# all-motor GA16



## rkeith (Jan 12, 2003)

Im just curious about this:

Using all the parts available for the GA16, how fast would a completely all motor GA16 200sx run (1/4 mile)??
Also, does anyone have a complete list of the motor--no FI--upgrades available for the GA16?


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## kbrassfi (Aug 1, 2002)

http://www.sentra.net/tech/garage/engine.php?S=3172ed2291c3b2d20cab7d932f526ecc
This article has most of them.


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

I don't think it would be very quick.You'd be lucky to get it into the 15's-maybe high 14's.Problem is, you are dealing with only like 90 cubic inches of dispalcement.In order to make power with an internal combustion engine, you need to be able to convert fuel into energy. 90 CI of displacement limits how much fuel you can pull into the cylinders per intake stroke.A turbo, supercharger or nitrous allow you to ingest more fuel/air mixture in each stroke,thereby giving you "artificial displacement" .In other words, the engine ingests ther same amount of air that a larger engine would.This is why it is easier to make power with a larger engine.Not to offend anyone here, but if you want to go fast for cheap,N/A,it is easier done in a RWD domestic V8 car than an import.For example, you can put together a streetable pump gas N/A Chevy 350CI with cheap readily available parts for around $2500 that will make over 400hp and at least 350 ft lbs of torque. The same power level from an import ( I.E. an SR20DET with upgraded turbo,intercooler,injectors,computer, cams,ignition, etc.) will run 2-3 times as much money and require far more sophisticated tuning than the larger engine would( a correctly sized 4 bbl carb and HEI ignition can be set up by almost anyone with a timing light and a screwdriver!).Both will require around the same amount of fuel to make that power too,since power is produced via the fuel->energy conversion(although the SR20 will have less parasitic losses than the SBC).This is not meant to dissuade you from trying but rather to give you some perspective on the whole thing.Again, nothing against imports they just aren't usually very cheap to build fast cars out of-especially ones that have limited aftermarket support.


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## holy200sx (Jan 8, 2003)

word!..

The price of a fully NA 1.6 liter would cost about the price of a nicely setup sR20det bluebird engine..


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## rkeith (Jan 12, 2003)

I dont plan on doing this, I just had way too much free time and curiosity got the best of me.... would it be possible to bore out a 1.6? or is the engine at its max size?....


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

The only other option I can think of for a decent N/A 1.6 liter engine is a SR16VE N1-197 hp,123 ft lb torque.But still not cheap. In my opinion, an all motor GA16DE is not worth your time and effort.You can't really bore it out much either-maybe another 2-5 CI(Remember my 350 Chevy(5.7lt) example? at .060 max overbore it only grows to 360 ci(5.9 lt)-and that's with 8 cylinders!)It would cost you at least around $600-900 to do correctly(assuming you do all your own assembly work and only need pistons,rings,gaskets,hot tanking,rebalancing, boring and honing) for only about a 1-5 hp gain.Do a SR20DET swap-it's cheaper and easier to mod later on.


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## rkeith (Jan 12, 2003)

rkeith said:


> *I dont plan on doing this, I just had way too much free time and curiosity got the best of me.... *


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

rkeith said:


>


Me too, that's why I made these posts!I just love to explain stuff.


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## sathid (May 22, 2003)

hi all.
i just came across this post, whislt looking for information on boring out a GA16DE and putting the crank from a GA18DE in it, to make it a GA19de.
i'm from australia, and theres been talk about it on our pulsar forum recently.

apparently it produces more torque than an SR20DE and is better suited to boosting because of the cast iron block. cept it has weak rods, or something.
just thought that was relevant to this post, as i saw someone mention boring out.

i was told that there was information on NPM about it
but i dont know what NPM is. lol


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## NissanTuner (Dec 1, 2002)

boosting a VE requires work to drop compression. they compress at something like 11:1 or 12:1, slapping a turbo on a VE without this work would be wasted money and a large horsepower sink. The aftermarket support for a VE is almost entirely exclusive to Japan as well, since the motors are not installed in any US Spec cars. So modding out a VE can be time consuming, expensive, and at best, difficult to source parts.

But for a 204hp 175lb torque n/a motor out of the box, ill deal with the support shortcomings


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

sathid said:


> *hi all.
> i just came across this post, whislt looking for information on boring out a GA16DE and putting the crank from a GA18DE in it, to make it a GA19de.
> i'm from australia, and theres been talk about it on our pulsar forum recently.
> 
> ...


what year was the GA18DE put out in austrailia? Do you know what the model number of the transmissions on it are, both automatic and manual? COuld you please PM me or email me this information if you have it? Thank you!


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## Guest (May 22, 2003)

sathid, npm= Nissan Performance Magazine. It's a very good free online mag and they sponsor this forum www.nissanperformancemag.com


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

NissanTuner said:


> *boosting a VE requires work to drop compression. they compress at something like 11:1 or 12:1, slapping a turbo on a VE without this work would be wasted money and a large horsepower sink. *


Actually, the high compression wouldn't be a "horsepower sink' as you stated but rather would produce excessive cylinder pressure and run into a ton of detonation-that's why you can't run boost on high compresion engines.If you had fuel of a high enough octane rating(and pistons that had sufficient space between the crown and top ring land)it would be possible to run it with a turbo.In fact, the world's first production turbo car(put into production the same year as the Corvair Monza Spyder with it's turbocharged flat 6)the 1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire with a 215 aluminum V8 had 10:1 compresion to compensate for a heavy turbine and excessive lag and the resultant low speed driveability problems.It required "Turbo-Rocket Fuel" every 2 weeks to stave off detonation.This was a production alcohol injection system to cool the combustion chambers.


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## niky (Jul 20, 2002)

there actually was a GA20 awhile back, but i don't know about the compatibility with the GA16, but the heads on the GA range fit between 1.3 to 1.8, so it might be possible to bore out your block and use this... i have not talked to a mechanic yet who is comfortable with boring out the GA16 to more than 1.7liters, though, so the GA18 head swap sounds pretty good.

You might be able to get more out of headwork than Mike Kojima stated in his article, but I don't know by how much. I've seen bone-stock looking GA16s wipe out 160hp SiR Hondas with nothing but NA mods.

BTW, james, GA18s and above are damn hard to find.


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## niky (Jul 20, 2002)

by the way, sathid, you aren't getting any info on the GA18 here... NEVER USED in America.


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## rios (Jun 10, 2002)

please enlighten us with tales of the other ga engines!


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

Yeah, what was the GA20 used in?Only other GA I had ever heard of was the GA15 that was used in some of the Sunny's as a base engine, I believe.I wonder if there is an importer who can get one of the bigger 1.8 or 2.0 engines here?


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

searched last night, the GA18DE was used on european versions of the Primera in the P11 generation. no info on details. 

you can't bore out the 1.6 more than a few thousands which will barely do anything for you. I remember someone bored out a ga and stuffed it with mazda pistons off a 323. 

GA20? Well I'm just interested in the tranny really could care less about the motor, if I wanted to swap it wouldn't be for another ga series motor!

anyone know the part number for the tranny pump on the sr20det automatic?


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## rios (Jun 10, 2002)

i saw it on a website lising it for 91-94 b13s jdm


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## sathid (May 22, 2003)

hi guys,
the GA18DE came in um...let me think
some of the N15 model pulsars, and i think they've either put it into the new N16 or it could be a QG18DE in that...
when they fazed out the SR20DE from the pulsar lineup (after 1997 i think) they moved to using 1.8l's which i'm pretty sure, at least first time round was the GA18DE.

the guys in new zealand see just about every car ever made in japan, because thier government has really soft import laws (i.e. they dont tax imports much, so they get them CHEAP)
theres guys driving VZ-R's around there (N15 pulsar with SR20VE)
theres one guy with one here....but i dont know how he got it.
lol

unfortunately i dont have much information on the GA19DE conversion yet, but the guy on my forum who told me about it, said there r guys in the US who have done it....
or something...
but i'm trying to find out more from him atm.


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## landlord (Jun 11, 2002)

ga20de, i looked it up it does exist ( i was in denile for a little bit) i gotta have one! not for the power, i cant find the specs, but just to say i have a 2.0 and its a ga! any one know of an importer that can find non popular engines!


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

I agree! The pure weirdness of it makes it something I'd love to have!(that and I hope it'd make my sorry B14 a little quicker without the trouble of changing EVERYTHING like an SR swap!) Oh, and James, you couldn't use the tranny anyways since it is a GA trans and you need a SR trans-like from a SR16VE or SR20DE to put it in your car.The SR20DET or SR20VE trans won't work-DET is AWD and VE is a CVT.


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## landlord (Jun 11, 2002)

himilefrontier said:


> * Oh, and James, you couldn't use the tranny anyways since it is a GA trans and you need a SR trans-like from a SR16VE or SR20DE to put it in your car.The SR20DET or SR20VE trans won't work-DET is AWD and VE is a CVT. *


james has a ga16de the tranny should work. the only difference is that james has turboed his ga!


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

I didn't realize that the 2 engines shared the same bellhousing bolt pattern.I guess you learn something every day!(and, duh, I should've read his proifile)


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## landlord (Jun 11, 2002)

himilefrontier said:


> *I didn't realize that the 2 engines shared the same bellhousing bolt pattern.I guess you learn something every day!(and, duh, I should've read his proifile) *


yeah, any ga series engine should bolt up to any ga tranny, wether or not the tranny fits in a sentra or 200sx thats another story.


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

So, does this all mean that a GA and an SR both have the same mounting face for the bellhousing?


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## landlord (Jun 11, 2002)

himilefrontier said:


> *So, does this all mean that a GA and an SR both have the same mounting face for the bellhousing? *



no. i was only talking about the ga block.

any ga tranny should bolt up to a ga block. no other series engine would be able to bolt up to a ga block or vice versa.

i thought we were primarily talking about ga's but ill have to re-read the thread, to see if im causing confusion.


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

He had mentioned something about a SR front pump, and that's what led me to believe he was swapping trannies.


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## niky (Jul 20, 2002)

sorry, forgot to check this thread.



> any ga tranny should bolt up to a ga block. no other series engine would be able to bolt up to a ga block or vice versa.


i agree with this, but i have yet to check about the GA18, as I have no sample to work with! GA16 heads fit the lower range just fine.

GA13s and 14s (79-90 hp, carb'd) are used in lower end Sentra applications throughout asia, and are basically old GA equipment stuck onto smaller bore blocks... imagine a "dirt-cheap" econo-engine with twincams and chain timing... weird!

GA15s (110 hp with efi) were also on Jap.Sunny/Sentra and Wingroads (4wd sentras)

GA18s (120xx? not sure) are in japanese-model cars mostly, I think the american 1.8 is the newer QG.

GA20s (130 hp, carb'd) , i've only seen them on 89-90xx Jap.spec Maximas, and NOWHERE ELSE. I've searched online for the engine and came up with zip (just some russian surplus lots). They're approximately the same size as other GAs, and may fit Sentras, but they're damn hard to get... most jap.surplus is GA15s, 16s and 18s.

One last note, I got a mechanic friend of mine to look at the GA20, and the oil galleries are in *the wrong place for a head or block swap*. Sorry...  

If you want a GA20, they're pretty hard to find, but 89body Maximas here go for almost scrap prices (900-1500$), so the engines are probably worth very little.


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

May be worth it,considering that they are almost the same HP as a SR20DE(130 GA vs 140 SR),with a less sophisticated fuel and ignition system.If the USDM manifold and distributor will bolt up,it could be a inexpensive alternative to the SR20DE swap.If they are truly almost valueless in the market,I'll definitely have to try it. I just wonder if other GA parts will interchange-like aftermarket cams and headers.


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

any info on the tranny model number? can you do me the HUGE favor and see if you can find out? I don't even know where to begin to look for it!


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## landlord (Jun 11, 2002)

ok ok, the ga20de was in a Y10 sunny wagon also, it is fuel injected, and was as far as i can tell sold in germany and russia. im looking into it farther and i have a few importers looking into it (they never heard of it either. ) if i can get one of these cheap enough, i may get one just to see what parts are interchangeable from the ga16, and to see if i can get in in my car.

james, i've asked about tranny info also as soon as i find somthing ill let you know.


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## niky (Jul 20, 2002)

this is too funny... it would be something to see a Sentra with a 14 year old engine!!!

It's hard to find GA20s in any condition, as most cars i've seen them in are in junkyard condition. I've heard of GA20 Maxs' being run after six years of sitting in place, so the engines are at least THAT tough. I'm going to the local surplus center this week to bring in my car for an SR20 conversion... I'll look around and see about GA20 availability... hell, who knows? they might be damn cheaper to run!


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## himilefrontier (Jan 21, 2003)

Yeah, it'd be kinda cool to build a GA20DET!Or even see how much power you could make N/A for spare change if they are really cheap!


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## darkelf (Jul 24, 2003)

I've been seraching for ga18de's and nearest match I could find to import in Mexico or Russia (I am Australian) Actually most of the matches I had were located in Mexico (that I could read or have my housemate read. He speaks Spanish) We are looking for ga18de cranks and pistons to mess with in our spare ga16de blocks. Once turbo charged they should be a fun project to give the regular sr20 guys a bit of a scare here in Brisbane. If anyone here can find a way to source the cranks in Mexico pleae email me. 


oh and by the way, some of the n15 pulsars in Japan come as a 4wd so you could make a ga18det 4wd. Just think on that... sweet huh  Looking at importing options now... hehe

cheers,
Mark


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## BLOWN 1.6 (Sep 20, 2003)

*(HELP) GA16DE PARTS NEEDED BAD.*

WELL SEE WHAT HAD HAPPEN WAS I WAS DRIVEN AND THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN MY PISTONS SHOT THROUGH THE BLOCK. THEY DIDNT FLY THROUGH THEY JUST PIERCED THE BLOCK , I CAN STILL SEE THE PISTONS STICKIN OUT. NOW WHAT ALL WOULD I NEED TO DO TO GET THAT FIXED I FIGURE THAT I NEED A NEW ENGINE BLOCK AND PISTONS , BUT IS THERE ANYONE WHO COULD TELL ME WHERE I CAN GET THOSE PIECES FOR A REASONABLE PRICE!


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## niky (Jul 20, 2002)

simply... get a full short or long block and swap it in... ask at your local junkyard or find a mechanic... these engines aren't hard to find. 

...stop typing in all caps... It Does Hurt The Eyes... 

...and DON'T threadjack!!!  stay on topic! If you need a new motor, please post in the classifieds or SEARCH the forum!


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## BLOWN 1.6 (Sep 20, 2003)

okay so ill hit up a junkyard and just ask for a a full short or long block for a ga16de 1.6 and what about the pistons will it come with the whole block? and thanks alot for your help bro.


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