# how does you AC perform?



## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

on my 06 Xtrail, i'm not getting any cold air from my vents. I had it briefly looked at by a mechanic about 2 years ago, but it was more of a 20 second ''look over/ya not working '' type of deal. ( He was working on other cars and busy/we shared automotive shop space). Anyways, i'm not sure if my compressor is shot or just do not have enough pressure. I was watching this ChrisFix video and he mentions sometimes not enough pressure so the compressor might actually work fine/needs pressure. First thing i will check is to see if my compressor turns on and the pulley spins. If i can find the same A/C Pro can he uses and reasonably affordable, i will try to fix/recharge it myself. How well does you Xtrail AC work? have you guys tried a similar repair? I think i try this, if it does not work, i may just live without cold Air in the summer as i may only keep my truck for another 2 years .....no point dumping a big AC repair bill in a vehicle that depreciating to the point it might only be worth $2000 or so two years from now. Plus i live in Vancouver....our summers are pretty pleasant and rarely gets hotter then 23-24 C for more then a few days or week in late july/august. ( Mind you, outside of metro Vancouver, we have towns and cities where we are the ''hotspots of Canada....averaging 30C and can go as high as 40C-43C. !)


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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

I have a hunch either not sold in Canada /and/or will not be shipped across the border from USA because it is banned or flammable/aerosol spray. I looked for the AC Pro kit and retails for $39.99 in usa. Cannot find a canadiaN retailer. Amazon.Ca lists it for sale at $41.99 and free shipping. I notice it states '' Ships from Canada and sold by Autozon. ''.....so should not be any issues .


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## rogoman (Dec 16, 2004)

The AC pro kit and others like it are just a stop-gap resolution in some cases. If all the system needs is more refrigerant, then the AC pro kit will do the job. However there may be other problems causing a *no cold air* condition. A lot of people use these kits and end up with a highly over-charged system without fixing the problem.

Here's what you need to do the proper job; it will measure the high/low side of the system. This way you can more easily determine what the actual problem might be:






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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

rogoman said:


> The AC pro kit and others like it are just a stop-gap resolution in some cases. If all the system needs is more refrigerant, then the AC pro kit will do the job. However there may be other problems causing a *no cold air* condition. A lot of people use these kits and end up with a highly over-charged system without fixing the problem.
> 
> Here's what you need to do the proper job; it will measure the high/low side of the system. This way you can more easily determine what the actual problem might be:
> 
> ...


hi...thanks for the info. As you mentioned, might be a stop gap repair. I could live with that. It's not crucial i have cold air living here in Vancouver during summer. It be nice to have cold air if a cheap and simple fix. But as i mentioned, for my old Xtrail, i will not be professionally servicing my air cond. It's July 10th, hit only 20 C today. Some days in June it was about 15-18C. Vancouver a strange duck in terms of weather. Very rarey will be hot and then only very brief. Travel only 50-75klms east of the city, can warm up . Further out, Kelowna, Kamloops ( far away from the coast/inland) can go to 30-35C and well past...long hot summers. Even have a desert region in BC.


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## X-hale (Apr 17, 2017)

It was 36.4 C here yesterday. I recharged my SVX and X-Trail last week. The SVX AC is so cold that my hands go numb on the steering wheel. The X-Trail is only cold enough at 36 C if I keep the recirc/max on all the time. It is my belief that the HVAC system is undersized for the amount of glass and the number of cubic feet of interior space.


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## rogoman (Dec 16, 2004)

tonyvancity said:


> hi...thanks for the info. As you mentioned, might be a stop gap repair. I could live with that. It's not crucial i have cold air living here in Vancouver during summer. It be nice to have cold air if a cheap and simple fix. But as i mentioned, for my old Xtrail, i will not be professionally servicing my air cond. It's July 10th, hit only 20 C today. Some days in June it was about 15-18C. Vancouver a strange duck in terms of weather. Very rarey will be hot and then only very brief. Travel only 50-75klms east of the city, can warm up . Further out, Kelowna, Kamloops ( far away from the coast/inland) can go to 30-35C and well past...long hot summers. Even have a desert region in BC.


It makes sense not to throw too much effort into your AC considering the climate in Vancouver.
Years ago I was in Seattle, Washington for about 2 weeks; nice place to visit; temperatures were about the same as what you have. However there was lots of rain and overcast every day. Here in New Jersey we're having temperatures of 35 - 37C and high humidity; need that AC working.


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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

X-hale said:


> It was 36.4 C here yesterday. I recharged my SVX and X-Trail last week. The SVX AC is so cold that my hands go numb on the steering wheel. The X-Trail is only cold enough at 36 C if I keep the recirc/max on all the time. It is my belief that the HVAC system is undersized for the amount of glass and the number of cubic feet of interior space.


i know that the first 2 years i had my 06 Xtrail , the air conditioner was working normal and blew cold air. But i took it one summer to visit relatives in the Okanagan region Of BC where it was hitting 30-35 celcius averages and the air cond was barely keeping me cool. That year i decided to have a professional window tint job on every window , minus the front windshield. That helped a lot to keep the interior cooler. My front driver/passenger windows are tinted at about 35%, the backglass hatch is at 20%.


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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

rogoman said:


> It makes sense not to throw too much effort into your AC considering the climate in Vancouver.
> Years ago I was in Seattle, Washington for about 2 weeks; nice place to visit; temperatures were about the same as what you have. However there was lots of rain and overcast every day. Here in New Jersey we're having temperatures of 35 - 37C and high humidity; need that AC working.


Oh yah, Seattle and Vancouver are twins in terms of rainy weather and both our cities are known for driving you bonkers with a short sunny season and just too many rainy days and nights. Mind you Vancouver in Summer can get it's share of warm humid days. I've visited seattle in Summer and it definitely felt hotter there. Aint it funny how some vehicle's have super ice cold air conditioners, even when it's an older car way past it's prime? My father had a 2004 dodge caravan and i just sold that for him last summer...ice cold air cond!. My brother has a 04 Matrix, nice cold air even on the lowest settings. I had a used , 1987 toyota Camry back in 2005-06 and i had to keep the air cond on the lowest setting because it was just so damn cold i was getting a sore throat. Then there was my then new 2004 Honda Civic Si....such a weak ass air cond. All black interior, tinted windows and one of the lamest air conditioners i ever experienced .


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## rogoman (Dec 16, 2004)

The older cars that used R12 refrigerant produced better cooling then the newer cars that use R134a refrigerant. Due to the Montreal Protocol agreement, all the car manufacturers had to convert to R134a in 1989.


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## buyerhousehold (9 mo ago)

tonyvancity said:


> View attachment 6546


Yes, I think you need this


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## alarmingprefer (9 mo ago)

A/C cool refrigerant might help you.
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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

is the AC Cool 12a compatible with my 06 xtrail that had the factory 134a??
i'm willing to buy a can of 12a if it is compatible and works for a few months in the summer. 
But if will absolutely not meant to be recharged with it, i just skip it. 
It's an old 16 yo vehicle and chances are i sell it AS IS in the next year or so. 
Whoever buys it can decide if worthy of taking the truck to a proper mechanic and fixing the AC issues. 
I just do not want to bring it in and spend $300-800 to get it correctly blssting cold ac.


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## DFSpencer (Oct 21, 2019)

tonyvancity said:


> is the AC Cool 12a compatible with my 06 xtrail that had the factory 134a??
> i'm willing to buy a can of 12a if it is compatible and works for a few months in the summer.
> But if will absolutely not meant to be recharged with it, i just skip it.
> It's an old 16 yo vehicle and chances are i sell it AS IS in the next year or so.
> ...


The AC on my T30 is also not working although when I bought it (wholesale) a few years ago it could give a little cooling. One thing that I didn't know, but makes sense, is that the system that controls the compressor detects if the refrigerant charge drops below a certain level and actually will prevent the locking clutch on the compressor pulley from engaging, I assume to protect the compressor because all refrigeration/heat pump systems have not only the obvious component, refrigerant, but also a special lubricant that the compressor needs. So when you lose cooling it is most likely a refrigerant leak but at times could be compressor failure.
You can buy what is called "R-12a" refrigerant in Canada (as far as I know it is still illegal in the US) and although R-12a is sold as a replacement for the classic R-12 and also R-134a it has no chemical relation to either. R-12a is actually a mixture of R-290 (propane) and R-600a (isobutane). Not surprisingly these are fairly flammable, unlike traditional chlorine and fluorine containing refrigerants. If you go to refrigeration-specific web sites you will find serious discussion and arguments about the very use of R-12a, R-290 or R-600a because of their flammability. Many or most of the R-12a bottles I've seen also contain a UV-detectable tracer that makes it much easier to troubleshoot leaks in the system. The one complication about simply adding R-12a to a R-134a system (at least one that still contains some R-134a) is now you have produced a mix of gases that really complicates any future work on the system, which typically will begin with a recovery of any residual refrigerant in the AC system. Refrigerant recovery units can not be used with refrigerants such as R-12a and if you tell professional refrigeration techs that your system has a mix with R-12a I believe they won't go near it. In my case I actually have a proper refrigerant recovery machine and its companion tank and before I mess with my X-Trail AC I will recover all the remaining R-134a from the vehicle before trying out R-12a. Propane and isobutane do not cause any ozone damage and have very little "greenhouse gas" issues and that is why you can buy them at places like Canadian Tire and Princess Auto without a proper refrigeration technician ticket.
The R-12a cans specifically list R-134a as one of the refrigerants that it can substitute for but from what I've read R-12a will not really give the same level of cooling as R-134a.


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## rogoman (Dec 16, 2004)

tonyvancity said:


> is the AC Cool 12a compatible with my 06 xtrail that had the factory 134a??
> i'm willing to buy a can of 12a if it is compatible and works for a few months in the summer.
> But if will absolutely not meant to be recharged with it, i just skip it.
> It's an old 16 yo vehicle and chances are i sell it AS IS in the next year or so.
> ...


*HC-12a*, also called *ES-12a*, *OZ-12a*, *DURACOOL 12a*[1] and *Hydrocarbon Blend B*, is a "drop-in" replacement refrigerant for Freon-12 and to a lesser extent, R-134a. So it may be worth trying it.


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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

rogoman said:


> *HC-12a*, also called *ES-12a*, *OZ-12a*, *DURACOOL 12a*[1] and *Hydrocarbon Blend B*, is a "drop-in" replacement refrigerant for Freon-12 and to a lesser extent, R-134a. So it may be worth trying it.


''cool''..lol. I was at Prince's Auto yesterday to buy the AC Cool 12A product but then i decided to google what our nissan Xtrails originally came with from the factory. Shows the 134A refridgerant. Then i read the 134a got banned for sale in Canada. 
I decided to leave it be for fear i would waste my money on 12a ( $25 per can as in the photo posted in previous comments) as maybe not compatible or i end up ruining my ac system even further for the next potential buyer of my truck.


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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

DFSpencer said:


> The AC on my T30 is also not working although when I bought it (wholesale) a few years ago it could give a little cooling. One thing that I didn't know, but makes sense, is that the system that controls the compressor detects if the refrigerant charge drops below a certain level and actually will prevent the locking clutch on the compressor pulley from engaging, I assume to protect the compressor because all refrigeration/heat pump systems have not only the obvious component, refrigerant, but also a special lubricant that the compressor needs. So when you lose cooling it is most likely a refrigerant leak but at times could be compressor failure.
> You can buy what is called "R-12a" refrigerant in Canada (as far as I know it is still illegal in the US) and although R-12a is sold as a replacement for the classic R-12 and also R-134a it has no chemical relation to either. R-12a is actually a mixture of R-290 (propane) and R-600a (isobutane). Not surprisingly these are fairly flammable, unlike traditional chlorine and fluorine containing refrigerants. If you go to refrigeration-specific web sites you will find serious discussion and arguments about the very use of R-12a, R-290 or R-600a because of their flammability. Many or most of the R-12a bottles I've seen also contain a UV-detectable tracer that makes it much easier to troubleshoot leaks in the system. The one complication about simply adding R-12a to a R-134a system (at least one that still contains some R-134a) is now you have produced a mix of gases that really complicates any future work on the system, which typically will begin with a recovery of any residual refrigerant in the AC system. Refrigerant recovery units can not be used with refrigerants such as R-12a and if you tell professional refrigeration techs that your system has a mix with R-12a I believe they won't go near it. In my case I actually have a proper refrigerant recovery machine and its companion tank and before I mess with my X-Trail AC I will recover all the remaining R-134a from the vehicle before trying out R-12a. Propane and isobutane do not cause any ozone damage and have very little "greenhouse gas" issues and that is why you can buy them at places like Canadian Tire and Princess Auto without a proper refrigeration technician ticket.
> The R-12a cans specifically list R-134a as one of the refrigerants that it can substitute for but from what I've read R-12a will not really give the same level of cooling as R-134a.


thanks, this is very helpful.
- i recall reading online on a few things you mentioned regarding the r12 not being as cold as the 134a, that the recharge can is full of iso butane and propane and it will be a big piss off to any AC tech as it may damage/contaminate their shop AC equipment. 
Having said that, it is on sale at Princess Auto for $25 per can and i could live with 20% or so less chilled AC in the xtrail. If i recharge and it at least works for a few months ( and where i live, even in the summer months the vehicle AC may not even be used for days at a time) and costs me another $25 , i'm okay with that. 
If i were to eventually sell my xtrail , i can at least have a working AC and tell / show the potential buyer that it needs to be recharged with the same stuff and he/she can take it as is or move on to another vehicle for sale.


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## DFSpencer (Oct 21, 2019)

tonyvancity said:


> thanks, this is very helpful.
> - i recall reading online on a few things you mentioned regarding the r12 not being as cold as the 134a, that the recharge can is full of iso butane and propane and it will be a big piss off to any AC tech as it may damage/contaminate their shop AC equipment.
> Having said that, it is on sale at Princess Auto for $25 per can and i could live with 20% or so less chilled AC in the xtrail. If i recharge and it at least works for a few months ( and where i live, even in the summer months the vehicle AC may not even be used for days at a time) and costs me another $25 , i'm okay with that.
> If i were to eventually sell my xtrail , i can at least have a working AC and tell / show the potential buyer that it needs to be recharged with the same stuff and he/she can take it as is or move on to another vehicle for sale.


Actually if you only need a can (so if you already have a hose) the current PA flyer catalogue that is out here in NS has 'A/C ON THE GO' (A/C 12a refrigerant) on sale for $9.99 each. That same can together with the hose and pressure gauge is indeed $24.99. This R-12a comes with the UV dye used for leak detection so if you are ambitious or motivated you might be able to find your vehicle's system leak. You will need a small, inexpensive UVA light (AKA 'black light' or UV 365 nm) and Amazon has many. I bought what looks just like a little rechargeable flashlight except it generates UVA; the one I bought was $22 but you can get non-rechargeable ones for about $14.
All of the cans of R-12a note on the side what they say is the R-12a equivalent to both R-134a and R-12. The original charge of the T30's A/C is 550 grams of R-134a but the A/C GO can claims that the can's 255 grams of R-12a is the equivalent to 680 grams of R-134a, I'm not exactly clear what "equivalent" means except that you have to correct how much R-12a you add to the vehicle A/C to avoid overcharging, which you don't want to do. I know that the "static" pressure of the 2.5l gas engine T30's A/C when charged with R-135a (with engine off and the system allowed to return to outside temperature) is 50 psi (that's in the service manual). I'll assume that is the goal you're looking for when you feed in the R-12a. The R-12a pressure in the can is a bit higher then 50 psi.


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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

DFSpencer said:


> Actually if you only need a can (so if you already have a hose) the current PA flyer catalogue that is out here in NS has 'A/C ON THE GO' (A/C 12a refrigerant) on sale for $9.99 each. That same can together with the hose and pressure gauge is indeed $24.99. This R-12a comes with the UV dye used for leak detection so if you are ambitious or motivated you might be able to find your vehicle's system leak. You will need a small, inexpensive UVA light (AKA 'black light' or UV 365 nm) and Amazon has many. I bought what looks just like a little rechargeable flashlight except it generates UVA; the one I bought was $22 but you can get non-rechargeable ones for about $14.
> All of the cans of R-12a note on the side what they say is the R-12a equivalent to both R-134a and R-12. The original charge of the T30's A/C is 550 grams of R-134a but the A/C GO can claims that the can's 255 grams of R-12a is the equivalent to 680 grams of R-134a, I'm not exactly clear what "equivalent" means except that you have to correct how much R-12a you add to the vehicle A/C to avoid overcharging, which you don't want to do. I know that the "static" pressure of the 2.5l gas engine T30's A/C when charged with R-135a (with engine off and the system allowed to return to outside temperature) is 50 psi (that's in the service manual). I'll assume that is the goal you're looking for when you feed in the R-12a. The R-12a pressure in the can is a bit higher then 50 psi.


thanks for the info/help. 
I try to go back to Princess Auto this weekend and see if they still have the $24.99 can of AC Cool. I do need the pressure gauge hose and $24.99 is a pretty good deal as i have seen each sold individually and for too much money. 
If it works and gives me cold air for a month or so i can be content with that.
Question if you can answer: So let's say i manage to get 40-45 psi of the r-12a in my AC system. And it blows cold air for a few weeks, then runs out . ( here we will assume i have a leak).
- will the AC leak only when the engine and AC is on? Or will it be like a slow leak from a vehicle tire that just sits there and air slowly escapes? get a leak regardless of whether my truck is running(AC turned on) or just parked and sitting overnight?


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## DFSpencer (Oct 21, 2019)

tonyvancity said:


> thanks for the info/help.
> I try to go back to Princess Auto this weekend and see if they still have the $24.99 can of AC Cool. I do need the pressure gauge hose and $24.99 is a pretty good deal as i have seen each sold individually and for too much money.
> If it works and gives me cold air for a month or so i can be content with that.
> Question if you can answer: So let's say i manage to get 40-45 psi of the r-12a in my AC system. And it blows cold air for a few weeks, then runs out . ( here we will assume i have a leak).
> - will the AC leak only when the engine and AC is on? Or will it be like a slow leak from a vehicle tire that just sits there and air slowly escapes? get a leak regardless of whether my truck is running(AC turned on) or just parked and sitting overnight?


Well the leak will clearly be worse when the A/C is on because the high pressure line will be a lot above 50 psi. From what I can find in the service manual the normal pressures for what are called the low (suction) side and the high side are around 25 psi and 300 psi or higher. If it ever stops raining here and the temperature returns to above 10C I'm thinking I will attack the AC on my vehicle, hopefully in the next few days. I know that my X-Trail lost what refrigerant that it had when I bought it (and I'm sure it was not actually working properly even then) while it was just sitting in my driveway. Clearly how much would be lost would depend on how bad the leak was so you probably still have some R-134a in your vehicle. If the leak is on the low pressure side you may actually stop losing refrigerant below some point if the AC isn't running. When you hook up the refrigerant line to your X-Trail, and before you pierce the top of the can to release refrigerant into the hose the pressure gauge will tell you what residual pressure is left in the AC system. The line that leaves the compressor is the high pressure one (the second line is the suction or return line) and that high pressure line is an obvious place to look for a leak. One factor that does complicate what you (and I) are going to do is that when you lose refrigerant (as a gas) you do also lose a little of the lubricating oil and in principle you are supposed to try to figure out how much so you replace it in the system. So the service manual says that if you have had a large refrigerant leak you should add 30 ml of lubricant back into the system. The AC system for the QR (gas) engine starts with a total of 180 ml lubricant. Princess Auto does sell the lubricant for R-12a, which may or may not be the same as, or at least compatible with, the original lubricant in the system. I'm not certain yet how I'm going to handle the lubricant business.


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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

DFSpencer said:


> Well the leak will clearly be worse when the A/C is on because the high pressure line will be a lot above 50 psi. From what I can find in the service manual the normal pressures for what are called the low (suction) side and the high side are around 25 psi and 300 psi or higher. If it ever stops raining here and the temperature returns to above 10C I'm thinking I will attack the AC on my vehicle, hopefully in the next few days. I know that my X-Trail lost what refrigerant that it had when I bought it (and I'm sure it was not actually working properly even then) while it was just sitting in my driveway. Clearly how much would be lost would depend on how bad the leak was so you probably still have some R-134a in your vehicle. If the leak is on the low pressure side you may actually stop losing refrigerant below some point if the AC isn't running. When you hook up the refrigerant line to your X-Trail, and before you pierce the top of the can to release refrigerant into the hose the pressure gauge will tell you what residual pressure is left in the AC system. The line that leaves the compressor is the high pressure one (the second line is the suction or return line) and that high pressure line is an obvious place to look for a leak. One factor that does complicate what you (and I) are going to do is that when you lose refrigerant (as a gas) you do also lose a little of the lubricating oil and in principle you are supposed to try to figure out how much so you replace it in the system. So the service manual says that if you have had a large refrigerant leak you should add 30 ml of lubricant back into the system. The AC system for the QR (gas) engine starts with a total of 180 ml lubricant. Princess Auto does sell the lubricant for R-12a, which may or may not be the same as, or at least compatible with, the original lubricant in the system. I'm not certain yet how I'm going to handle the lubricant business.


i'm thinking either i read about or saw a video of the A/C Cool R-12a that states there is AC lubricant already added. If true, no idea if that is sufficient amount .
I was reading on a Saturn forum the AC problem this one fellow has with his AC and another commenter chimed in with the disaster that awaits if you recharge your vehicle AC system and the proper type & amount of ac oil is not included. He was saying the AC system starts pretty much implode without the lube oil.
Anyways, any thoughts if any of these recharge AC cans have built in lubricants and sufficient?


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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

*12A A/C Cool Refrigerant*
emzone 12A A/C Cool Refrigerant is an environmentally friendly replacement alternative for ozone depleting R-12 and global warming R134a products. It is non-toxic and non-ozone depleting. *The 12A A/C Cool Refrigerant also contains high performance oil to improve system efficiency* and Universal UV Dye to help with leak detection.

hmmmmm......well. I guess i take my chances and spend $25 . Maybe temporarily works until the next recharge. Maybe it will not work at all. 
Either way, 16 year old truck.....made up my mind i'm not forking out for a proper and expensive AC system repair by a certified technician. If i can do it the el cheapskate way, great, i have cold air and i can sell it at some point and brag it still has cold AC. 
If no worky, oh well, sell as is the next buyer can shell out the cash if they have overflowing bank accounts. ..lol.


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## VStar650CL (Nov 12, 2020)

You generally don't lose PAG oil from a leakdown, so what's already in there should be fine. Adding PAG is typically only needed when replacing major components like a compressor, condenser, receiver/drier or evaporator. In any case, you don't want to get carried away with it. While too much PAG won't generally blow anything up, it can seriously affect the system's performance by clotting the TXV or other orifices.


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## DFSpencer (Oct 21, 2019)

tonyvancity said:


> i'm thinking either i read about or saw a video of the A/C Cool R-12a that states there is AC lubricant already added. If true, no idea if that is sufficient amount .
> I was reading on a Saturn forum the AC problem this one fellow has with his AC and another commenter chimed in with the disaster that awaits if you recharge your vehicle AC system and the proper type & amount of ac oil is not included. He was saying the AC system starts pretty much implode without the lube oil.
> Anyways, any thoughts if any of these recharge AC cans have built in lubricants and sufficient?


The A/C ON THE GO can (and it seems many or most of similar products) does say in very fine print that it replaces "lost refrigerant and oil". The emzone A/C Cool refrigerant web site does state that it contains oil. When you have a refrigerant leak you don't lose all or even most of the lubricating oil. The oil tends to stay localized in a few places, like the compressor where the oil is critical. The specific type of oil used in refrigeration systems (and there are a fair number of different ones) has to be a proper match to the specific refrigerant in that system because the goal is to have a small amount of oil actually dissolve or mix with the refrigerant and circulate thorough the system, but there shouldn't be too much oil carried around in the refrigerant liquid or gas. That is why in a simple leak some oil will be lost but not most. Now as soon as you replace individual components in the A/C system you do have to be very careful to replace the lost oil. The service manual states that if, for example, you replace the entire evaporator assembly (so in the cabin) you have to replace 75 ml of lubricant (the whole system with the original R-135a charge has 180 ml of oil). 
I actually did work on my X-Trail today. I have proper refrigeration gauges and various adaptors and accessories and when I hooked things up I didn't get any pressure in the A/C. Initially I wondered if something was wrong with my hookup but I disconnected one of the two lines (air conditioners have two ports, one high and one low, you will be working only through the low), I pushed in the Schrader valve pin and realized there was no pressure in the system. So indeed if the leak is bad enough you can lose all refrigerant except for a little residual gas in the system that does not generate pressure. I did do the proper next step of connecting up a vacuum pump and drawing down the system. For R-12a you don't actually leave the vacuum in the system when you charge it but the vacuum process will let you know if you have a leak in the system and if so how bad. I found that I did have a leak and it was fairly big. I did go ahead and charge the system with the R-12a and even before I turned on the engine, and tried the A/C, I looked down below the alternator and could already see the greenish dye from the refrigerant oozing out of somewhere around the inside top of the compressor or maybe a pipe that runs above it. This is another case where the X-Trail service manual isn't as useful as it could be so I'll have to crawl under the car and study the different pipes and connections and try to narrow down the location of the leak, or leaks.


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## VStar650CL (Nov 12, 2020)

DFSpencer said:


> I looked down below the alternator and could already see the greenish dye from the refrigerant oozing out of somewhere around the inside top of the compressor or maybe a pipe that runs above it.


The o-rings on the compressor outlet and return fittings are "the usual suspects" in that area.


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## DFSpencer (Oct 21, 2019)

VStar650CL said:


> The o-rings on the compressor outlet and return fittings are "the usual suspects" in that area.


Yeh, that was my assumption and I do have a good kit of (green) refrigerant tolerate O-rings. It doesn't seem to be in the crimp connectors on hoses. In fact if that area is the only source of the leak I count myself very lucky because it is pretty easy to get to and work on. If the refrigerant leak were in piping back at the firewall or inside the cabin I'd probably just forget it. Where I live A/C is actually more useful in the winter to supply dry air, then heated, to defrost the inside of the windshield.


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## tonyvancity (Jan 2, 2017)

DFSpencer said:


> Yeh, that was my assumption and I do have a good kit of (green) refrigerant tolerate O-rings. It doesn't seem to be in the crimp connectors on hoses. In fact if that area is the only source of the leak I count myself very lucky because it is pretty easy to get to and work on. If the refrigerant leak were in piping back at the firewall or inside the cabin I'd probably just forget it. Where I live A/C is actually more useful in the winter to supply dry air, then heated, to defrost the inside of the windshield.


Where I live A/C is actually more useful in the winter to supply dry air, then heated, to defrost the inside of the windshield. 
--- yes! forgot that i was actually using the AC + heat during Fall and winter months here in Vancouver with the matrix and xtrail. It sure keeps the cabin from steaming up all the windows and makes for more pleasant driving thru cruddy weather.


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