# valve stem shim tool...



## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

I'm finally to the point where I'm installing the head on my eternal turbo project. I recently had the head worked and now I need to determine proper shim height. Problem is I don't have the special tool mentioned in the FSM. The FSM shows the tool mounting in the HLA hole. Anybody made or seen something different...like a bolt on/clamp style?

At the machine shop, I doubt that I specified the stems to be ground to the same height as that would have made it a little easier.

Any info is greatly appreciated.

laterz..Jody


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## lshadoff (Nov 26, 2002)

You can get them from Kent-Moore (P/N J39957-N Valve shim gauge plate kit). The kit comes with the plate, hold-down bolts, and dial indicator. You can order it over the phone.

Call them at 800-345-2233

Be sitting when you call. I'll bet the kit is expensive.


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

Thanks for the great info Lewis!

They're closed until Monday to observe Thanksgiving (imagine that).

I'm sure this will be a "one time use" tool so I can't see me spending a lot of money for it. But then again... Decisions, decisions.

Thanks again.

Jody


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## lshadoff (Nov 26, 2002)

Hmmm. Make your fortune renting the tool. I don't know of anyone who has one. Not even Mike Kojima. 8^)


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

Believe me, I thought about that!  

I've considered taking it to a machine shop to have them do it...seems simple enough: measure this, measure that, the difference is your shim (x8), right it down, I buy it  

I'm pleased w/ my friends DSM beast completed here in Austin. I plan to check into the machine shop that was used for his car. If they want an arm then I'll probably just give Kent-Moore an arm and a leg.

Thanks again.

Jody


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## jbanach77 (Jun 11, 2002)

PM me and let me know just how much this tool is also, i would be interested in a purchase also cause i need to shim my stock cams in my gti-r. but when i get a beater car i am going to install my jun 280's and will need to re-shim the head again. please keep me posted!!!!!!


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

Will do....Jody


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

lshadoff said:


> *You can get them from Kent-Moore (P/N J39957-N Valve shim gauge plate kit). The kit comes with the plate, hold-down bolts, and dial indicator. You can order it over the phone.
> 
> Call them at 800-345-2233
> 
> Be sitting when you call. I'll bet the kit is expensive. *


Called them today and they said that P/N does not exist. The gentleman also told me that they've switched to the magnetic base dial indicators.

Guess I'll check local machine shops now.

Thanks anyway...Jody


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## jbanach77 (Jun 11, 2002)

if you find anything localy let me know and i will purchase one with you. cause i know that we don't have many shops around here that deals with that sort of thing.


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## morepower2 (Apr 19, 2002)

jbanach77 said:


> *if you find anything localy let me know and i will purchase one with you. cause i know that we don't have many shops around here that deals with that sort of thing. *


I borrow my friends which is a dial indicator with the rod welded to a hollowed out old HLA. It proably works better than the Kent-Moor tool.

Mike


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## jbanach77 (Jun 11, 2002)

morepower2 said:


> *I borrow my friends which is a dial indicator with the rod welded to a hollowed out old HLA. It proably works better than the Kent-Moor tool.
> 
> Mike *


could you be more descriptive in your tool so i get the definitive shim sizes i need? what kind of tools do i need to get to get the readings i need? and how do i go about manually to get the shim size.

i know this sounds like i am dumb guys but i want to be 100% sure while i am doing the measuring.


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## Geo (Apr 30, 2002)

morepower2 said:


> *I borrow my friends which is a dial indicator with the rod welded to a hollowed out old HLA. It proably works better than the Kent-Moor tool.
> 
> Mike *


Mike, I thought the Nissan tool was the one I saw Mike Smith using at JWT. If not, can you send me a private e-mail. I'd like to discuss this with you.


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

Local machine shop price quoted $50-$75 depending on how long it takes. Said it probably won't take more than an hour. I've done work with him before also, so maybe the price will be on the lower end. 
Still, it's the cheapest route I've found.

There are many dial indicators on ebay and I have several HLA's from 2 other motors. Wouldn't mind having the tool made similiar to Mike's friend. I'll ask the machinist about this when I drop off the head.

Thanks for the input.

Jody Misenheimer


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## Geo (Apr 30, 2002)

1fastser said:


> *Local machine shop price quoted $50-$75 depending on how long it takes. Said it probably won't take more than an hour. I've done work with him before also, so maybe the price will be on the lower end.
> Still, it's the cheapest route I've found.
> 
> There are many dial indicators on ebay and I have several HLA's from 2 other motors. Wouldn't mind having the tool made similiar to Mike's friend. I'll ask the machinist about this when I drop off the head.
> ...


Jody, what style are we talking about? Are we talking about the kind I saw at JWT or something like Mike described? I've already talked with my machinist as well about making one like they use at JWT.


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## jbanach77 (Jun 11, 2002)

either way it goes keep me informed. maybe you can get a group purchase together also to further lower the price. just a thought


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

Geo said:


> *Jody, what style are we talking about? Are we talking about the kind I saw at JWT or something like Mike described? I've already talked with my machinist as well about making one like they use at JWT. *


I don't know what your eyes saw at JWT  

I was referring to the one described by Mike..."dial indicator with the rod welded to a hollowed out old HLA". I'm sure the hole in the HLA would need to be 'true' and the bar welded in perfectly verticle...correct?

I'll take the head to the machine shop when the rocker arm guides come in.

laterz...Jody


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## morepower2 (Apr 19, 2002)

yeah I asctualy feel that there is a limited comercial need for this product, george? nudge, nudge!


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## BORNGEARHEAD (Apr 30, 2002)

Hey guys. I wrote the part # off of one at work. The part# you have is wrong. The right part # is J38957-N. Funny, for some reason we have 2 of these kits. I might have to acquire one of these.


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

Is it the bolt-down kind?

Jody


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## Geo (Apr 30, 2002)

morepower2 said:


> *yeah I asctualy feel that there is a limited comercial need for this product, george? nudge, nudge! *


It's on the docket Mike. I agree, there is a need for this and I'm quite certain I can get them produced for far less than what is currently available. I've talked with my machinist already and it should be plenty easy to do. My biggest problem at the moment is while I have plenty of spare blocks, I don't have any spare heads around. I traded one a long time ago, and my other is still at JWT. I'll see if I can find someone around here to let me borrow one. I'm sure in an afternoon I could get one drawn up and with another afternoon of checking the prototype we'd be all set.

I'll start looking for a head to borrow.


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## BORNGEARHEAD (Apr 30, 2002)

1fastser said:


> *Is it the bolt-down kind?
> 
> Jody *


Yes. It is like 6" x6" steel, 1/4" thick. It bolts down in the 4 corners to the head. The middle has a hole for the dial indicator.

I hope you were asking me.


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## Geo (Apr 30, 2002)

BORNGEARHEAD said:


> *Yes. It is like 6" x6" steel, 1/4" thick. It bolts down in the 4 corners to the head. The middle has a hole for the dial indicator.
> 
> I hope you were asking me. *


Bingo!

That's the one.

Jody, now that you have the correct part number, will you post the price when you call Kent-Moore?

If it's outrageous, I'll pursue making one. Otherwise, I'll probably just buy one.

BTW, BGH where does it bolt to? I was figuring the cam journal caps' bolt holes.


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

Geo said:


> *I don't have any spare heads around.
> I'll start looking for a head to borrow. *


I have two. Take your pick.

I'll check on that price.

laterz...Jody


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

Geo said:


> *That's the one.
> 
> Jody, now that you have the correct part number, will you post the price when you call Kent-Moore?
> 
> If it's outrageous, I'll pursue making one. Otherwise, I'll probably just buy one.*


$347.27  *whistles*

Like I said Geo, I have two, take your pick. You can *have* one...just comp me a tool when you make them.  

The price for new rocker arm guides, the machinists cost for measuring shim heighth, and new shims will still be cheaper than buying the tool.  

laterz...Jody


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## jbanach77 (Jun 11, 2002)

damn that is pricy, i am already getting kicked repeatidly in the nuts cause of EIP Tuning. if i would have found that tool for them they would have still funked up my motor somehow.


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## Geo (Apr 30, 2002)

1fastser said:


> *$347.27  *whistles*
> 
> Like I said Geo, I have two, take your pick. You can have one...just comp me a tool when you make them.
> 
> ...


I think I already have one lined up, but I might take you up on it. I have absolutely no doubt we can do something better than that. I'll start looking at raw materials. It may take a bit of time because I have two projects that I'm racing (no pun intended) to have done by my race in January. Then again, perhaps I should just take a road trip to Austin and pick one up. It won't be hard to produce, but I have to get some measurements and angles just right.


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

I have several HLA's beggin to be bored, too. 

Both heads are assembled. I know it won't matter...just a bonus.

Kent-Moore is sending me a catalog of their 'nissan tools'.

laterz...Jody


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## Geo (Apr 30, 2002)

1fastser said:


> *I have several HLA's beggin to be bored, too.
> 
> Both heads are assembled. I know it won't matter...just a bonus.
> 
> ...


What I will have built will not require an HVLA (in fact, I have extras floating around). I will have the plate style built. Much more user friendly and far more repeatable.


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## BORNGEARHEAD (Apr 30, 2002)

Geo said:


> *What I will have built will not require an HVLA (in fact, I have extras floating around). I will have the plate style built. Much more user friendly and far more repeatable. *


I agree.


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## morepower2 (Apr 19, 2002)

Geo said:


> *What I will have built will not require an HVLA (in fact, I have extras floating around). I will have the plate style built. Much more user friendly and far more repeatable. *


I'll buy one!

Mike


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

Geo said:


> *What I will have built will not require an HVLA (in fact, I have extras floating around). I will have the plate style built. Much more user friendly and far more repeatable. *


True.

Anything like what we discussed at the rally? i.e. the plate is long enough to measure one side (intake or exhaust) without unbolting the plate.

....just wondering.

laterz...Jody


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## jbanach77 (Jun 11, 2002)

as long as i can use it on my gti-r motor and it is reasonable, i am in on a group purchase, definately!!!


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## Geo (Apr 30, 2002)

1fastser said:


> *True.
> 
> Anything like what we discussed at the rally? i.e. the plate is long enough to measure one side (intake or exhaust) without unbolting the plate.
> 
> ...


I'll have to see about that. It would certainly add to the material and machining costs. It would almost certainly have to be anodized and I suspect that would add to the cost as well. It would be ideal to be able to do a whole side at once though.

I need to get my hands on a head first. Dwayne has one locally, but the engine is still together. Damn, I wish I'd have thought about this before last weekend.


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## Geo (Apr 30, 2002)

jbanach77 said:


> *as long as i can use it on my gti-r motor and it is reasonable, i am in on a group purchase, definately!!! *


1) I don't have a GTi-R head

2) Do you even need one for the GTi-R?


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## SuckiT (Jun 13, 2002)

Geo said:


> *1) I don't have a GTi-R head
> 
> 2) Do you even need one for the GTi-R? *


Come over to NYC and you wouldnt ask that question. Out of the 7 Gti-r engines, I think only 2 of them are quiet. The rest including mine have to be reshimmed!


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## Geo (Apr 30, 2002)

SuckiT said:


> *Come over to NYC and you wouldnt ask that question. Out of the 7 Gti-r engines, I think only 2 of them are quiet. The rest including mine have to be reshimmed! *


I'm not familiar with the GTi-R head.

OK, who wants to send me one. 

Actually, once we have a decent prototype, I might be willing to ship it to someone to see if it works. Mike, I'm sure you have access to a GTi-R head that is stripped down, don't you? If so, that would tell us if the basic layout is the same. I think it should be, but who knows (I don't)?


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## jbanach77 (Jun 11, 2002)

the only quiet on i have heard is a stock one. every aftermarket head or built motor for a gti-r i have heard they have been NOISY beyond belief. i am scared to drive my car hard cause of the noise.


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## 1fastser (Sep 30, 2002)

1fastser said:


> *At the machine shop, I doubt that I specified the stems to be ground to the same height as that would have made it a little easier.*


And it came back to bite me in the backside! Having the valve job brought the valves slightly deeper in the head thus making the valve stems sit higher. The result: The smallest shim recommended (2.8mm I believe) is too tall, bringing the overall height out of spec! 

I'm having the stems that are too tall ground down now. The saga continues.

laterz...Jody


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