as far as safety issues go. There are going to be issues and incidents every now and then just as there are with gasoline leaks and fires.
Hell, not to long ago there was a car fire on the interstate in Huntsville, AL and they determined it to be because of a fuel leak...or so the story says. Anytime there is any kind of fuel involved, there is going to be trouble eventually.


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## billygg (Jul 29, 2005)

I agree that i bought a frontier for the use of it. I am planning a move soon, and will be living outside a pretty big city "Charlotte". I know that i will probably be driving double the amount i drive now, thus spending prob around 50 a week on gas. that alone is like half the damn truck payment, haha. Thats why i considered looking either for another means of fueling, or selling it. Maybe even getting a day driver thats efficient on fuel for work driving. I do love my truck, when i bought it, my views were a little different on the earth, and i want to keep my part in preserving. I think the natural gas "cng" is probably a better solution than the propane gas. I do agree that the kits, if they even make them for the newer cars, will be prob in the 1 to 5k range. Thanks everyone for your opinions. Its nice to see what people think of the conversions and the warming issue. I am going to call around tomorrow and see what some of these companies recommend and prices for conversions.


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## avenger (Oct 7, 2005)

somebody watched an al gore movie...


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## Mylt1 (May 10, 2006)

as far as i can tell global warming is a fact of nature. remember when dinos ruled the world almost half of north america was under water. seems to me that its just a fact of life that people cant understand. there have been many ice ages through out the life of the earth. looks to me that this is just the begining of the end. not anytime soon but it will happen. 
as far as the propane, most of the kits i have seen require the fork lift tanks. they dont weigh hundreds of pounds but yes you will loose bed space. question is where are you gonna get it filled? most places are getting away from filling propane tanks and are just doing extanges on them. there are very few places where i live that still refill tanks. so supply may be an issue. 
jerryp58 you really shouldnt be running anything grater than e10 in the frontier. unless the older ones are different my manual says e10 is the max to use in the 05 frontier. and yes you will notice a drop in MPG's by useing any E mixed fuel.


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## Gerald (May 23, 2005)

Well said Mylt1.

OkieScot


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## msubullyfan (Jul 24, 2005)

This thread has been thoroughly, soundly hijacked.


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## Mylt1 (May 10, 2006)

msubullyfan said:


> This thread has been thoroughly, soundly hijacked.


how is that? we'er still kinda on topic. global warming, lowering emissions, and propane systems. a little off topic yes but not as bad as i have seen some places.


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## msubullyfan (Jul 24, 2005)

billygg said:


> So what do you guys think of this. Seeing the frontie is a gas hog, with the latest global warming issues, i really am debating either selling my truck, or changing the way it runs. BUT I LOVE MY TRUCK .


The original poster asked for advice about whether or not he should convert his truck to propane -- he didn't ask for a enviro-socioeconomic dissertation on global warming.

I'm not upset. I just thought the direction the thread went was quite humorous.


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## Z_Rated (Apr 29, 2006)

Would I? No, I want/need truckability. Gas hog? Maybe, but I knew what I was in for as far as MPG. No difference in HP? Not in my experiences as a fork lift operator in both performance and preference. Although, I would like to hear your opinion after a conversion if you choose to do so.


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## azrocketman (Oct 5, 2005)

I'll ignore the moral, maintenance, and performance aspects of this discussion and concentrate on the economics. I'll assume that gasoline costs $3.00 gallon and you currently get 15 mpg. If you double your gas milage and the LPG still costs $3.00 per gallon then you save ten cents per mile. If the kit costs you $1000 you'll need to drive 10,000 miles before you break even. If the fuel cost drops to $2.00 a gallon but the gas mileage stays at 15 mpg it will take you about 14,000 miles to break even (assuming the kit is still $1000).

The above assumptions are extreme that you'll double your mileage, that the fuel cost is reduced by a third, or that the kit costs only $1000. I think, when the real economics and economies are considered that your break even may be 30 to 40 thousand miles (or more) away. It may be worth it to you if you are driving lots of miles per year or if the non-economic factors are important (like global warming). Speaking for myself, I'd concentrate on keeping the truck in the best state of tune, proper tire pressures, and driving style.

Steve


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## Gerald (May 23, 2005)

Actually he mentioned global warming as part of his consideration of the conversion so I feel we are still sort of on topic at least for part of his quandary. If something is said to solidify his postion on global warming one way or the other then we have helped him.

Although I come down soundly on the side of leave it like it is there are some positives for LPG. One of the trucking companies I worked for just out of school used LPG on their
trucks. It did not produce as much power nor as good of fuel mileage, but it did extend the life of their engines.

International Harvester gave them a new 450 CI engine in exchange for one they got 500,000 miles out of. The engine longevity is where they made their savings.

OkieScot


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## MrMorphine (Jul 15, 2005)

PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC stop watching CNN! 

This is my current information:
1.yes,it's gonna get worse before it gets better.
2.Too little too late. we can't just go cold turkey on gas,it's gonna take time to get out alternate fuel source infrastructure running.
3.The hole in the ozone layer has begun to patch it self up,but it is going to take time.
4.Will somone please tell ford and chevy to stop selling school bus sized SUVs? 
5. Does anyone know where we'll be able to buy mickey mouse ears that havent been under 6 feet of water in 2026?


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## jerryp58 (Jan 6, 2005)

Mylt1 said:


> jerryp58 you really shouldnt be running anything grater than e10


Hey thanks for pointing that out. I read through my owner's manual when I got the truck but didn't recall reading about Exx. My '04 manual says the same thing about oxygenates (10% max recommended).

I guess I was going on the general belief (Internet, news stories, etc.) that most vehicles produced after 2000 should easily be able to handle up to E40. Of course, the way Nissan reacts to some brands of spark plugs (e.g., Bosch), I guess we can say Nissan may not be included with "most vehicles".

Anyway, I guess I'll have to consider warranty versus trying to contribute to the growth of a gasoline competitor, all the while taking a MPG hit (I think it'll still be worth it to me -- even though the oil companies will probably be in control of the corn fields someday  ).


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## jerryp58 (Jan 6, 2005)

MrMorphine said:


> PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC stop watching CNN!
> 
> This is my current information:
> 1.yes,it's gonna get worse before it gets better.
> ...


I'm curious. Have we ever known there not to be a hole in the Ozone? What if it's supposed to be there and we succeed in closing it up?


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## Mylt1 (May 10, 2006)

speaking of bus sized suvs. there was a report from texas, midland i believe. the gm dealerships even with the price of gas cant keep $60k escalades on the lot. a lot of dealerships are reporting huge sales of full size trucks and suv's since gas prices have gone up. oh and ford and gm arnt the only ones selling bus sized suv's. one word armada. yes i know its not a suburban or an expedition but its still a big ass suv. to the tune of $50k when i bought my frontier. but i have to say. if i could have afforded it i would have gotten it. it had everything you could get on one.


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