# 8" or 10" Subs. Difference?



## fast_kozak (May 18, 2007)

Hey,

Besides the obvious SIZE difference, is there a noticeable difference between the 2 subs?
I have the stock RF package with the 8" sub enclosed in my trunk, and I'm wondering if poping-in an aftermarket sub, like JBL for example, will make more of a difference, instead of trying to make a 10" fit in there. The box is already made for the 8", that's the only reason why I'm concidering it. 
Any suggestions, opinions, personal experiences? All would help.


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## theubergeek (May 6, 2007)

fast_kozak said:


> Hey,
> 
> Besides the obvious SIZE difference, is there a noticeable difference between the 2 subs?
> I have the stock RF package with the 8" sub enclosed in my trunk, and I'm wondering if poping-in an aftermarket sub, like JBL for example, will make more of a difference, instead of trying to make a 10" fit in there. The box is already made for the 8", that's the only reason why I'm concidering it.
> Any suggestions, opinions, personal experiences? All would help.


the main diff is the power in the subs.. the other is hrtz range.. the 10 would be better but maby in another box.. if u can get a bigger box and bigger amp it would push the walue in the whole package.. me i like oone 12 for the just enuff sound package..


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## fast_kozak (May 18, 2007)

theubergeek said:


> the main diff is the power in the subs.. the other is hrtz range.. the 10 would be better but maby in another box.. if u can get a bigger box and bigger amp it would push the walue in the whole package.. me i like oone 12 for the just enuff sound package..



Thanks for your input. Why do you recommend another box? You don't think that the stock box would be good enough?


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## theubergeek (May 6, 2007)

the main point is the box is made for the RF 8".. but going to a bigget box/sub that are matched for each other it would sound great.. i love image dynamics subs .. love em.. Untitled Document for a good quality dont run a cheap sub/ box//


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## fast_kozak (May 18, 2007)

theubergeek said:


> the main point is the box is made for the RF 8".. but going to a bigget box/sub that are matched for each other it would sound great.. i love image dynamics subs .. love em.. Untitled Document for a good quality dont run a cheap sub/ box//



And what would happen if I stuck a 10" into the 8"box?


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## Tavel (Aug 21, 2004)

the main difference: the bigger the speaker, the less accurate the sound produced...

You'll probably want to go with the 10" because they'll have a clean frequency response (unlike 12's), but will still have enough power to thump down the street. It's a good compromise between accuracy and volume. 

of course, if you wanted REALLY clear sound and don't care about rattling your trunk lid off, you should get the 8's. 


Now, since you're replacing stock subs, I'd have to recommend neither. You're not going to hear any improvement over stock unless you build a new box, mount it differently, and give it a new amp. The speaker itself doesn't matter so much as the mounting/enclosure. properly mounted stock speakers can sound better than improperly mounted $300 after market speakers. (proper mounting = fiberglass mounts and dynamat on the door skin. NOT the adapter brackets that almost every install place uses!).


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## fast_kozak (May 18, 2007)

I don't think I was clear, and that was an error on my part. I'm replacing everything from tweeters to sub, and adding an amp and deck. My setup will be like so:

Component System in the front (tweeters replacing stock in the pillars)
3 Ways in the rear
4-Channel Amp + (8 or 10... still debating) Sub.

So knowing this, what should I do with the sub situation?


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## Tavel (Aug 21, 2004)

fast_kozak said:


> I don't think I was clear, and that was an error on my part. I'm replacing everything from tweeters to sub, and adding an amp and deck. My setup will be like so:
> 
> Component System in the front (tweeters replacing stock in the pillars)
> 3 Ways in the rear
> ...


You'll get a good improvement from all of that, so maybe just put all of those goodies in and see how it sounds. You might like it even with the stock subs. (save some cash)

Otherwise, I'd go with the 10's. The 3 ways in the back will cover the lower mid-range and upper bass, so all you need is the low end bass from a sub. Make sure you get crossovers though, nothing sounds as crappy as a 10" sub trying to hit tweeter range :loser:


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## fast_kozak (May 18, 2007)

Tavel said:


> You'll get a good improvement from all of that, so maybe just put all of those goodies in and see how it sounds. You might like it even with the stock subs. (save some cash)
> 
> Otherwise, I'd go with the 10's. The 3 ways in the back will cover the lower mid-range and upper bass, so all you need is the low end bass from a sub. Make sure you get crossovers though, nothing sounds as crappy as a 10" sub trying to hit tweeter range :loser:



Don't the crossovers come with the component set? Or I'd have to get ANOTHER crossover unit?

And what about my enlosure? You think I can keep the stock RF one and put in a shallow 10" from the RF Punch Series?


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## Tavel (Aug 21, 2004)

fast_kozak said:


> Don't the crossovers come with the component set? Or I'd have to get ANOTHER crossover unit?
> 
> And what about my enlosure? You think I can keep the stock RF one and put in a shallow 10" from the RF Punch Series?


the crossovers that come with the component set are for just those components (so the woofer isn't trying to hit tweeter range, and the tweeter isn't trying to hit woofer range.) 

You'll need another set to separate the sub range from the mid/highs so the subs can work efficiently. 

You might be able to physically fit the 10" into the 8" enclosure, but the acoustics will be all goofy and it'll probably sound worse. 

If you're trying to leave the stock enclosure then I would also just leave the stock sub. an after market sub of the same size isn't going to sound notably different. 

I know you're thinking "UPGRADES! I NEED UPGRADES", but sometimes you really don't need to upgrade. I've even seen people "upgrade" their audio and it ended up sounding worse...but you'd die of starvation before you could convince _them_ of that. 

That's why I'm recommending you put the system in bit by bit to see how each component changes the sound, you might hit a nice sound without changing a whole lot (or spending a whole lot of money). 

(I just bought a 2000 corolla and I'm replacing the front speakers with some bigger 6 1/2" (stock is 5 1/4"), and i'm replacing the rear speakers with a 10" sub (or two). But I'm leaving the stock HU...and it will sound excellent. )


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## fast_kozak (May 18, 2007)

I totally agree with you.

I just installed a HU today, and not only did the installation kit not match (I bought it offline from cardomain), and it doesn't fit flush so at night I'm getting a line of white light from the bottom of the faceplate, and now my ipod aux input isn't accessible.
I wanted to use the HU because my GF bought it for me. I don't want to insult her by not using it, but it's not working right now. 
And I find the sound got different. It's more powerful, but I think I'm going to need to change speakers as well.


You're the second person I'm hearing about that wants to replace the rear speakers with the subs. Don't you believe the sound will be different, with nothing comming from behind you?

Also, for my enclosure, I think I'll need a custom one. Because cargo space IS important to me, I'll need to get something fiberglassed. Got any recomendations/suggestions?

By the way, thanks for all the imput.


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## SHIFTVAX (Jan 15, 2006)

Since the sub enclosure does affect the way your system sounds I wouln't use that factory crap anyway even though it say RF!


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## Sentrixx (Apr 30, 2002)

Personally.... If your going to do subs you need to check out this company. 

http://www.edesignaudio.com/us.php

They make some really bad ass subs and they have a new 10" speaker that takes up no space what so ever. It's called the sq10 and it's gotten some sweet ass rateings.

As for my self... I bought there 4 of there Eu-700's. Which are a 6.5" sub/mid. And WOW


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## Tavel (Aug 21, 2004)

fast_kozak said:


> I totally agree with you.
> 
> I just installed a HU today, and not only did the installation kit not match (I bought it offline from cardomain), and it doesn't fit flush so at night I'm getting a line of white light from the bottom of the faceplate, and now my ipod aux input isn't accessible.
> I wanted to use the HU because my GF bought it for me. I don't want to insult her by not using it, but it's not working right now.
> ...



Well hey, if your girly gave it to you then definitely use it. You didn't spend any money on it and it'll be a constant reminder of you sweetheart's love. 


the new HU probably is more powerful because it has a better internal amplifier than stock. You'll just need to play with the balance and levels to get it to sound right. 

As for rear speakers: Yes, the sound will be different...it will be better. You can't hear if a sound is coming from behind or in front of you, so you won't notice a difference that way. But the rear speakers hit your ears out of phase and pretty distorted by the trip through the cabin and because your ears face the wrong way. In a simple description, rear speakers sound muffled. Not good. 

If you need evidence, turn the fader toward the front. Sometimes it takes a few days to get used to it, but then you'll have an epiphany and wonder why in the world you used back speakers for so long. Be honest though, the fronts don't carry the lows as well, so it will sound a little empty unless you get that back. 

I implore anyone to try this with an open mind. If you're looking to shoot me down you'll only ever hear evidence to support that. 


Subs aren't effected as much because those low sounds carry more energy and are less prone to distortion. 

People aiming for bragging rights have rear speakers, people aiming for excellent quality don't have rear speakers. Some head units do have phase correction for individual speakers, but that can be difficult to tune and doesn't solve the problem of distortion and muffling. 

I just didn't want to say anything because I figured you already had the speakers and I didn't want to rain on your parade. I hate when people do that. 



Onto custom enclosures...well that's a whole new can of worms that I'm not qualified to advise on. Sorry. 

I have audiophile friends so I can learn from their mistakes without spending any of those wads of cash. :idhitit:


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## fast_kozak (May 18, 2007)

First let me say I really appreciate the time you're taking to reply.

Over the past couple of days, I've come to enjoy the head unit. Although still looking tacky, I placed electrical tape over the holes where the orange light shone through, so now I'm not so dissapointed.

Ok. On to replying.

I've also come to terms with a solution for sound and dollar value that will be better suited for me. As opposed to that whole setup I was thinking, I just going to allow my HU to power all speakers in the cab, and get a mono amp for my 10" in the back. Once I get prices for custom enclosure work, I'll decide bewteen box and custom.

Pictures will get posted soon, to show what I was talking about and what I've been able to accomplish. But I've also decided on keeping 3-ways for the back, to carry the low's to mids, and I'll use my components to do everything. 

Any comments on this?


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## Sentrixx (Apr 30, 2002)

Do not use any rear speakers unless they are subs... Keep your front stage and make sure they are good separates. Don't go comp on the front. you want some nice highs up near you.


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## fast_kozak (May 18, 2007)

Sentrixx said:


> Do not use any rear speakers unless they are subs... Keep your front stage and make sure they are good separates. Don't go comp on the front. you want some nice highs up near you.


In your opinion, why not have the 3-ways in the rear, and why not use the component speakers in the front? I haven't been challenged on this type of setup as of yet.


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## theubergeek (May 6, 2007)

i run componets in the front and rear..but i am building a set of "kickpannles" for the back on the sides for more.. but i just got board and wanted to do it


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## Tavel (Aug 21, 2004)

fast_kozak said:


> In your opinion, why not have the 3-ways in the rear, and why not use the component speakers in the front? I haven't been challenged on this type of setup as of yet.


I think he's saying don't put coaxial components in the front (tweeter and woofer on the same basket), and use seperate components instead. 

I'd have to say that's probably a matter of personal preference as I've always been very happy with the sound from the coax components. Plus, the sound is probably a little more consistent if it's all coming from the same place...just a thought. 

We're recommending against 3-ways in the rear because we simply recommend against rear speakers.


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## fast_kozak (May 18, 2007)

But doesn't NOT having rear speakers affect surround sound effect"? I mean, if the 3-ways are just for mid to lows, wouldn't that be ideal?

For my component speakers, I'm going to the put the 6 1/2 in the door, and the tweeters in the pillar, replacing the stock ones.

If i remove the rear speakers, and just have components in the front and a 10" in the back, won't I be missing something?

Is there a reason you recommend against rear speakers, or is it just a biased opinion from personal preference?


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## SHIFTVAX (Jan 15, 2006)

I never heard of just a component sub minus rear deck speakers! Thats intresting I wouldnt do it though.


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## Tavel (Aug 21, 2004)

fast_kozak said:


> But doesn't NOT having rear speakers affect surround sound effect"? I mean, if the 3-ways are just for mid to lows, wouldn't that be ideal?
> 
> For my component speakers, I'm going to the put the 6 1/2 in the door, and the tweeters in the pillar, replacing the stock ones.
> 
> ...


i already explained it (on the first page). I guess it is an "opinion", but I think it holds a little more validity than any random opinion. At least it's easy to try for yourself, just flip the fader to the front for a few days and see how it sounds. 

you might like it, might not...but I'm betting you will. Don't think that having rear speakers is right just because "everyone does it"...i can think of a lot of examples where common wisdom fails. Digital cameras for instance, people think megapixels are everything when it's actually probably the least important part.


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## SHIFTVAX (Jan 15, 2006)

OK I got you!


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