# Question on Tokico Struts



## Jer_ry (Apr 27, 2005)

I was looking around and saw a sight on Tokico HP Gas struts for my B14 they stated they work well with lowering springs needed to find out if thats true or if they are stock size and someone just wanted to make money. Thanks.


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## af200sx/se-r (Dec 26, 2004)

Jer_ry said:


> I was looking around and saw a sight on Tokico HP Gas struts for my B14 they stated they work well with lowering springs needed to find out if thats true or if they are stock size and someone just wanted to make money. Thanks.


The struts are not good for anything other then stock springs.
The only good springs for the b14 are Hypercos, but those are impossible to find (limited production).
Tein basics or Koni shocks w/ lowering springs is the cheapest and safest way to lower the b14.


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## Jer_ry (Apr 27, 2005)

af200sx/se-r said:


> The struts are not good for anything other then stock springs.
> The only good springs for the b14 are Hypercos, but those are impossible to find (limited production).
> Tein basics or Koni shocks w/ lowering springs is the cheapest and safest way to lower the b14.


Cool i was unaware koni struts would work with lowering springs. What is the name of them or would any koni's work? Thanks.


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## Shawn B (Oct 5, 2005)

Jer_ry said:


> Cool i was unaware koni struts would work with lowering springs. What is the name of them or would any koni's work? Thanks.


IIRC, there is a write-up of how to custom shorten the Koni's on SR20Forum.com in the Tech Section.


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## Jer_ry (Apr 27, 2005)

Shawn B said:


> IIRC, there is a write-up of how to custom shorten the Koni's on SR20Forum.com in the Tech Section.


 Ahh rats you gotta do crazy stuff to em...So i take it Agx's are still the only shortened struts they make for our cars. Seems weird that less metal costs much much more....


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## Shawn B (Oct 5, 2005)

Jer_ry said:


> Ahh rats you gotta do crazy stuff to em...So i take it Agx's are still the only shortened struts they make for our cars. Seems weird that less metal costs much much more....


AGX's are not shortened. They are OEM length.


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## Jer_ry (Apr 27, 2005)

Shawn B said:


> AGX's are not shortened. They are OEM length.


Then why are they so ideal for lowering springs? I'm pretty sure i saw a guide that showed oem and agx's next to each other and the agx's were a lot shorter...


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## LucinoSR20 (Aug 30, 2005)

so i cant use my tok HP's with my tien s tech, or my sportlines? thats not what ive been told, and not what ive read.

i thought these springs were made tto OEM fit, but spring rates were diffrent.... i could be wrong though.


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## LucinoSR20 (Aug 30, 2005)

cmon guys... need more info hehehehe


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## Shawn B (Oct 5, 2005)

Jer_ry said:


> Then why are they so ideal for lowering springs? I'm pretty sure i saw a guide that showed oem and agx's next to each other and the agx's were a lot shorter...


AGX's are not ideal by any means, and they are indeed the stock length. They are cheap, externally adjustable, stronger than stock so they can handle higher spring rates, and very effective if paired with Hypercos. They would also work well with your stock OEM springs. 

The ideal _street-only_ suspension is shortened Koni's with Hypercos.


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## 98Midnight (Apr 23, 2004)

Tokico struts are good quality and can be used with lowering springs. I have HPs with Tein H Techs on my Toyota. After 45,000 miles they still ride great.
Read this right of the friggin' Tokico website:

Q. Will other springs work with TOKICO shocks?
A. TOKICO shock absorbers have quite a wide range of performance. They are designed to work with original springs or with a wide range of performance lowering springs. However if the spring is not designed properly no shock will work correctly. TOKICO shocks will tend to give the best performance and ride quality when used with original or TOKICO springs. 

Q. How low can I go?
A. The amount a vehicle can be safely lowered varies by make and model. Cars can generally be lowered by 1 or 2 inches. Some trucks can be lowered by as much as 6 inches. Excessive lowering can and does cause a number of problems. Suspension was designed to allow the tires to move independently from the chassis. If too much travel is removed due to excess lowering, or springs that are too stiff, problems can range from a harsh ride to actual damage to vehicle components. 

Some of the problems include: 

1. Harsh ride with poor adhesion
2. Excess wear on CV or U-joints
3. Poor alignment
4. Shock failure
5. Stress cracks in the chassis or suspension
6. Excess noise and rattles in the chassis
7. A dangerous lack of control on rough roads


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## shift_of_legend (Jun 2, 2004)

Ok, I've done extensive research and a little testing. The testing I did was with a B14 equipped with megan racing lowering springs (280front, 250rear) with tokico hp shocks. The car handled great but the lowering springs were too low (2" drop). The car bottomed out on any abrupt/rigid pot hole. There were suprisingly pot holes that the car didn't bottom out on and actually felt comfortable. The best thing I noticed though was, no matter how hard you drove and what surface you went over, the car went exactly where you pointed it, meaning that the wheels were always planted. This being said, I believe that the best way to setup a budget suspension for street use is as follows.

Tokico HP, with kyb or energy suspension bump stops, Tein H.tech springs, with polyurethane coil spacers at the front to raise the front 3/4 - 1 inch.

Reason for the lift only in the front is that the rear is rated at 250 lbs @0.6" drop. While the front is 190lbs 2" drop. The front is soft and too low. Jack that up to give you only a 1" drop and you should be fine.

The bump stops will soften any bottoming out blows saving the shocks, preventing premature blow out.


You have to do some measuring, because there are no b14 specific spacers. Get the inner and outer diameter of the coil and chose based on that.

I know guys who use modified Integra coilovers on their B14's because it's easier to get 325fr/300rr spring rates (HP cannot be used with these rates). I asked how they modify them and they say they get the piece that the shock body goes through machined to fit the sentra strut and that's all. I'll try it myself and confirm before someone else tries it and screws up their ride.

This site shows a chart with the different measurements for the various spcaers ES offers
http://www.energysuspension.com/pages/sboots.html

more spacers
http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/a...4b9ce6d&apwkwd=Energy+Susp+Coil+Spring+Spacer

bump stops from ES
http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/a...51W43c5024b9ce6d&apwkwd=Energy+Susp+Bump+Stop


I hope this helps, and I hope I don't get flamed.




Miscellaneous links

http://store.summitracing.com/default.asp?target=egnsearch.asp&N=115+401077+318648&autoview=sku

http://www.thepartsbin.com/sitemap/energy_susp~coil_spring_spacer~parts.html


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## Jer_ry (Apr 27, 2005)

shift_of_legend the "testing" you did with the tokico hp shocks were they mounted striaght from the box? or did you do all that crazy modifing that was mentioned earlier in the thread?


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## shift_of_legend (Jun 2, 2004)

Jer_ry said:


> shift_of_legend the "testing" you did with the tokico hp shocks were they mounted striaght from the box? or did you do all that crazy modifing that was mentioned earlier in the thread?


no none of the above mentioned mods were done. After using the megan springs tokico hp combo, I went researching into the shocks. I couldn't understand why a shock would be sold and successfully marketed for so many years as a high performance shock yet still bottom out like that. After alot of research, I realised Tokico HP only give warranty for a max drop of 1.5" and Mike Kojima doesn't recommend less than 1" drop no matter what stock height aftermarket shocks you use.

What lead me to thinking that there must be a more affordable way, was trying to figure out how to raise the springs on the car to meet that 1" front and 0.6" drop recommendation. I love the megan spring rates,but the drop will not work with any unshortened shocks. When you look under the car while it's sitting, you only see half an inch of travel.

At first we contemplated moving the spring chair up an inch, but I feared it not being done properly by the machinists near me. Then I thought by some cheapo coilovers and either buy 8inch race springs from, eibach, hyperco, skunk, tein or swift springs. That would still not be cost effective.

I then started wodnering what if I put something to space the springs to add back the heaight? I thought if I could get some rubber of polyurethane and cut it to the dimensions I need I could do it. But no one sells polyurethane in thick pads that I know of.

I found a site where poeple use cutting boards (they are made of polyurethane) but I decided hell no am going to use some ghetto cutting boards shaped out to fit the chair and shocks. So I search for ready made spacers and found the links I posted and thought hey, this could really work. I am yet to measure the springs on the B14 though to see if any of these spacers would work, so it's still a theory.

The only think that isn't theory is the bump stops. Get KYB or ES progressive bump stops. They work wonders, even on bad suspension setups. You barely feel when you bottom out. Atleast, it doesn' feel like a swift kick in your back with 20lb caterpillar construction boots.


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## Jer_ry (Apr 27, 2005)

I couldnt help but notice the link for the ES bump stops takes you to the ones for Application: 1988 - 1988 Oldsmobile Cutlass. When i input the information for the b14's i cannot find them..


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## shift_of_legend (Jun 2, 2004)

Here are some universal bump stops

http://www.energysuspension.com/pages/sk_bsp1.html


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## Jer_ry (Apr 27, 2005)

Which ones would you use? Sorry to sound like such a newb just don't know what to look for, when i replaced my springs last week I didnt see anything like this anywhere I don;t think mine have any bumpstops on them i don't even know where they go i will have to look that up. I think it would be a good idea to order some of these too since i have new struts ordered :thumbup:


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## shift_of_legend (Jun 2, 2004)

Oh I didn't even realise you were a newb. You should have let a professional do it, but aint nothing wrong with doing these things yourself. 

The Bump stop fits over the shiny metal rod that goes up and down into the shock body. The bump stop fits over that before you intall the shock. Measure that slender shiny rods diameter and look in the chart for the inner diameter of the bumpstops. That will tell you if it fits. Choose a bump stop that gets thicker from top to bottom to get the progressive effect.

Remember, if the inner diameter of the bumpstop is the same or bigger than the rod it will work.


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## shift_of_legend (Jun 2, 2004)

I'm going to do some measurements tonight and tell you which one of these you should try. I'm also going to fidn some koni and KYB bump stops as well. I know koni makes really good ones. If you can find the bumpstops from the classic se-r b13 they use koni I think.

http://www.energysuspension.com/media2/9_6109.jpg
http://www.energysuspension.com/media2/9_6110.jpg
http://www.energysuspension.com/media2/9_6111.jpg
http://www.energysuspension.com/media2/7_6104.jpg


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## Jer_ry (Apr 27, 2005)

Just because i've never worked on suspension before dosent mean that I'm an idiot though  I love doing the work....actually it's not work to me i like every minute of it just putting in wrong parts is what worries me.


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## Shawn B (Oct 5, 2005)

Koni makes the best bumpstops. Very progressive.

I am pretty sure you can buy them from Tire Rack, I got mine from Motivational Engineering. Sixty eight bucks shipped.


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## shift_of_legend (Jun 2, 2004)

sorry if I came off as calling you an idiot, didn't mean to make you feel insulted. I should have said, if you're not confident then let some who knows what they are doing to it.

If you are confident then just do it.

It's all about measurement.

Back when none of these thing were made the old school guys got good results just judgin for measuring and estimation.

as the saying goes measure twice cut once.


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## shift_of_legend (Jun 2, 2004)

THIS BUGS ME because last year tokico said they hadn't made these for the B14 but nopi is selling it for the B14. I try to get the spring rates but I can't find them any where. I keep wondering if they are rebadge eibachs. They say 1" drop, but some how I don't believe them. If anyone has any info on these please let me know.

http://www.nopionline.com/nopistore...6&vnopinum=598+0417&vTitle=NISSAN Sentra 1996


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## shift_of_legend (Jun 2, 2004)

I only see kyb boot kit and strut mount kits? they come with bump stops, but nothing beats koni as shawn B said.
http://www.tirerack.com/suspension/...ntra+GLE&autoYear=1996&autoModClar=&brand=all


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## LucinoSR20 (Aug 30, 2005)

Let you in on a secret... MOST springs will be rebadged Eibachs.


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## LucinoSR20 (Aug 30, 2005)

getting my blues tomorrow... due for delivery... and ive had my s-techs for a while. Ill give you guys update on the ride... My car will dramatically change in ride hight though im sure. Ill take before and after pictures.


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