# Bigger ground wire.



## rod_88 (Jan 13, 2007)

Where could I find a bigger thicker ground wire. I mean, my car had a small ascapade a couple of days ago, where my ground wire was not making contact. I need to change that out, but Ive read that using a bigger ground wire aids in better fuel economy, and who am I kidding, power. The better ground is made the better the hp and torque. So, Where can I find a thicker ground wire?:woowoo:


----------



## glynka (Aug 18, 2007)

Hi,[#1] Please where you read that using a bigger ground wire aids in better fuel economy,and make better hp and torque?
[#2] in any Auto Part you can chose bigger AWG,and the long you want.


----------



## spat (Oct 15, 2005)

WOW! simply adding a bigger ground will improve all that! Hey, I have a peice of 4/O copper lying around. That should give me like 100MPG and a 50% boost in HP!

HEEH! HEEH!

Ok, all jokes aside. The only thing I can think of is someone must have taken that phrase out of context. True, if you have a sensor with poor ground it may hinder fuel economy. Also If you have a poor engine ground it can hinder many components and in the end result in poor fuel economy but it will also effect drivability and likely give you multiple error codes. But I don't see any way a larger ground can boost any of those claims above the origional intent of the manufacturer. If there truely is a claim I would love to read the science behind it!


----------



## rod_88 (Jan 13, 2007)

Yeah. I read it in I think it was a preveous modified mag thingy. They swapped out a ground wire off a stock hatch, and they dyno tested it first. They did the wire swap and they made like 15 Hp more, plus more torque.


----------



## spat (Oct 15, 2005)

I still would think that there must have been a problem in the system of some sorts. It would be interesting to see that done in a controled environment.


----------



## rod_88 (Jan 13, 2007)

Why is hard to beleive? I mean no offense but MSD centers its company on good electronics. A good system requires a good contacts. To me it makes sence.


----------



## spat (Oct 15, 2005)

I completely agree with the good contacts issue. My point is if there was an improvement by adding a larger ground then the system was lacking the needed current flow IMO. Question is was the origional ground faulty, have a poor contact point, or was it just a poor design on the manufacturers part? I don't think that would occure on the average vehicle. Otherwise manufacturers would simply just start putting larger grounds! What I would like to know is what wire did they replace? What make, model and year was it? Did they try testing this swap on multiple vehicles of the same make, model and year? Did they try this on many other Makes and models? That would give a better picture of whats happening.


----------



## rod_88 (Jan 13, 2007)

well i guess you make a poit, they did this to a civic hatch, like a 90, and I guess if your doing performance parts then I guess you have to upgrade the whole thing. Im guess that the og ground wire is fine for the og equipment, so, you need to go bigger if you go bigger on the rest of the engine. My brother did his on a 1990 Dodge ram charger and his starts faster and feels smoother.


----------



## spat (Oct 15, 2005)

Well I will admit that most high volume manufacturers cut corners anywhere they can so it may be more common than should be. I still haven't got the answer, which ground is all this referenced to. The engine to chassis? Battery negative to body? Body to Chassis?

Also that would definatly make a difference if they where upgrading the engine ground and had a higher demand of power due to performance parts. Keep in mind the manufacturer is only using the needed gauge wire for the current demand not for what someone may add later. So they may also gain a benifit by replaceing wires from the performance parts althe way back to it origination. Otherwise if not properly fused and wires sized properly they may let the smoke out of the wires. Once you let the smoke out of the wire it is totally useless! 

In the end I guess it wouldn't hurt to try it on any vehicle that seems to be lacking power though.


----------



## rod_88 (Jan 13, 2007)

oh my bad for all the mis-spelling, um they did it to the battery cable. Im sure it would help just as much doing it to everything else though right?


----------



## spat (Oct 15, 2005)

Depends on how the extras are wired into the system. If they go strait to the battery and have their own fuse protection then only upgrading the ground would be necessary. If they tapped into one of the fuse blocks then the related power supply to that fuse block would stand a chance of giving some added benefit.

I often tell people the flow of electricity is realy not that complicated if they have a good understanding of water flow (hydraulics). Think of it in this way when comparing to water flow: pressure = voltage, rate of flow = current (Amps) , restriction to flow = resistance (Ohms).

Now suppose you had a pump recirculating water from a tank(battery) and through a pipe. If you added a "T" in the output line and a "T" in the return line you still have the same amount of flow. Now you add a second pump with a separate line directly from the tank but it returns through the "T" in the origional return line. You still have the same amount of flow because you can't overcome the restricted flow in the return line. So what is the solution? Increase the size of the return line or run a separate return line back to the tank. Of course you still have a limit of whats available in the tank(battery) to be pumped out so eventually that may need upgrading as well.

this would not be 100% true but is relatively true. You may get a small increase but you wont get the full benefit of the second pump without up grading the return because the return has its limitations until it is upgraded.


----------



## rod_88 (Jan 13, 2007)

I guess, So I guess to get the "same" performance you could simply just get a bigger more"hard-core" batery?


----------



## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

A bigger battery has nothing to do with the integrity of the vehicle's ground circuits/


----------



## rod_88 (Jan 13, 2007)

I know. It would just aid in the starting process.


----------

