# Ride quality ???



## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Okay, it's a truck ...I get that, but does it have to shake me to death all the time?

The PO said they had problems getting their tire guy to do anything about the balance or tire shake. They were never happy with these Kelly Chargers. The tread still has a lot of life left. I checked the run out on each one and they are within specs and wearing evenly, but all 4 have a few ounces of weights on them. Looks excessive to me ...but I didn't do the balance. I'm thinking about taking all the weights off and running them ...then having another shop balance them as needed.

I just bought a set of Bilstein shocks to put all around and am looking for decent tires and prices. Not sure which ones to go with yet. I'll let you all know if the new shocks helped. BTW, this 2wd HB only has 92,000 miles on the clock.

What 14" tires have you guys been happy with?

Hey, at least this isn't another oil thread! :loser:


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## Nissanman7166 (Feb 12, 2009)

what year is the truck?


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Nissanman7166 said:


> what year is the truck?


Hey Mike,
Sorry ...it's a 1994. 2 wheel drive XE.

The tire size that's on it now is a 205/70-14 

-Roger


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## Nissanman7166 (Feb 12, 2009)

Thats pretty good mileage for that year on these trucks. Mine's a 93 and has a little over 328,000 miles.
Are you sure its a balance issue and not something to do with wheel bearings, sticking brakes, or bad U-joints? 
I had bad U-joints on my truck and it would shake the crap outa me between certain speeds and RPM's. ( Very cheap to replace )
Just a thought.


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Nissanman7166 said:


> Thats pretty good mileage for that year on these trucks. Mine's a 93 and has a little over 328,000 miles.
> Are you sure its a balance issue and not something to do with wheel bearings, sticking brakes, or bad U-joints?
> I had bad U-joints on my truck and it would shake the crap outa me between certain speeds and RPM's. ( Very cheap to replace )
> Just a thought.



Man, I really hope I can get those kind of miles out of this engine.

I'm not sure, but I'm changing shocks, ordering Michelin Harmony tires, and will repack and adjust the front wheel bearings during front brake rotor replacement, and about 14 bucks to have all tires rebalanced. 

After that I'll look hard at the rear drive line and joints. I'm going to figure this baby out and do what it takes to fix it. Now, about the tires. The Mich Harmonies are nice smooth car tires, which is what I want but are over a bill each and so I'm open to suggestions for rubber.

Thanks,
Roger


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## samabhi126 (Jul 1, 2009)

At least now you should leave that truck otherwise one day you will really meet the death.


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## Nissanman7166 (Feb 12, 2009)

Can't help out much on tires. My trucks lifted and I run 15" Mud terrain tires on mine so I wouldnt know much about what your looking for. someone else will have to chime in and give some input on that. 

good luck though


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Nissanman7166 said:


> Can't help out much on tires. My trucks lifted and I run 15" Mud terrain tires on mine so I wouldnt know much about what your looking for. someone else will have to chime in and give some input on that.
> 
> good luck though


Thanks ...I'm sticking with a passenger car tire in hopes of a smoother ride and better fuel economy. Just wondered what everyone else was doing.

-Roger


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## zanegrey (Dec 5, 2005)

go with a chrome pathy rims and a 235 75r 15 tires ..
passenger or light truck..

i get close to 30 miles to the gallon on the highway..

i have the z24 engine though..


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

zanegrey said:


> go with a chrome pathy rims and a 235 75r 15 tires ..
> passenger or light truck..
> 
> i get close to 30 miles to the gallon on the highway..
> ...


Sounds sweet, but I'm stuck with the 14's and will have to configure it with tires in some commonly found range that won't upset the suspension dynamics any more than they already are.

I had my mind pretty much set on Michelin Harmony's in a 205/70-R14 but of after servicing a Mercedes today that had a set with one of them cupping badly I'm not real sure of my choice anymore. I couldn't find anything wrong with the suspension on the car and they don't normally cup tires ...unless the tire is badly out of balance, and that may have been the case here.


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Okay, here goes ...I just replaced all the old shocks with Bilsteins. Easy job, and it really made a nice difference in the handling if not a somewhat stiffer but more controlled ride. They were a nice upgrade ...but it is still a truck. That said, the Kelly Charger tires still SUCK! I feel sorry for the previous owner that she was stuck with this set of tires so long. I won't be!

I wish I could move to a lighter set of alloy wheels also, but for now I'm just investing in the very best tires available. It should ride like a brand new truck again ...if not better.


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## 4X4D21 (Mar 9, 2009)

possibly you have a bent rim if it shakes alot. and yes it is a truck, but they can ride very smooth


i have a 93 4x4 5speed 2.4l, its got 81000 miles, ive replaced all the suspension in it, i have a set of 31x10.50x15 mud tires, redid the frame due to rust,(you may not have a bad frame, but i noticed with the frame like mine was at the rear wheel well, the frame was actually flexing, and gave me a very bad shake. so look into the frame as well) and with those i get excellent ride quality and about 24mpg in the city.


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

4X4D21 said:


> possibly you have a bent rim if it shakes alot. and yes it is a truck, but they can ride very smooth
> 
> 
> i have a 93 4x4 5speed 2.4l, its got 81000 miles, ive replaced all the suspension in it, i have a set of 31x10.50x15 mud tires, redid the frame due to rust,(you may not have a bad frame, but i noticed with the frame like mine was at the rear wheel well, the frame was actually flexing, and gave me a very bad shake. so look into the frame as well) and with those i get excellent ride quality and about 24mpg in the city.



Checked the wheels, they run true ...even the tires have very little lateral runout, but they are the heaviest 14" tire and wheel combo I've ever seen and no way they are in balance. 

As soon as I get my Wife's new tires paid for on her Honda, these Kelly Flintstones are coming off here. The truck is too nice to be running shi* for tires on it.

Checked the frame ...there is some very minor surface rust but none serious at this stage. I've got my prep and paint ready to treat the surface and it will be protected well then.

Thanks for your reply.


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

samabhi126 said:


> At least now you should leave that truck otherwise one day you will really meet the death.


This post has bothered me for days. Maybe that was the intention. 

Now I know the engineering, construction and crash integrity has come a LONG, long way since these 1994 trucks were put on the road ...but, you are talking to someone who just got rid of a 1988, 2 door, Mitsubishi Montero. Talking about your death trap! I'm so glad it's gone. I never would even let my Daughter or Wife drive it. The rollover potential was just too high, not to mention if you ever hit anything head on. You would be the first one to the accident scene for sure.

And, I grew up owning and driving early VW Beetles ...you know ...with the only thing between you and the front bumper being the fuel tank ...oh, and the spare tire ... big whoopee! On top of that, I ride motorcycles ...a lot ...mine makes 150 horsepower and can run a 10 second quarter mile @ over 140 MPH. Uh, with like no protection, really ...I mean, come on!

So the old Nissan Hardbody wasn't THAT hard. People still die in crashes in new cars EVERY single day. When it's my time to go, I'm outa here! I like the truck. Got a great deal on it and it's as good as any small truck that was built in it's day. That's all I expect of it ...and all I can afford. My Nissan D21 says "NO FEAR" on it and it's made it this far just fine.

Peace out!


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## Oldnissanguy (Jan 6, 2005)

I don't know what they cost, but the later model Pathfinder and Frontier 15" wheels fit fine.


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Oldnissanguy said:


> I don't know what they cost, but the later model Pathfinder and Frontier 15" wheels fit fine.


That's good to know. I was thinking the hubs might have the same pattern, but finding spare mags may present a problem. I'll have to take a look around and see. 

Going to 15's sure opens more options with tire availability. Not much selection in 14" anymore. Thanks for the tip!


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## Oldnissanguy (Jan 6, 2005)

BTW, unless you've already done it, you'll need to jack the front end back up to factory specs if you put on 15" wheels. Most of them sag a little, or a lot.


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## dentedsub (Oct 23, 2007)

i see this got off topic a little, for ride quality though, the brand of tire doesn't matter as much as the type. tires are regulated like everything else. point two is that everything is a compromise. the best ride would be big bias ply mud tires with a class A load rating and little air pressure. the only thing i can think of right now that would help is look for a set that replaces a steel band with kevlar or nylon, those are suppose to ride better. as for the michelins you saw with cupping, thats probably not the tire, they were probably ran too low psi or had a bad alignment. 
it might help a little if you lower the front as much as you dare. that will soften the front a little.


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Oldnissanguy said:


> BTW, unless you've already done it, you'll need to jack the front end back up to factory specs if you put on 15" wheels. Most of them sag a little, or a lot.


Yeah, I have seen that on several Torsion Rod suspension trucks over the years. Mine looks pretty good although I don't know what the measurements are suppose to be from the ground. Installing the Bilstein gas shocks helped it ride higher by a noticeable amount. People don't realize how that sag affects the alignment either. My front tires show just a tad more wear inside leading me to believe there's just a little too much negative camber at the height it's been running. I've only put about 200 miles on it with the new shocks and all "looks" okay.



dentedsub said:


> i see this got off topic a little, for ride quality though, the brand of tire doesn't matter as much as the type. tires are regulated like everything else. point two is that everything is a compromise. the best ride would be big bias ply mud tires with a class A load rating and little air pressure. the only thing i can think of right now that would help is look for a set that replaces a steel band with kevlar or nylon, those are suppose to ride better. as for the michelins you saw with cupping, that's probably not the tire, they were probably ran too low psi or had a bad alignment.
> it might help a little if you lower the front as much as you dare. that will soften the front a little.


Thanks for the tire info. That does help.

Normally, on the Michelin tire cupping, I would tend to agree with you, but this one was weird. Out of the ordinary cupping, because it only involved one of the larger blocks on the outside edge of the Harmony's tread. It didn't occur but in that one 2 to 3 degree section of the tire, not every other block all the way around the tire like some tread designs seem to do. There had to be a compound or belt problem with this tire, and I personally would have gone back to my tire dealer to have it replaced while the tread had most of its life life. I reported it but not sure how far that went.

I really hope I can find the solution to improve the ride. It's way too shaky-bumpy all the time. None of my other cars and trucks have ridden these very same roads this roughly. My 4wd Montero was extremely smooth for a truck in comparison to this 2wd D21. All else about that old 2 door Montero pretty much sucked ...but, it did ride good.


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## dentedsub (Oct 23, 2007)

i think this was already said, but did you check your u-joints yet?


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

dentedsub said:


> i think this was already said, but did you check your u-joints yet?


No, actually I have not. I mean, there's no looseness in the drive shaft at the joints, and it turns smoothly by hand, but I haven't actually pulled the shaft and checked them for any tight spots.

The previous owner had the vibration complaints just as soon as they had these Kelly tires installed, and the tire dealer said all was normal ...several times. Needless to say, they quit doing business with the tire dealer and spread word that he was a crook.

I'm still contemplating 15" tire and wheel combo's, but I'm glad you mentioned the U-joints. I do need to do a full inspection of them just in case.


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## Oldnissanguy (Jan 6, 2005)

+ on removing the drive shaft. You really can't tell the condition without removing it.


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## D21FAN (Jul 13, 2009)

I have a set of 225/70/14 Goodyear Wrangler AT/2s on my truck. They are a great riding tire and are very quite. Can even tell they are an all terrain tire when driving it. But i do have to say that when they wear out that i am gonna go when a 15inch setup


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

One thing I've noticed, while paying close attention and turning up my senses to diagnostic mode, there's a lot of shake ...like road irregularities and such coming up through the steering column. I can also feel the engine vibrations in the steering wheel at certain RPM's, perhaps more than would be considered normal. Having never owned one before, I really don't know right now what is normal and what is a problem. I WILL make it better and will be persistant in finding what it needs. That's all I've done for a living for nearly 40 years, but my first real experience with owning a Nissan truck.

I've looked at cab mounts, motor mounts, transmission, all suspension components, exhaust, frame, and everything I can get my hands on, to check for any wear, damage, or anything out of alignment or bent. Have yet to see or locate any abnormal condition anywhere, and the original owner says the truck was never in an accident, and I even checked CarFax to be sure. I love the truck and its simple, straight forward mechanical design, so I'm going to hang in there 'til I make this thing ride like butta'.

I also thought of putting a VERY large Amp and huge Sub in so I won't notice the bad vibes any more.

:thumbup:


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## D21FAN (Jul 13, 2009)

Well i tell you what i did to mine....it road kinda like a boat, when i would hit a bump it would kinda keep on bouncing, well come to find out all my shocks were shot. So i fixed those. When i was putting those on, i noticed the ball joints were bad. I replaced the uppers and lowers and got an anlignment, and no more play and drive brand new.


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

D21FAN said:


> Well i tell you what i did to mine....it road kinda like a boat, when i would hit a bump it would kinda keep on bouncing, well come to find out all my shocks were shot. So i fixed those. When i was putting those on, i noticed the ball joints were bad. I replaced the uppers and lowers and got an alignment, and no more play and drive brand new.


I was getting the boat ride too, and put Bilsteins all the way around. They control the bounce and made it handle better but are a bit harsh so far, plus I think they actually accentuate what I suspect is rough tire vibration. I'm still glad I changed the shocks, and I did not find wear in the ball joints or bushings. This D21 has had a pretty easy life ...up to now. LOL


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## D21FAN (Jul 13, 2009)

Yeah mine it too, its a 1992 with 155k on it. Never wrecked, and was owned by 2 old men.


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## CMax03 (Jan 17, 2009)

TheRepairMan said:


> I was getting the boat ride too, and put Bilsteins all the way around. They control the bounce and made it handle better but are a bit harsh so far, plus I think they actually accentuate what I suspect is rough tire vibration. I'm still glad I changed the shocks, and I did not find wear in the ball joints or bushings. This D21 has had a pretty easy life ...up to now. LOL


 Yeah I installed two sets of Bilsteins and was very pleased with there performance...Now I'm using Tokico Monomax and I'll try KYB gas-a-just next time, since they're geared toward handling.


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## Oldnissanguy (Jan 6, 2005)

I go the cheap route. I watch the Sears adds until they have them for 50% off. They have Monro and some other brands.


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

*UPDATE*

Well, I've got over a thousand miles on the new Bilsteins now and about 250 or so on the new 215/70-14" Michelin Harmonys, and the ride is vastly improved over the way it was when I got it from the PO in May. Oh, and I've got stage one of my audio system completed, and I like it!

However, there is still some harsh rapid vibration transferring up into the steering wheel at any and all road speeds but nearly goes away, or at least turns into a high frequency vibration that's not really so noticeable at highway speeds. I'm thinking maybe time to replace motor mounts and trans mount, but it's just a guess right now. 

BTW, I did remove the drive shaft and the joints are smooth still. The engine is pretty quiet for a K24 and I don't think there's anything abnormal going on there, but I'm open to some other more experienced owner opinions.

TIA,
Roger

94, D21, 2.4 2wd XE, 5-spd


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