# 1993 KA24E new oil pump- still looong prime time



## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

Sorry about another ka24e timing chain, oil pump question. Got a 1993 d21 288K. Oil light has been taken longer than usual to go off and activate the timing tensioner. Put a new oil pump on this weekend- no change. Flushed with recommended Seaf$&m today and put new oil and nissan filter on- no change. Once it does prime up it runs perfect. Can i get the oil pan off in the truck to check out the screen and pickup tube. Its my daily so i got to try or scrap it.


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

First thing I would do is install a mechanical oil pressure test gauge and confirm the oil pressure is within specs. If that's okay, it is probably not the pickup but the oil channel in the block to the chain tensioner; sludge can build up in the channel and restrict the oil pressure during start-up. Unfortunately, to clean the channel, you have to remove the front cover and tensioner, remove the oil filter and spray carb cleaner into the oil port on the face of the black and use compressed air to blow through the channel until it blows out clear through the oil filter adapter. I make this a key point anytime a timing chain job is done on a KA-series engine. If the oil pickup was getting restricted, it would likely get worse the more you run the engine. To answer your question, if it's 2WD, you can remove the pan with the engine in the vehicle, but you'll have to unbolt the engine mounts and jack up on the bellhouse to gain enough clearance. If it's 4WD, I believe you have to lower the front diff in addition to above.


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

I think the tensioner is blocked also with the new oil pump added and no change. Going to start tearing into it tonight. Are the ebay timing gear sets with oil pump worth anything ($80 with gaskets)


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

I've heard good and bad reports about Nissan timing sets from Ebay. You might want to check out Rockauto.com and see what they have available. I would stick with a reputable name like TRW (for example) if you don't want to go with genuine Nissan. For genuine Nissan parts, go to 1stAAANissanParts.com.


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

I read a timing chain write up that said to remove three of the bolts format the cross member under the oil pan and let it swing out of the way to remove the pan. Doesn't look like a cross member but more of a cross support for the front suspension. Is it safe to remove? Doing some studying up before I tackle it the next week or so.


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

started tearing down tonight. Going to go slowly over next couple days. Got all the accessories off. Kind of confused on the thermostat housing. Read a couple of write ups but they do not mention taking off all the hoses that go to the housing (looks like 3 plus lower radiator). Do all these need to come off?


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

Got everything tore down today. Bad news. Whole right side guide gone including lower bolt. Chain barely eat through timing cover. took oil pan off and found bolt and all the crumbled guide. Can the cover be welded up, braised, or JB welded up. ??


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

It could be welded if you find someone good at aluminum welding. You have to be careful because the area where the chain cuts through is near the coolant jacket behind the water pump. My recommendation would be to replace the cover. Try Rockauto.com.


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## Grug (Aug 20, 2009)

Sorry to hear about your timing chain situation, fsg.

I don't suppose you took any pictures of the destruction before you removed it all? How about a picture of the inside of the cover?

As far as timing chain write-ups go, did you mainly use the one on this site?


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

Sorry for the late response Grug. No pictures-the whole right side tensioner (rigid) was gone. Got the cover welded up and getting ready to put back together this week -weekend. I did use this site primarily for info. Got another question. Marked the crank and cam with white paint at TOD. the factory shiny link is not aligned with the cam marked though- about 1 link off. Could it have jumped a link with all the slack. It did run good once the oil light went off previously.


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

Yes, with enough slack it can jump timing. Fortunately, with only one tooth, you won't bend the valves. Three or more teeth and valve damage is likely. You need to make sure the timing is right.


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

I put the crank at TDC with the alignment pin and crank pulley. Checked the dist. and it was where I had previously marked TDC when I replaced the oil pump. Right now both the cam and crank keys are at 12. I marked both with white paint to keep correct. When i put the new gears on the new chain should line up with both dimples and off color links. Correct? Sorry if stupid question but If not do i move cam or crank?


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## smj999smj (Jan 1, 2006)

The keyways on the cam and crank should be at 12:00. When installing the chain, the colored links of the chain should line up with the dimples on the timing gears. The cam gear mark will be in the 3:00 position and the crank gear mark will be in the 5:00 position. When looking straight down at the distributor, the rotor should be pointing in the 4:00 position (approximately). If you need to correct the timing, you will need to jam a wedge between the timing chain to push it against the guides and not slip. Do this after putting the crank in the 0 degree TDC position and the cam in the #1 TDC position (or close as you can get it). You will need to remove the cam gear, turn the cam, then reinstall the cam gear to the proper spot on the chain. If the chain slips, the tensioner will take up the slack and you may need to remove the front cover. Keep in mind that if the colored links are lined up to the timing marks on the gear, they will not be lined up if the engine is turned over.


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

I think I may have it on the exhaust stroke. The colored key is one link off on the cam but the other colored key is about halfway along the left tensioner. I think I looked at the flange on the rotor button instead of looking which way it was pointing then looking to see if the flange lined up where i marked it previously. I am going to turn the crank 360 back to where I marked it and check the dimples to the colored links.


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

Well, turned the crank and have a hard time seeing the colored links. I have not taken gears or crank off the whole time. I will watch the valves on #1 and get it on the compression stroke and line up the crank with the paint mark I had at TDC then take gears off and put new ones on.


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

Well I completed the timing chain replacement today. one grove off the first try on the dizzy but got corrected. Engine runs perfect_ after the oil light goes off. Thought it took a while the first time but i though it had to prime and get the air out off the system. drove it 80 down the interstate and let it set for about 5 hrs. Still took a grand total of 9 seconds for the light to go off and the timing chain to stop rattling? Whats up? cleaned the passage to the tensioner about 4 times with brake cleaner. Still seems that the entire system looses prime and has to start over every start.


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## rogoman (Dec 16, 2004)

It's unlikely that the oil pump is loosing prime. The system may just have very low oil pressure; this could be caused by a dirty oil pickup screen, worn oil pump or worn rod/main bearings. Like SMJ suggested, install a temporary oil pressure gauge to check the pressure.


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## ChrisHarris (Feb 5, 2009)

Bad oil filter backflow valve?

The Fram oil filters I was using were always back flowing at night. Timing chain would rattle on start-up. Switched to a decent filter with a good backflow valve - no more timing chain rattle on start-up. I am using Bosch 3600 filter now.

I don't know what leads to where with regard to oil passages inside these engines. I don't know if the oil goes from the pump straight to the timing chain or if it passes through the oil filter first. If it has to pass through the oil filter before it can go through the oil passage to the chain, then it could be the oil filter. I know it was a really simple fix for me.


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## TheRepairMan (Jun 30, 2009)

Yeah, the oil flows from pan to pump through the filter, and then to the oil galleys. I don't want to turn this into an oil filter debate thread, but it sounds like you did the right thing. Not a fan of Fram here either. It ticks me off that my local Walmart has stopped selling anything but Fram. Poor choice for customers.

-R


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

My first try was to drain a quart and put in Lucas which i had been running previously. Did worse about 12-30 seconds of chain rattle with new timing kit and oil pump. I had been running 10-30 like the previous owner since 200K. I decided to try 5-30. Now the light and rattle goes off in 3-6 seconds. I have a cheaper stp filter on now. I tried a Nissan filter before i changed timing chain out. I could not see anti backflow valve in the bottom of the nissan filter though. I will try the bosch filter tomorrow. let you know.


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

Tried the Bosch filter with back-flow synthetic valve (3400). Still takes about 3-6 seconds for chain to stop rattling. Just going to drive it til something changes or she blows.


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## lumbee (Mar 20, 2005)

Good to know that thinkening up the oil has reduced the time to prime the system. I was told my a shade tree nissan mechanic that seemed to know the KA24's pretty well, that the biggest cause of the chain rattle is just the wear in the connecting rods/journels, ect. Thats why I have been reluctant to repair anyting on my truck. Mine only rattles for a couple secs, but I keep waiting for the day when it starts taking longer. Seems like every time I see one of these threads, the repair never seems to stop the rattle. Seems like the only real solution is a full engine rebuild including journel bearings.


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## fsglover (Jan 14, 2011)

Still rattling along. Sometimes the rattling stops at 2 seconds - sometimes 6 seconds. Going to look for an engine to swap. Mine is a 93, what year models will swap directly if with the least amount of changing parts?


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## rogoman (Dec 16, 2004)

fsglover said:


> Going to look for an engine to swap. Mine is a 93, what year models will swap directly if with the least amount of changing parts?


The KA24E was used in the HB trucks from 1990 to 1997.


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