# People being jerks about searching



## dono200sx (May 2, 2002)

*Getting on soapbox*
Has this started to piss anyone else off? I'm getting sick of reading people getting up tight about people asking questions. It is getting to the point where I am being pushed away from coming back to the forums. If it weren't for all the information here, I would have left. 

*Example:* "If you had searched this forum and SR20DEFORUMS, you would have found 35 mm to 40 mm."

I understand the importance of searching. I always search before I ask a question. I didn't find the answer I was looking for, so I asked. I know that many questions asked are repeated, and for those I can see the need for pointing out that people can search and find answers to most of their question. But... what the hell is up with people being such dicks about people searching? Most people are just rude about it. You know... It's not always easy to find little details like that. If you have such a problem with people asking questions, then get over it and move on. There is no one FORCING you to read that post or answer. That is the whole point of the forum! 

I don't mean to sound ungreatful for those who help out people on the forums, b/c I'm not. I have learned quite a bit through the forums and through the various web sites. I spend the greater portion of my day reading about nissans. 

Loosen up people... we're all friends here... I'm sorry for the gripe, but I felt this needed to be expressed. I'm not normally one to start something like this. But it needed to be said, so here it is. Maybe I'm being over-sensitive, maybe not. 

OK. I'm off the soap box. Anyone else want a turn?

BTW, bahearn, that quote was not an attack on you. That was just the first thing that came to mind when I made this thread. I 
*do not* mean for that to insult you in any way.


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## dono200sx (May 2, 2002)

Sorry. This was meant for the General forum. Could a moderator move it there? Thanks!

Done deal. Pat


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## dono200sx (May 2, 2002)

Thanks Pat!


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## PatScottAKA99XE (Apr 30, 2002)

Well I can not speak for everyone, but think that most of these repeat quetions come from lazy members(not to single anyone out). I think any time a member wants to post something they should do a search first. I am probly quilty of repeating something, but I do use the search option a lot. Its just a waste of space to repeat something and it make unessary work for admins.


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## dono200sx (May 2, 2002)

I agree. People should search before asking a question. It wastes time, and like you said space. What pisses me off is how rude people are about it...


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## BORNGEARHEAD (Apr 30, 2002)

Thank you for addressing this issue. I do search and rarely ask the same questions but for those people who are new and don't quite know what there doing on here or those people who aren't checking the forum daily like a lot of us do, it is rude and insulting. I think people should lighten up and just help out for the answer. A lot of times I notice they don't even answer the question, they just give some smart ass comment.


Be nice!


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## PatScottAKA99XE (Apr 30, 2002)

Very true,
There is no reason that anyone should be rude about it. The way I look at it. If you have time to think up a smart-ass remark just to post it, you should use that time and brain power to do the search for the person and put the tread link(s) in your post instead. 

http://www.nissanforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3520 

See how hard was that(I know, shameless plug for my own car).


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## bahearn (Jul 15, 2002)

I'm not a jerk, nor a dick, but I am a curmudgeon.

I've been on the SE-R mailing list for over 4 years and just recently starting visiting this board and SR20DE FORUMS. I am SO SICK AND TIRED of seeing the same old questions every freaking day. Almost every day, someone responds "SEARCH!" and does it do any good? If it weren't for the good information here, I would have left, too.

I'm much more amenable to answering civilly when it's mentioned that a search failed. If this old man can search first, then you young pups can certainly do the same.

And, yes, dono200sx, I took it personally. I'm so mad at you that I'm going to...to...to CHANGE ALL THE AIR IN YOUR TIRES! Hah! Take that! Keep a wary eye out or you find all the valve stem caps switch around on your wheels. I might swap your wiper blades. I might fill your mailbox with air. If you find a burning paper bag on your porch, be sure to STOMP IT OUT and pay no attention to what's inside the bag.

One more thing: I'm smilie impaired. I hate those things.


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

Can somebody help me with my timing....

sorry for the sarcasm....


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## dono200sx (May 2, 2002)

bahearn said:


> *
> And, yes, dono200sx, I took it personally. I'm so mad at you that I'm going to...to...to CHANGE ALL THE AIR IN YOUR TIRES! Hah! Take that! Keep a wary eye out or you find all the valve stem caps switch around on your wheels. I might swap your wiper blades. I might fill your mailbox with air. If you find a burning paper bag on your porch, be sure to STOMP IT OUT and pay no attention to what's inside the bag.*


Like I said, I did not use your quote to flame you. I had no intention to insult you in any way. If you did take offense, then you have my apologies. But let one thing be said. I hope that was a sarcastic remark. If it wasn't and I find you anywhere near my car, I will be promptly pressing charges and if that doesn't work, I'm going after you and your car. I don't take too kindly to people threatening me, my family, of my car. 'Nuf said about assholes....

I agree. People should search before asking a question. But being rude and arrogant isn't going to get us anywhere. I personally don't have a solution for this, but I'm sure someone can come up with something. I don't think that suspending posting rights for a couple weeks is the answer. If someone is having a problem and needs an immediate response and they just signed up they should be able to post. Anyone got an idea to solving the problem?


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## PatScottAKA99XE (Apr 30, 2002)

Easy, bahearn.
Us mods and admins have been talking about ways to solve the very problems you have mentioned. We are working hard to make these boards better for everyone. Recently we have been talking about cosmetic only sections so that us tech geeks can skip through all of that. I am trying to get a "harcore" tech section for disscusing topics at an almost engineering level. Please remember that this site is still young. We will have growing pains along the way.


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## sentra94xe (May 6, 2002)

PatScottAKA99XE said:


> *Easy, bahearn. Us mods and admins have been talking about ways to solve the very problems you have mentioned. <snip>*



Well put, Pat. Since this BB is young there will be a significant amount of ups and downs throughout its growth. We mods and admins are doing our best to make this board easy to navigate and informative. It'll take some time for the bugs to be worked out, but besides some small issues I personally feel it is looking pretty damn good so far. I plan on stickin' around for awhile.


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## Guest (Aug 15, 2002)

What's funny to me is *and it's not directly related to this board...it's all boards really*, that when you ask a question that's been asked alot of times. People wanna flame you right? Ok...well...in the amount of time it took you to write whatever "flame" you write...you could have answered his/her question instead. Helping the guy out and hey, you probably got a new friend. There are polite ways of answering a question and letting someone know that it's been asked before. Just my two.


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## Sentra GTR-1 (Aug 2, 2002)

*bottom line*

Bottom line sentra brothers.......if you have a question to ask......ask it......search or no search thats what a forum is for. (not to be rude, but those that dont like it......tuff...deal with it)


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## Guest (Aug 15, 2002)

Sentra! SENTRA!!! I do NOT own a POS SENTRA!! I have the almighty ALTIMA...pay me HOMAGE peasants!   

Seriously tho...just ask the question.  


I'm just jealous cuz my car can't fit the SR20DET ...so pay me no mind....


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## Scott (Apr 15, 2002)

*Bottom line:*

(And this represents the opinion of the admins and moderators)

Questions are fine. However, what we're trying to avoid are questions pertaining to readily available information. Some of this stuff has been rehashed, discussed in great detail, or even been written about on the pages of SE-R.net, Sentra.net, NissanPerformanceMag.com, or any other number of sites & forums.

So what we're asking is for people to do a bit of reading first, then ask questions. Posts such as "how do I advance my timing?" have been covered already, but if you happen to read the available info first you'll be to ask more intelligent and detailed questions. Assuming you still have any questions at all. For people to post the same questions continually just makes the forums less useful for all.


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## bahearn (Jul 15, 2002)

Man, you people sure have your panties in a wad.

I did NOT take umbrage at being chastised for not sugar-coating my initial reponse to search first.

If any of you took my absurd actions as reasonable, then I need to leave you sociopaths before some gets hurt, namely me. As I said, I hate smilies. That doesn't mean I don't like humor, satire or facetiousness. I liberally applied all of those to my last post. "Fll your mailbox with air" and "change the air in your tires". Good grief, some threat.

Geez, loosen up.


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

you know what pisses me off, ppl that ask stupid questions that haven't even bothered to think themselves. sure the info is available, and I know it's confusing... but ask the questions AFTER you have attempted to figure it out... I mean the timing thing, it's not the hardest thing in the world... and that's not the only issue, the TURBO AUTOMATIC transmission issue is getting old too, I'm just tired of stupid questions that get asked over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over....


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## dono200sx (May 2, 2002)

I agree that people should research something before they post a question about it. Like was mentioned, that lead to more inteligent questions. Something that does for the rest of us is helps us learn also from those questions. It's that forward motion of learning that we all need. But the problem still lays in how do we get people to do that? I still haven't thought of anything.


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

can't we put some sort of screening page in when you're inserting a new thread? Like it asks them what the thread is about (like a list and you check which topic it is about), and if it is one that can be covered in NPM or search, it can direct them to an automated message... just something that automatically informs the non-searching ppl to use search and allow room to delete nonsensical threads.


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## sentra94xe (May 6, 2002)

James said:


> *can't we put some sort of screening page in when you're inserting a new thread? Like it asks them what the thread is about (like a list and you check which topic it is about), and if it is one that can be covered in NPM or search, it can direct them to an automated message... just something that automatically informs the non-searching ppl to use search and allow room to delete nonsensical threads. *



This idea seems reasonable, just might be more than necessary. I'm not Scott or Ryan so I don't know how much space on the server a screening page like this would take up. But that's not the main concern here. It's about figuring a way to best inform our members. Since this thread is still very active, this topic appears to be of great concern to all members, including moderators and administrators. I'll make sure this topic gets to the higher powers and we'll see what we can do.


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## Scott (Apr 15, 2002)

Screening pages might sound like a good idea, but in practice it's not really that feasible. It would require rewriting portions of the forums software and just make posting threads more of a hassle for everyone. There are a couple options available that I've considered:


Prevent new members from posting messages or new threads for xx days after subscribing
Send new members automatic private messages containing info on how to use the forums

But that doesn't address the issue that there are already nearly 2000 members and it's not just new subscribers posting the repeat questions. I think it's just going to fall to the moderators to keep things in check.


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

If the screening page is that difficult then just throw it out. I like your first suggestion but sometimes ppl sign up just to throw a single question out and after it's answered never return... i think they'd be discouraged to frequent the site. The second suggestion might be our best bet but I thought that we already did that? 

Maybe we can make it so that the first page they see when ppl sign up is a list of sources so they can read up themselves (namely sentra.net)...


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## dono200sx (May 2, 2002)

James said:


> *Maybe we can make it so that the first page they see when ppl sign up is a list of sources so they can read up themselves (namely sentra.net)... *


That just might be the ticket. I think it would be worth while to send that list in the form of private messages also. That way it is repeated. 

I thought of something while I was at lunch a few minutes ago. Is there a better way to make those stickies more noticeable? Even though they are always at the top, for those of us with large screens especially, they seem to blend in with the rest. If they kind of stood out, people would notice them better. Maybe like making the titles, etc. *bold* would help differentiate them from the rest. Also maybe that type of sticky at the top of each forum asking that a subject be researched before a post is made.


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## Seva (Jul 10, 2002)

I remember on b15sentra.net forums the most commons sight would be a post from a member with 1 or 2 posts to his name asking if they make altezzas for sentras;-)


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## Seva (Jul 10, 2002)

GlowstickBoy said:


> *Sentra! SENTRA!!! I do NOT own a POS SENTRA!! *


*OH NO YOU DIDN'T!!!*

















just kidding;-)


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## ihateloops (Jun 23, 2002)

its not just people not using the search button to find stuff that gets to me, its when they dont even browse through the rest of the threads in the section where they post, and then post a question that is already asked two threads down. some of the people on here are seriously far too lazy.


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## Black200SXSER (Apr 30, 2002)

I think people need to quit whining...the moderators are there to keep things in check..quit complaining about it

If you do your part, the forum will grow..if everyone self moderates, it will be civil, and full of knowledge. 

Take responsibility for yourself.


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## dono200sx (May 2, 2002)

Black200SXSER said:


> *I think people need to quit whining...the moderators are there to keep things in check..quit complaining about it
> 
> If you do your part, the forum will grow..if everyone self moderates, it will be civil, and full of knowledge.
> 
> Take responsibility for yourself.  *


That is absolutely true. But how to we get people to that point? I would love to see this forum grow even more... it's already huge. We just have this one hurdle to pass at this point. I don't think it would be too hard for everyone to put in a little more effort to improve the forums.


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## hagasan (Aug 5, 2002)

...Ya know...that's what the forum is for...exchanging info...just thought I'd point out the obvious. Don't like...don't respond...EASY..


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## Black200SXSER (Apr 30, 2002)

for sharing info...not 30,000,000,000 times....


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## PatScottAKA99XE (Apr 30, 2002)

Black200SXSER said:


> *for sharing info...not 30,000,000,000 times.... *


Aint that the truth.
BTW Brad, Fix yo sig or Im gonna moderate yo A$$. LOL


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## Black200SXSER (Apr 30, 2002)

I didnt see it got broken..?


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## hagasan (Aug 5, 2002)

All right I was going to let this one go but something happend yesterday that kind of pissed me off. Here I go...

I tried to find how to change ignition timing on my car. I thought I'd go and "search" for the info. Of course I read up on all the threads and how it is sooooo easy to change your timing. After looking through all of the info (including the page in the Sentra.net site that everyone was refering too) I realised that allthough there was allot of talk no one REALLY explianed how to do it. Everyone raved how it improves the power and how you need to change it to 15 dergees...BUT no one...not ONE freaking person actually expained where on a 1.6L the timing marks are (yeah I know by the crank pulley...BUT WHERE!!!) nor how the timing light works??? So pretty much after 2 hours of looking I did not find out S$#T.... Moral of the story... Although you guys think you have answered all the Q's, usually none of the forums hold ALL of the answers... So that's why the ppl ask the same question OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN. Because most ppl either don't answer the question correctly or completely... 

my two cents...

BTW: The answers would be appreciated...


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## PatScottAKA99XE (Apr 30, 2002)

hagasan said:


> *All right I was going to let this one go but something happend yesterday that kind of pissed me off. Here I go...
> 
> I tried to find how to change ignition timing on my car. I thought I'd go and "search" for the info. Of course I read up on all the threads and how it is sooooo easy to change your timing. After looking through all of the info (including the page in the Sentra.net site that everyone was refering too) I realised that allthough there was allot of talk no one REALLY explianed how to do it. Everyone raved how it improves the power and how you need to change it to 15 dergees...BUT no one...not ONE freaking person actually expained where on a 1.6L the timing marks are (yeah I know by the crank pulley...BUT WHERE!!!) nor how the timing light works??? So pretty much after 2 hours of looking I did not find out S$#T.... Moral of the story... Although you guys think you have answered all the Q's, usually none of the forums hold ALL of the answers... So that's why the ppl ask the same question OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN. Because most ppl either don't answer the question correctly or completely...
> 
> ...


Dont take this the wrong way, but if you do not know how to use a timming light or find/read the marks you probably shouldnt be doing it yourself. Done wrong you can fry your motor. Read up on how to use a light first. Its kida sorta my fault there are no pics of the timing marks for you to look at. I have been trying to find the time to do it for Sentra.net. Ill try to get on it this week.


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## hagasan (Aug 5, 2002)

It's all good PatScott... 

It just gets frustraring when people seem talking about something so "obvious" but in actuality the subject is a little more in depth. At least you're trying to help instead of just flaming me for being a "moron" for not knowing. I'm actually pretty competent with cars. But it's just like every thing in life....it seems complicated at first. Once you do it though...things tend to make much more sense. Any info (especially some pics...) would of greathelp . Thanks!!!


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## PatScottAKA99XE (Apr 30, 2002)

Damn it, I am gonna get off my lazy a$$ tommorow and take pic of the timing marks. LOL
Glad to see I didnt upset you(I tend to have that affect on some members). There are plans for a good timming adv. article. we're working on it. I may take some time tommorow and write up a preliminary(sp?) one for the mean time. If I do, you will get the first copy 
I know what you mean, I take some automotive tasks for granted since I am a tech, and do the crap everyday. I have to keep reminding myself that not everone has done these things before.


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## Sr20 B12 (May 1, 2002)

You know what I'm sick of? Guys who sit on their hands and asses who are typing in "help...help...help?" as the topic and have statements like "I wanna get a se-r because I heard that their fast. How can I put a turbo in my car with no knowledge on how to change my oil and scratch my ass?" 

I see stuff like this on a daily basis it makes me get angry, because these people think education and information is a handout you get while going on the train. When you go or went to school, the teacher never said "don't worry about studying or learning kids, I'll take all your test and quizzes for you this whole semester." I don't think so..... Just like how you bust your tail in school on the basic academics, you should apply the same focus on educating yourself with information that will further your knowledge and expertise on engines and engine building. 

And for 17 years of age I can say that I have gained a lot more information from watching and reading other peoples faults and accomplishments or listening to their advice and suggestions, than guys twice my age. And like the commercials say "If I can do it, so can you!"

And I think this give me the reason to tell someone to use the search when they want to know what engine their sentra has!

-Mario


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## Adam (Apr 30, 2002)

hagasan said:


> *At least you're trying to help instead of just flaming me for being a "moron" for not knowing. *


If I understand correctly what's being discussed in the moderator's forum, we'll be more active in cutting this type of reply down, keeping things more on topic.


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## hagasan (Aug 5, 2002)

...further proof that I am hanging out in the right forum...

...thanks guys...


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## dono200sx (May 2, 2002)

hagasan said:


> *All right I was going to let this one go but something happend yesterday that kind of pissed me off. Here I go...
> 
> I tried to find how to change ignition timing on my car. I thought I'd go and "search" for the info. Of course I read up on all the threads and how it is sooooo easy to change your timing. After looking through all of the info (including the page in the Sentra.net site that everyone was refering too) I realised that allthough there was allot of talk no one REALLY explianed how to do it. Everyone raved how it improves the power and how you need to change it to 15 dergees...BUT no one...not ONE freaking person actually expained where on a 1.6L the timing marks are (yeah I know by the crank pulley...BUT WHERE!!!) nor how the timing light works??? So pretty much after 2 hours of looking I did not find out S$#T.... Moral of the story... Although you guys think you have answered all the Q's, usually none of the forums hold ALL of the answers... So that's why the ppl ask the same question OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN. Because most ppl either don't answer the question correctly or completely...
> 
> ...


I'll have some time here in about 45-1 hour to help you out. I have the 1.6L myself, and when I went to a friend's house to adjust my timing, we had a hard time finding the lights (He's 48 and has been working on cars since he was 16 or so). I know there is an article explaining exactly how to do it. You might go to your nearest Autozone and get a Haynes manual, or better yet drop the $50-60 and get a Factory Service Manual. What we did was hook up the timing light, and start the car. We then used the timing light to locate the marks. They were right about the crank pulley. If you shine the light between the coolant resoviour (sp?) and the alternator towards that direction and look around, you shouldn't have much trouble finding them.


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## dono200sx (May 2, 2002)

Here is that link I promised you. I went to www.sentra.net and searched for "ga16de timing" and used the information from links in there to get this article: http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/november98/timing.shtml

Sorry I posted this later that I promised... I left work early. I think i'm getting this stomach virus going around...

I think that if more people would respond like this, people would learn how to search better. I think that in itself would help curb redundant questions.


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