# Big brakes for my Sentra....



## TH... (Oct 15, 2003)

*11in Front 10.2 Rear $$$ B13 Brakes*

Has anyone purchased this kit and do you think its a good price? 

For my 91 XE .

900 bones for...
11in sloted/crossed drilled front with 4 piston calipers
10.2in sloted and crossed drilled rear with steel braided brake lines for both front and rear....

Both with brake pads only thing needed is maxima 89-94 rear calipers.

Check it out here.

http://www.fastbrakes.com/products/product.php?partnum=FBN20


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## TH... (Oct 15, 2003)

Anyone, anyone, Buller.... Buller....


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## morepower2 (Apr 19, 2002)

TH... said:


> Has anyone purchased this kit and do you think its a good price?
> 
> For my 91 XE .
> 
> ...


Yes thats an excellent kit.

Mike


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## sno (Oct 4, 2002)

yeah, it's a really nice kit but damn is it expensive. i'd get it if i were usin my car for the track only.


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## TH... (Oct 15, 2003)

sno said:


> yeah, it's a really nice kit but damn is it expensive. i'd get it if i were usin my car for the track only.


I plan on autocrossing, and running it the drag strip.


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## nismo-vzr (Sep 14, 2003)

That's a good price for the whole kit. I have the 11 3/4" and I love it. I put a seatbelt marking accross my friend's chest when he ask me to demontrate on how effective the brake is.


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## sr20racer (Jun 29, 2002)

I would think of upgrading to the NX2000 brakes instead of dropping 1G on brakes.


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## morepower2 (Apr 19, 2002)

sr20racer said:


> I would think of upgrading to the NX2000 brakes instead of dropping 1G on brakes.


NX2000 brakes unless you find them used are about $800 new from Nissan. I would pay the extra 200 and get the Fastbrakes.

Mike


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## sr20racer (Jun 29, 2002)

morepower2 said:


> NX2000 brakes unless you find them used are about $800 new from Nissan. I would pay the extra 200 and get the Fastbrakes.
> 
> Mike


I was thinking of used, and from looking at the thread starters sig I wasn't thinking the big-ass brake upgrade was necessary, but it isn't my car or money.


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## azkicker0027 (May 31, 2002)

so are the ad22vf's also applicable to the b13?? i didn't know, wow.


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## danifilth (May 14, 2003)

azkicker0027 said:


> so are the ad22vf's also applicable to the b13?? i didn't know, wow.[/QUOTE
> 
> ?NX2000 is B13


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## turbo91ser (Apr 30, 2002)

*I would suggest.........*



TH... said:


> I plan on autocrossing, and running it the drag strip.


I would suggest doing the NX2000 brake upgrade along with the Altima master cylinder. Unless you are road racing your car you will never be able to use the Fastbrakes kit to anywhere near it potential.


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## azkicker0027 (May 31, 2002)

wow, i didn't know that the NX's are B13, cool :thumbup:


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## nismo-vzr (Sep 14, 2003)

azkicker0027 said:


> wow, i didn't know that the NX's are B13, cool :thumbup:


Ad22vf is from GTi-r and pusar vz-r which are rnn14 and jn15 respectively.


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## nismo-vzr (Sep 14, 2003)

we spend thousands of dollars to make our cars go faster but we skimp on brake upgrades? I don't understand it. 
I don't know about you guys, but these brakes gives me peace of mind knowing my car has the capabilities to stop on a dime when I need it.


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## TH... (Oct 15, 2003)

turbo91ser said:


> I would suggest doing the NX2000 brake upgrade along with the Altima master cylinder. Unless you are road racing your car you will never be able to use the Fastbrakes kit to anywhere near it potential.


 I also would consider road racing as-well I mean I'm going to have quite a bit of supension mods eventually, so I could consider running it on a real road track its only like 150-300$ in some places for like a two day event for all day and you can run with a bunch of different cars. I would say its worth it if I planed on running it in one a day events so I wouldn't fry any other brakes I'd go to put on there not saying that the NX2000's brakes aren't capable of doing the job but I would like more then less If I can get it.


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## johnand (Apr 30, 2002)

Unless you are road racing, the Fastbrakes kit is WAY overkill. It DOES NOT improve your braking performance on the street. If you can lock up your brakes now on the street, then it won't improve stopping distances at all. Once you lock up the brakes, TIRES are what determines braking ability. If you want better stopping on the street, upgrade you tires. The NX2K brakes are more than adequate for autox and drag racing, just not up to the task of road racing.


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## Adam (Apr 30, 2002)

Does the kit even have everything you need to convert your rear drums to disks? I thought you needed other stuff like SE-R spindles and whatnot.


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## nismo-vzr (Sep 14, 2003)

johnand said:


> Unless you are road racing, the Fastbrakes kit is WAY overkill. It DOES NOT improve your braking performance on the street. If you can lock up your brakes now on the street, then it won't improve stopping distances at all. Once you lock up the brakes, TIRES are what determines braking ability. If you want better stopping on the street, upgrade you tires. The NX2K brakes are more than adequate for autox and drag racing, just not up to the task of road racing.


Nothing against your opinion, but have you tried using the kit either on the track or the street? I'm just like TH, it's better more than less. 
Why did you say it's over kill and it does not improve braking performance?
If Porsche and Ferrari thinks bigger brakes will improve their car's braking ability, then...that's good enough to convince me.


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## morepower2 (Apr 19, 2002)

johnand said:


> Unless you are road racing, the Fastbrakes kit is WAY overkill. It DOES NOT improve your braking performance on the street. If you can lock up your brakes now on the street, then it won't improve stopping distances at all. Once you lock up the brakes, TIRES are what determines braking ability. If you want better stopping on the street, upgrade you tires. The NX2K brakes are more than adequate for autox and drag racing, just not up to the task of road racing.


Bull, it makes a huge difference, stock sentra brakes suck and can bairly lock up the wheels in a 70 mph stop. One 70-zero will fade them to nothing.

Powerful brakes are way easier to threhold brake and modulate as well and will shorten stopping distances greatly. All of my street Sentra's and my race car use Fastbrakes.

Mike


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## TH... (Oct 15, 2003)

nismo-vzr said:


> Nothing against your opinion, but have you tried using the kit either on the track or the street? I'm just like TH, it's better more than less.
> Why did you say it's over kill and it does not improve braking performance?
> If Porsche and Ferrari thinks bigger brakes will improve their car's braking ability, then...that's good enough to convince me.


AND



morepower2 said:


> Bull, it makes a huge difference, stock sentra brakes suck and can bairly lock up the wheels in a 70 mph stop. One 70-zero will fade them to nothing.
> 
> Powerful brakes are way easier to threhold brake and modulate as well and will shorten stopping distances greatly. All of my street Sentra's and my race car use Fastbrakes.
> 
> Mike



Thank you...


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## MaddMatt (Jan 26, 2003)

Tires stop your car. Period, end of story. *IF* you have enough friction between the pad and the rotor to lock em up, the only thing you will accomplish with a bigger brake kit is faster lockup, flat spotted tires, and an emptier wallet.

If you *can't* muster enough friction between the pad and the rotor, then you need to address that issue. Virtually 100% of the time, if you do nothing but street driving, good pads, clean fluid and new OE rotors will *DRAMATICALLY* improve stopping distances as they are replacing worn out parts that aren't working well. I can make your car with OE brakes stop like it has a big kit with the proper friction compound choice.

Brakes for autox: What class would you like to compete in? If you change to Fastbrakes or even NX2000 brakes, forget stock, street prepared, prepared, or STS. You're going straight to the big-dogs in Modified, SM or STX. Good luck with those WRXs and M3s in a 91 XE. 

Price: I don't know where you shop for brake parts, but if you pay $800 for NX brakes I hope they at least bought you dinner first before they f#$ked you like that. I did the front swap with SS lines on my SE-R for ~$300. Calipers were something like $50 each after the core return. They included the frames and pads. Rotors I got for ~$30 each, and the lines were $100something. Find another $50 for AXXIS Ultimates or something like that and you'll have one fade-free head-in-the-dashboard stop after another.

Unless you're doing a track school, I see no need what-so-ever for the Fastbrakes kit. A NX conversion will probably cost ~ the same as replacing all your 13 year old worn out OE parts with new non-worn out OE parts. There's a few more pad choices for the NX brakes vs the OE brake, so that in itself makes the upgrade worth it IMO. Inexpensive, reliable, effective, bolts right on. What's not to like?


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## johnand (Apr 30, 2002)

TH... said:


> AND
> 
> Thank you...


Well, with that reply it sounds like you have already made up you mind to buy the kit.

IMO, I just recommend you do some more reading and reasearch before plunking down $1K on a brake kit.

Thanks Matt for that great reply 

If you want some great technical reading about brakes and how to properly upgrade, check out this site: http://www.stoptech.com/technical/

Matt posted that site in a legendary thread on Altima.net about crossdrilled rotors

And as far as asking if I have experience w/ the Fastbrakes kit, the answer is Yes. My best friend has them on his SE-R and on the street, I can actually stop just as good as him w/ stock SE-R brakes w/ Axxis Ultimate pads. I have driven his car and agree w/ what Matt says, his car doesn't really stop any quicker than mine, just locks up easier. The one advantage I DID notice w/ his Fastbrakes kit, is much easier to modulate the brakes compared to mine.

I just don't want to see someone spend a whole lot of money if not needed.

Now if you are after the kit for the BLING factor, I can't argue that, because they are one cool looking set of brakes


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## MaddMatt (Jan 26, 2003)

No denying the sexy appeal of a big kit 

For the record, yes, I did upgrade my brakes. For fade resistance on track (and better/more pad choices). And my brakes last 50% longer than they did before, so I spend 1/2 as much on pads and rotors as I did before. Well, OK I work for Carbotech, I get that shizzle for free now 

I didn't decrease my braking distances as much as I improved the consistency of the system.


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## sr20racer (Jun 29, 2002)

nismo-vzr said:


> If Porsche and Ferrari thinks bigger brakes will improve their car's braking ability, then...that's good enough to convince me.


Yeah but this is a 1.6 130hp Sentra not a 400hp sportscar.


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## morepower2 (Apr 19, 2002)

MaddMatt said:


> Tires stop your car. Period, end of story. *IF* you have enough friction between the pad and the rotor to lock em up, the only thing you will accomplish with a bigger brake kit is faster lockup, flat spotted tires, and an emptier wallet.
> 
> If you *can't* muster enough friction between the pad and the rotor, then you need to address that issue. Virtually 100% of the time, if you do nothing but street driving, good pads, clean fluid and new OE rotors will *DRAMATICALLY* improve stopping distances as they are replacing worn out parts that aren't working well. I can make your car with OE brakes stop like it has a big kit with the proper friction compound choice.
> 
> ...


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## morepower2 (Apr 19, 2002)

sr20racer said:


> Yeah but this is a 1.6 130hp Sentra not a 400hp sportscar.


The brakes on our 1.6 liter 200SX project car were very inadiquate even with only 120 whp.

Mike


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## microsweper (Jun 30, 2003)

from what i gather from what ive read from this post and many others is that if your lookin for an effective yet cheap brake upgrade the nx is the way to go unless your tottaly into auto x. unfortunatly there is a lack of information on what they are from and where they can be aquired from new and used. could any one point me in the right direction. sorta newb so keep it simple plz


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/august01/brake.shtml

The article mentions SMC for rotors, they are no longer in business. however, PowerSlot now makes NX2000 rotors.

or

http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/february03/b12_brakes/

or

http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/march01/nx2000_b13_brakes.shtml


or Fastbrakes

http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/november02/fastbrakes/

http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/september02/projectsentraser/

http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/october02/project_serturbo/

Be amazed at what you can find with a couple minutes of searching...

I've had everything from 1.6 brakes, se-r brakes, nx2000 brakes, and fastbrakes... anyone that says the 1.6 or se-r brakes stop just as good as Fastbrakes obviously has never driven very much with cars equipped with the different setups.. It's laughable to think the tiny stock sentra brakes are as good as a big brake kit... One post mentioned he stopped just as good, did you measure stopping distances?... okay for sake of argument I'll give you the first stop,,, but how'bout the second and third stops??.. Stock sentra brakes are scary for any type of performance, heck even two hard stops on the freeway will make you yank then out for something bigger.... 

NX2000 (ad22vf) upgrade is a great upgrade.. Mike's quote of $800 is probably for New Nissan Genuine parts, not rebuilds. 

http://www.courtesyparts.com/Mercha...n=PROD&Store_Code=CP&Product_Code=99995-B13KT


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## nismo-vzr (Sep 14, 2003)

sr20racer said:


> Yeah but this is a 1.6 130hp Sentra not a 400hp sportscar.


Yeah, let's try this. Suzuki gsxr 599cc/100+bhp has twin 300mm disc 4 piston calipers for the front and 200mm disc dual opposed piston for the rear. Its dry wieght is 354.9 lbs. Overkill?


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

nismo-vzr said:


> Yeah, let's try this. Suzuki gsxr 599cc/100+bhp has twin 300mm disc 4 piston calipers for the front and 200mm disc dual opposed piston for the rear. Its dry wieght is 354.9 lbs. Overkill?


yeah, haha 

350 lbs.. you should just be able to stop Fred Flintstone style...  ..right... it's all in the tires..


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## nismo-vzr (Sep 14, 2003)

myoung said:


> yeah, haha
> 
> 350 lbs.. you should just be able to stop Fred Flintstone style...  ..right... it's all in the tires..


LOL. That's a good one.


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## sr20racer (Jun 29, 2002)

nismo-vzr said:


> Yeah, let's try this. Suzuki gsxr 599cc/100+bhp has twin 300mm disc 4 piston calipers for the front and 200mm disc dual opposed piston for the rear. Its dry wieght is 354.9 lbs. Overkill?


Well shit then, maybe I will put a $1100 brake upgrade on my girlfriends 100hp Civic HX.  That's not overkill right? You made me see the light.


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

sr20racer said:


> Well shit then, maybe I will put a $1100 brake upgrade on my girlfriends 100hp Civic HX.  That's not overkill right? You made me see the light.


Pretty sure that's not the point he was trying to make.....and I'm pretty sure you know that... 

But then again, If your girlfriend plans on doing any performance driving then yeah I would, if you care about her..lol


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

MaddMatt said:


> Tires stop your car. Period, end of story. *IF* you have enough friction between the pad and the rotor to lock em up, the only thing you will accomplish with a bigger brake kit is faster lockup, flat spotted tires, and an emptier wallet.


I'm pretty sure the object is to NOT lock your brakes up.. but hey stop or slow down however you like..


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## sr20racer (Jun 29, 2002)

Yeah, I was just kidding. :fluffy:


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

sr20racer said:


> Yeah, I was just kidding. :fluffy:



hahaha I know.... I was going to ask you why you would have a girlfriend that drives a Civic in the first place  ....haha


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## MaddMatt (Jan 26, 2003)

I know the point is to not lock the brakes. My point in that statement was "if you can lock up the brakes, what will you achieve with a larger system?" I really liked the GRM article ~ 2 years ago when they put a Dynalite system on Miata and measured 10 consecutive stops from 50 mph. With the Dynalites, the car required an average of 5-6 *more* feet/stop. 

Nevermind. Go spend $1100 on a kit for street driving. I still say you should decide which auto-x class you want to compete in before you do anything, and see what mods are allowed.

And if anyone happens to be in western NC and wants to see how well a car with OE Nissan brakes can stop, look me up. But what do I know....

L8R

Edit: since someone asked for NX part sources, here's where I got mine:
- www.carparts.com. I got the loaded Wagner calipers which include the mounting bracket. I've been told A1 Cardone calipers come with the bracket as well.
- www.brakeco.com. I got cheap NX rotors from them.


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## morepower2 (Apr 19, 2002)

MaddMatt said:


> I know the point is to not lock the brakes. My point in that statement was "if you can lock up the brakes, what will you achieve with a larger system?" I really liked the GRM article ~ 2 years ago when they put a Dynalite system on Miata and measured 10 consecutive stops from 50 mph. With the Dynalites, the car required an average of 5-6 *more* feet/stop.
> 
> Nevermind. Go spend $1100 on a kit for street driving. I still say you should decide which auto-x class you want to compete in before you do anything, and see what mods are allowed.
> 
> ...


OEM brakes are designed for OEM tires coeffecent of adhesion. When you go to bigger stickier tires, especialy the kinds of tires you get nowdays, you are hard pressed to keep any streetable setup from fading when you drive hard like on the track even for casual lapping. I don't condone fast street driving like canyon running but I can see it happening there also.

In the old days even a few years ago with the first generation of R compound tires, brake fade was easy to avoid but now its hard to keep it at bay with a streetable compound with sticky tires. An Azenis, SO3 or S02 or KD's grip better than AOO8S's did. With R-Compound tires forget it, you have to run an aggresive race pad if your car is capable.

Sure you can go pretty fast with NX brakes but its easier to drive hard with the fastbrakes. I have raced Showroom stock on stock SE-R brakes, and run NX brakes in IMSA and SE-R Cup. Now that SE-R Cup allows the fastbrakes 11" setup I can vouch how much better it is than the NX and how much cheaper it is to run it.

For instance my turbocharged project Phoenix street car easily fades its 11.7" fastbrakes system with streetable pads! I installed your pads Matt and am eager to find out what it does.

My main point is that the fastbrakes kit is not that expensive and is cheaper to run in the long run if you are in a sitiuation where you need to consider upgrading the brakes to begin with. The other point is if you upgrade NX brakes enough so they won't fade on the track or fast driving, they are not very streetable.

Mike


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

MaddMatt said:


> Well, OK I work for Carbotech, I get that shizzle for free now
> 
> .


I was pretty confident that you didn't work for Fastbrakes....


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## MaddMatt (Jan 26, 2003)

> The other point is if you upgrade NX brakes enough so they won't fade on the track or fast driving, they are not very streetable.


It's all in the compound choice, Mike 




> I installed your pads Matt and am eager to find out what it does.


WOW! That was like 6-8 months ago. I figured you had burned through them by now. Let me know how you like them.

In any event, the original poster never said anythign about taking this car to the race track, just auto-x and drag race. I still think he should decide which class he wants to compete in and look at the rules. Stock class allows no brake mods other than pads and SS lines (depending on model year). Street prepared is pretty much the same way, and in that class you want to run the smallest diameter wheel (I'm thinking 13" for him) anyway, so upgrading to either NX or Fastbrakes would not only render the car illegal, but uncompetetive in class. Wheel size is essentially unrestricted in street prepared, and there's a reason all national championship street prepared cars run on the smallest diameter wheel possible (rotational mass). The Fastbrakes kit would put him in classes like STX and SM where *THE* car to beat is either a WRX or an E36 M3. With a 91 XE, he'll be bringing a knife to a gun fight.


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## TH... (Oct 15, 2003)

*Orignal poster..... Hmm, thats me...*



MaddMatt said:


> In any event, the original poster never said anythign about taking this car to the race track, just auto-x and drag race. I still think he should decide which class he wants to compete in and look at the rules. Stock class allows no brake mods other than pads and SS lines (depending on model year). Street prepared is pretty much the same way, and in that class you want to run the smallest diameter wheel (I'm thinking 13" for him) anyway, so upgrading to either NX or Fastbrakes would not only render the car illegal, but uncompetetive in class. Wheel size is essentially unrestricted in street prepared, and there's a reason all national championship street prepared cars run on the smallest diameter wheel possible (rotational mass). The Fastbrakes kit would put him in classes like STX and SM where *THE* car to beat is either a WRX or an E36 M3. With a 91 XE, he'll be bringing a knife to a gun fight.


I didn't say this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sno
yeah, it's a really nice kit but damn is it expensive. i'd get it if i were usin my car for the track only. 




TH... said:


> I plan on autocrossing, and running it the drag strip.


or this

Originally Posted by turbo91ser
I would suggest doing the NX2000 brake upgrade along with the Altima master cylinder. Unless you are road racing your car you will never be able to use the Fastbrakes kit to anywhere near it potential. 




TH... said:


> I also would consider road racing as-well I mean I'm going to have quite a bit of supension mods eventually, so I could consider running it on a real road track its only like 150-300$ in some places for like a two day event for all day and you can run with a bunch of different cars. I would say its worth it if I planed on running it in one a day events so I wouldn't fry any other brakes I'd go to put on there not saying that the NX2000's brakes aren't capable of doing the job but I would like more then less If I can get it..


So, I don't think you realize that in the future I plan to make this my race, autocross, and drag car with a little bit of everything for every area I enjoy, I might intend on doing one of them more then often but its nice to know I have the braking power and or longevity for a competiton. That might help you under understand that Its not like I just want to take them out on the street for looks and overkill I plan to actually put them use to some use somewhere.

I'm still not sure if I'm doing the FB or NX2000 kit I just put up this thread in hope to hear voices from others, which we already estabished to see what was thought doing such a "Big Brake Upgrade" for my 1.6L XE sentra that I enjoy modifying to my liking.

P.S.



MaddMatt said:


> The Fastbrakes kit would put him in classes like STX and SM where *THE* car to beat is either a WRX or an E36 M3. With a 91 XE, he'll be bringing a knife to a gun fight.


I worked for BMW I know how they perform and I've driven all of the models. I only want to take my car to events to have fun with smile on my face when some body comes up to greet me on such a nice set up on my classic SE-R when my return response would be its the XE and it has the 1.6L motor in it I've just done alot to bring the little motor alive. The look on peoples faces when they hear that my car is the 1.6 and not the glorious infamous SR20 2.0l motor is alot more gradifing for me. Not to say that I don't like the SE-R's because I do I hope to own one myself one day possibly. 

For the record at my local 1/8th mile track here in Jacksonville,FL I raced a guy in a WRX and took him the hole way down the track, now underline the fact he couldn't launch his car for s**t helps me. To say that I did it and all my friends watched me from the bleachers beat him was nice enough. It also goes to show which I'm sure we all know " Its not always the car, its the driver that makes the car". 

Thanks, for all posts sorry I was'nt there for the extra confo.

TH......


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## TH... (Oct 15, 2003)

Bump...


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## TH... (Oct 15, 2003)

MaddMatt, do you have anything to say?


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## bigchu420 (Feb 24, 2004)

*Parts list*

What parts would I need to do the NX2000 brake upgrade for my 93 B13 XE? I would like to change all four corners since I have the disc/drum setup now.


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## danifilth (May 14, 2003)

master cylinder,spindles,brake rotors,brake pads,brake calipers,emergency brake lines,brake lines.I think thats it.


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