# 510 Spring Rates



## nizmo559 (Mar 4, 2003)

Trying to figure out what kind of suspension to aim for. Looking for something thats more streetable than track ready. Some where in between I guess you could say. I have read that for front spring rates with the 280 coil over set up you should aim for 250lb/in-300lb/in. As for the rear you could do a full coil over or just get the spring from either eibach, suspension tech, ermish-racing or specialty engineering at 800lb/in-1100lb/in. Sounds kinda crazy for the rear but I guess the length and how its positioned factors in to the equation for this car. You guys have any suggestions or hear of some other options?


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## datman55 (Dec 13, 2004)

In my track car, I ran 375 pound fronts and 800 pound rears. If I was going for a good street set-up....300 pound fronts (max) and maybe 650-700 pound rears.


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## nizmo559 (Mar 4, 2003)

Who made your springs datman? Do you happen to know the lenghth of the rear spring also?


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## datman55 (Dec 13, 2004)

I used eibach springs.....we had coilovers on the front. Not sure of the length.

This link has pics of the front struts we used. I supply a kit here in Australia for converting standard struts to coilovers.

Race car web site


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## nizmo559 (Mar 4, 2003)

Dude thats awsome write up. I have'nt found anything like that so detailed here in the States.


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## datman55 (Dec 13, 2004)

Thanks dude, if I can help you out at all....just ask away, more than happy to share info.


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## nizmo559 (Mar 4, 2003)

Thanks man i'm slowly but surely gonna get my car together. Supposed to check out some coilover kits at http://www.ermish-racing.com./ tomorrow in Fremont, Ca. I hear lots of good things about them.


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## datman55 (Dec 13, 2004)

Looks like good stuff......


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## SVP5TEN (Apr 27, 2004)

datman55 said:


> In my track car, I ran 375 pound fronts and 800 pound rears. If I was going for a good street set-up....300 pound fronts (max) and maybe 650-700 pound rears.


correct me if im wrong. i didnt know you can run spring rates that high in the rear. to me the spring rates sound like a dragcar set up. i know 300 pounds max at rear is correct, but for the rear their is much weight to support. can to clarify that for me?. thanks.
patrick


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## SVP5TEN (Apr 27, 2004)

nizmo559 said:


> Thanks man i'm slowly but surely gonna get my car together. Supposed to check out some coilover kits at http://www.ermish-racing.com./ tomorrow in Fremont, Ca. I hear lots of good things about them.


im also getting my set up from troy. its a good set up cause he also makes a rear coil over set up, that i really dont see much of today. tell me what he quotes you. haha. 
patrick


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## nizmo559 (Mar 4, 2003)

Cool place its about 15 minutes away from San Jose in Fremont. He had a couple swooped up 510's in almost every flavor. The coilovers look awsome.


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## datman55 (Dec 13, 2004)

SVP5TEN...the reason for the higher springrate is due to the design of the 510 swing arms, and where the spring is placed. 

It's been a couple of years since I sold my 510, so the exact numbers may be a little out, but the principle is the same.......

Because the spring is placed between the wheel and the swing arm pivot point, you get a leverage effect on the spring. Because of this leverage effect, the actual springrate needs to be about (memory fading) 3 times the "wheel rate". Because the front springs do not have this leverage effect, the "wheel rate" is the same as the Spring rate. 

If we were talking purely wheel rates, I would say 150-200lb on the rear would be fine for the street....that equates roughly to a 600lb spring rate (assuming 3:1)

That's the basic priniciple, I'm sure someone here could certainly correct the actual maths.


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## nizmo559 (Mar 4, 2003)

Yea Datman thats what I have read because of the way the spring sits you can go a higher rate basically.

Well when I emailed http://www.ermish-racing.com. requesting a spring rate of #850-#1000 I think they thought I was crazy. But from what I was reading over on 510realm.com a lot of the guys over there do just buy the spring its self non coil over at those rates and have a pretty nice firm ride.

Unfortunately http://www.ermish-racing.com. can only get as high as #850 for the rear.

They did say they could get the rear coil over in the #900-1000 range but thats at the wheel and not spring.

So I was thinking why not go 280zx coilover (spring rate unknown for now) #850 spring in the Rear. 

Is what im saying make sense its 1:37 am over here in Cali.


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## datman55 (Dec 13, 2004)

*You got it...I think.*

The thing you have to be careful of is where your rear coil over is going to located on the swing arm. If it is in the same location as the standard spring then 800lb springs will be fine....pretty firm.....but fine. (just make sure your back teeth are in good...they may rattle themselves loose!)

If the coilover is connected closer to the wheel, the spring rate needs to be less, as the closer to wheel you go, the closer to the "wheel rate" you get. In simple terms....the closer to the wheel, the lower the spring rate.

The reason the other guys might have thought you were a little crazy was, the are probably talking wheel rates....you need to confirm this with them, as 800lb wheel rates are not crazy...they are for the clinicaly insane (ie. have all teeth removed professionally prior to them falling out from the vibrations though the car!)

BTW...I'll be in your neighbourhood tomorrow......coming over to visit you guys for a few weeks.


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## nizmo559 (Mar 4, 2003)

Oh really where abouts?


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## datman55 (Dec 13, 2004)

*Trip*

Actually just passing through L.A. ---- on my way to Dallas, and then up to Missouri and Iowa....Doing a road trip from Dallas.


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## SVP5TEN (Apr 27, 2004)

datman55 said:


> SVP5TEN...the reason for the higher springrate is due to the design of the 510 swing arms, and where the spring is placed.
> 
> It's been a couple of years since I sold my 510, so the exact numbers may be a little out, but the principle is the same.......
> 
> ...


datman thanks for clearing that up. i was thinking one wheel spring rates. when you brought up the equation it seemed correct. thanks for the clarification.


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## SVP5TEN (Apr 27, 2004)

datman55 said:


> The thing you have to be careful of is where your rear coil over is going to located on the swing arm. If it is in the same location as the standard spring then 800lb springs will be fine....pretty firm.....but fine. (just make sure your back teeth are in good...they may rattle themselves loose!)
> 
> If the coilover is connected closer to the wheel, the spring rate needs to be less, as the closer to wheel you go, the closer to the "wheel rate" you get. In simple terms....the closer to the wheel, the lower the spring rate.
> 
> ...


in nizmo and my case the spring rate would be less for the rears using the coil over set up from troys. its a coil-over with a strut insert.where the original spring sits is now illegitimate. the coil over is positioned more near the wheel.


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