# KA24E Valve Tapping



## Keone777 (Sep 24, 2008)

Got the tapping going on under the valve cover. Heard it can mushroom and compress the valve stem. Anybody got any helpful past experieces and is there any special tools I'll need? I have the valve clearance adjuster. Oh, and the book says it's a hydraulic, self-adjusting valve system. Thanks!


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Keone777 said:


> Got the tapping going on under the valve cover. Heard it can mushroom and compress the valve stem. Anybody got any helpful past experiences and is there any special tools I'll need? I have the valve clearance adjuster. Oh, and the book says it's a hydraulic, self-adjusting valve system. Thanks!


My shop uses a product called "Valve Medic". It can clean noisy lifters and allow them to pump back up. I've only seen one or two that the customers had let the oil change intervals go so long that this stuff wouldn't clean them up.

There's always the possibility of a mechanical failure causing the noise, but trying a good top end cleaner is very inexpensive. There are several good ones on the parts store shelves, Seafoam, CD-2, etc., but always follow the directions carefully.


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## Hiteshew (Aug 8, 2009)

hey I actually have the same year and model as you, and had the same problem.. but it only happened after i was driving it for a few hours straight. I'm just curious if this happens to you when you have a load or if its been running for awhile? or is it constant no matter what..

-I told my uncle about it and he said to put a thicker oil in it and i did but i haven't ran it like that since.. so i don't know if it did anything or not, hasn't ticked since though..


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## Hiteshew (Aug 8, 2009)

I'd listen to "TheRepairMan" haha.. I'm practically a newbie ... probably to him anyway :newbie:


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Hiteshew said:


> hey I actually have the same year and model as you, and had the same problem.. but *it only happened after i was driving it for a few hours straight.* I'm just curious if this happens to you when you have a load or if its been running for awhile? or is it constant no matter what..
> 
> -I told my uncle about it and he said to put a thicker oil in it and i did but i haven't ran it like that since.. so i don't know if it did anything or not, hasn't ticked since though..


Yours may have actually been an oil pressure problem. That can happen with older or high mileage vehicles. 

After I treat a customers engine for 20 or 30 minutes I always change the oil anyway, so going to a step heavier weight isn't a problem ...and may help some if it is an oil pump issue.


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## Keone777 (Sep 24, 2008)

Thanks for the replies guys. 

So, I use 5W30 in my truck and add about 10% capacity of Lucas Oil Stabilizer. I've used Seafoam in my gas tank, but have been hesitant to put it in to my oil. Is Seafoam safe and is Valve Medic better? Heard some sketchy stuff about Seafoam in the crankcase.

Oh, and so my hydraulic lifters aren't mechanically adjustable?


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## Keone777 (Sep 24, 2008)

Oh, and my truck tends to tap when it is still warming up. After driving for close to an hour, the tapping diminishes to where I can't hear it unless I open the hood and put my head in.


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Keone777 said:


> Thanks for the replies guys.
> 
> So, I use 5W30 in my truck and add about 10% capacity of Lucas Oil Stabilizer. I've used Seafoam in my gas tank, but have been hesitant to put it in to my oil. Is Seafoam safe and is Valve Medic better? Heard some sketchy stuff about Seafoam in the crankcase.
> 
> Oh, and so my hydraulic lifters aren't mechanically adjustable?


Seafoam seems to most commonly be used in dealing with moisture in a fuel system. That's what we have always used it for, but I have used it in an engine before for only a few minutes to clean the lifters with no ill effects.

Valve Medic is exactly what it says it is. It's formulated specifically for cleaning oil deposits off the hydraulic valve lash adjusters and their tiny little oil passages. It works VERY well for this, and yes, your 95 KA24E engine should have hydraulic adjusters.



Keone777 said:


> Oh, and my truck tends to tap when it is still warming up. After driving for close to an hour, the tapping diminishes to where I can't hear it unless I open the hood and put my head in.


Very common symptoms of dirty lash adjusters. Yours should be pretty easy to clear up. Don't leave the Valve Medic or CD-2 in for a long period or during hard use of the truck. If my memory serves me correctly it only needs to be run about 20 minutes and then change the oil. Severe cases may require longer treatment or a second dose over the next oil change interval. You don't want to over-clean all the engine internals. That could cause it to start burning oil. Follow the directions.


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## zanegrey (Dec 5, 2005)

it is a dis service to post this and not give us vital statistics...

this is modst likely a timing chain problem which most would have told you first if you would have given mileage..

also check into an anti flo back oil pump..


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

zanegrey said:


> it is a dis service to post this and not give us vital statistics...
> 
> this is modst likely a timing chain problem which most would have told you first if you would have given mileage..
> 
> also check into an anti flo back oil pump..




I'll agree with you, Zane. The timing chain issue is much more common than lash adjusters, but they do sound quite a bit different, too. So who knows without being able to hear it for ourselves?

If he could YouTube a video of it sounding off maybe we could decipher which of the two problems it might be.


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## Keone777 (Sep 24, 2008)

I apologize about not giving the vitals. My truck has 168,000 on the tac, but the previous owner said the tac went out for a while when it was first owned and there might be a 10,000-20,000 mile discrepency (more). 

I will try the Valve Medic in the oil to see if that works, crossing my fingers.

In the meantime, I will see if I can post a video up from my girlfriends phone. Hopefully the sound is good enough.

Thanks for the help because this is my daily driver/yard truck/weekend adventures truck. Want to keep my baby running .


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## zanegrey (Dec 5, 2005)

close to 200 k miles .. replace the timing chain...
or get ready to buy another engine..

which i sell ...

400 for a long block 500 rtdi...


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## lumbee (Mar 20, 2005)

zanegrey said:


> close to 200 k miles .. replace the timing chain...
> or get ready to buy another engine..
> 
> which i sell ...
> ...


...I disagree...I have a 95 2wd with the KA24E. I've had the tapping go in and out for the last 5 years. My symptoms are like Hites...in normal driving back/forth to school (only about 5 miles) I never hear it, but when I drive to my folks place (about 200 miles once a month) it happens about every time. This is pretty well documented on this forum as a tappet issue (not timing chain) , and does not seem to have any ill effects on the motor.


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## 95pickup (Jul 22, 2009)

You are all WRONG!!!!!:loser:

Just kidding..

I say its the timing chain. That seems to be the common issue
with these trucks!

My truck motor was getting louder and louder as i got near 190k. 
I thought the engine was done.

It had lots of power but sounded like it was gonna blow at idle
torn down the front engine and found a broken guide and a loose tim chain
replaced and added some other new parts.
the motor now sounds like new...

And one more thing. in texas if you use 5w-40 oil the motor sounds like its gonna blow. valves tap way too loud.
I have used 10w-40 for 110k for the last 7 years. when i rebuilt the engine.
ZERO SLUDGE.. MOTOR WAS BEYOND CLEAN ON THE INSIDE...
Valvoline 10w-40 Maxlife. Nissan swears by it and so do i...

good luck:balls:


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## Keone777 (Sep 24, 2008)

Well, I'm doing my clutch, flywheel, engine and tranny mounts, and the clutch slave cylinder next weekend. Got some work ahead of me 

Until then, I'm going to run some Seafoam through the engine and change to 10W40 w/ Lucas Oil Stabilizer and see if that helps. Hopefully it does.

Zanegrey, thanks for advice. Seen you post alot on here and looks like you know these trucks real good. I'll probably look into doing the timing chain either this winter break or summer (hard to do while in college). Oh, and what kind of engine are you selling? Don't know what a long block 500 rtdi is. :newbie:


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## zanegrey (Dec 5, 2005)

a long block is a whole engine less peripherals..intake ,exhaust no pulleys no brackets or pumps..no dizzy ..

rtdi... ready to drop in...


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## Keone777 (Sep 24, 2008)

So what's the 500 mean? Is it KA24E? :lame:, I know...


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## rogoman (Dec 16, 2004)

TheRepairMan said:


> I'll agree with you, Zane. The timing chain issue is much more common than lash adjusters, but they do sound quite a bit different, too. So who knows without being able to hear it for ourselves?


There's a big difference in the sound between a timing chain problem and a hydraulic lifter problem. 

A worn timing chain assembly will produce a rather loud rattling sound, particularly during cold start-up. A worn hydraulic lifter will have a taping sound.


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## zanegrey (Dec 5, 2005)

the ka24e does not have hydraulic lifters..


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

zanegrey said:


> the ka24e does not have hydraulic lifters..


Zane, are you sure? I'm almost positive mine are hydraulic ...hummm...??? 

The ka24de motors don't though... solid shim and bucket style.

Here's a post about them in the ka24e from the timing chain replacement sticky above in this forum.

http://www.nissanforums.com/1194054-post4.html

And, a very descriptive post about them in our engines in another forum.

Ratsun Forum - View Single Post - nissan engine ticking


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## zanegrey (Dec 5, 2005)

my brain hurtz...


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## lumbee (Mar 20, 2005)

zanegrey said:


> the ka24e does not have hydraulic lifters..


...I'm pretty sure the lifters are hydraulic...no I havn't pulled the valve cover, so I havn't seen it with my own eyes, but my manual says it does, and I've talked to mechanics that says it does...:thumbdwn:


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## zanegrey (Dec 5, 2005)

there is a cam ,rocker and valve stem...no hydraulic lifters...


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

zanegrey said:


> there is a cam ,rocker and valve stem...no hydraulic lifters...


Okay, Zane, don't let your brain explode, but read this and tell me this isn't what the rockers do in our Ka24e engines. I'm just sayin' ...

Ticking Lifters in a KA24E

Most SOHC owners complain of lifter tick.. or actually, the lash adjusters not working properly CAUSING a tick, but few know that it CAN be repaired as a DIY project.

I dont know if you all have read up on the subject, but this past few weeks i have read any and all info about hydraulic lash adjusters from Wikipedia, searched Google (read over 300 pages) and searched all the nissan forums out there.. 

Anyway.. here is an explanation for what a lifter does.. Thanks to Wikipedia..

A hydraulic lifter, also known as a hydraulic tappet or a hydraulic lash adjuster, is a device for maintaining zero valve clearance in an internal combustion engine. Conventional means of adjusting valve actuation always require a small clearance to be left between the valve and its rocker or cam follower to allow for thermal expansion and wear, as it is vital that a valve must never be prevented from closing completely; this rapidly burns it away, especially in the case of the exhaust valve. The hydraulic lifter was designed to ensure that the valvetrain always operates with zero clearance, leading to quieter operation and eliminating the need for periodic adjustment of valve clearance.

The hydraulic lifter consists of a hollow expanding piston situated between the camshaft and valve, either operated by a rocker mechanism or, in the case of double overhead camshafts, directly by the camshaft. It is filled with engine oil intermittently from an oil gallery through a small drilling. When the engine valve is closed, the lifter is free to fill with oil, but when the valve is opening and the lifter is being operated on by the camshaft, the oil feed is blocked and the lifter acts just as a solid one would, oil being nearly incompressible.

So, now that we know what it is.. 

What happens when a lifter gets dirt or air inside of it, gets stuck open, or seizes closed? 

NOISE, lots of it.. and possible damage since they may not open or close the valves all the way.. 


The valve lifters need to be bled when putting them together.. The smaller diameter tube has a valve that only opens when it is being pulled out of the other piece.. (thats the best way i can explain it) and what you need to do is find a needle, and push some oil in on that valve with a needle to bleed the air out of the lifter itself.. (it will compress as you bleed the air out) this image below is of a different set, but the idea stays the same..


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## zanegrey (Dec 5, 2005)

lol.........


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## lostsole69 (May 5, 2016)

I have a KA24 that just started to tap yesterday and it is just about 200,000 miles please give me a price on a long block. [email protected]


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## Qalaen (Aug 25, 2016)

Ok so....
I bought a 94 d21 2.4 kingcab for a hundred bucks head gasket was bad and waterpump housing was breached timing chain tensioner failed
Replaces the head gasket and head bolts
Water pump and housing 
Timing chain tentioner and guides
Cap rotor plugs and wires
Camshaft ( the end had a hairline crack)
Set the timing and she started right up and smoked like an old locamotive till it cleared itself out. Runs great now but it has noisy lifters very rattley. 
My question is will this go away with letting it idle or running it around without pushing it muchor do i need to find a wat too clean the lifters? If so do i run trans fluid or seafoam really really do nit want to take thehead off againLOL


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## rogoman (Dec 16, 2004)

Your engine is KA24E that uses hydraulic lifters. If a lifter(s) are tapping, then you have several options:
* - You can try using a powerful oil detergent to clean the lifter internals. A product called valve medic may help. AdvanceAuto sells it. Liquid Wrench Valve Medic M37-12: Advance Auto Parts
I think the instructions call for keeping it in the oil for a short period, then draining the motor oil.
* - You can take them apart and clean them with a strong solvent like lacquer thinner, just don't mix all the pieces between more then one lifter; they are uniquely machined/matched. After cleaning, prelub them with motor oil. 
* - Buy new lifters.


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## Qalaen (Aug 25, 2016)

Ok i will try the valve medic as now omly one seems to be ratteling
I also notoved a really bad hesitation almost as id iys starcing when accelerating hard.... thinking o2 sensor since it smoked like a frweight train when i got it started and test drove it. It cleared up not smoking but very sluggish. Cleaned the maf sensor just in case and it sedmed to help a lot at first but then right back to sluggishness
Starting to really like this little truck.


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## Qalaen (Aug 25, 2016)

Ok sensor is good and no more sluggishness!!
Anyone kniw about what an off frame paint job runs on these ?


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

Your best bet is to get several quotes from auto body shops in your area. Factors such as your area's labor rate and type and color of paint will greatly affect the price.


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## Qalaen (Aug 25, 2016)

Ya they gave me a quote of 4 grand to sand and spray....
Thinking about buying a spray gun and trying it myself


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

For a complete paint job, that doesn't sound out of the ballpark. White is a good color because it hides a lot. Black shows everything. Red is usually more expensive because of the pigment in the paint. Metallics can add to cost and be harder to paint, especially when you are dealing with "grays" such as metallic charcoal or some of your silvers and pearls. Preparation is the key to any good paint job as the paint won't look good if what's under it isn't properly prepared.


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