# Crack on radiator top, repair or replace?



## andym (May 24, 2004)

Hello. There is a crack on my radiator, on the top between the cap and the side. Can I repair this or replace it? I don't have much money so I'd rather repair it. The radiator actually looks like plastic in this area. I was thinking of melting it closed with a soldering iron and maybe putting some epoxy seal over/into it.

If it's plastic over metal, I do have some good quality silver solder which I could use. I also have a very small arc welder (which I haven't yet learned to use). Any assistance here would be appreciated.


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## Asleep (Jan 19, 2003)

andym said:


> Hello. There is a crack on my radiator, on the top between the cap and the side. Can I repair this or replace it? I don't have much money so I'd rather repair it. The radiator actually looks like plastic in this area. I was thinking of melting it closed with a soldering iron and maybe putting some epoxy seal over/into it.
> 
> If it's plastic over metal, I do have some good quality silver solder which I could use. I also have a very small arc welder (which I haven't yet learned to use). Any assistance here would be appreciated.


you can do solder it shut with plastic rods. they actually have a plastic welder. for very short term, you can use jb weld, but dont rely on that car anymore to be reliable. it may not leak at first, but it will again. get a metal radiator, just a bit more expensive than the plastic one. 168 versus 158 for the plastic. http://dexonline.com/servlet/Action...last10Saved=true&resultForm=BASIC&REGION=both


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## andym (May 24, 2004)

*Also engine damage?*

What do you mean by a plastic welder & rods? Do you mean a basic glue gun? I think those are mainly for arts & crafts. That type of glue I don't think is very strong. Do you mean some other type of "welder"? Where can I get it?

I ended up using a basic soldering iron to smush the crack closed and then went over the work first with a film of Gorilla Glue and then after a couple of hours with a two-mix epoxy glue. I let it cure overnight and will know soon after I start it if it was successful.

By the way, could I have damaged my engine? This whole thing started when my serpentine belt broke, which I suppose stopped the water pump and caused the coolant to overheat and crack the radiator. Strangely, the temperature gauge in the dashboard didn't move past the normal area. However, the engine is harder to start and then idles a bit rough. I don't see any white smoke from the exhaust. There was some little puffs in rapid succession of white steam coming out of the crack in the radiator when idling however.


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## Asleep (Jan 19, 2003)

andym said:


> What do you mean by a plastic welder & rods? Do you mean a basic glue gun? I think those are mainly for arts & crafts. That type of glue I don't think is very strong. Do you mean some other type of "welder"? Where can I get it?
> 
> I ended up using a basic soldering iron to smush the crack closed and then went over the work first with a film of Gorilla Glue and then after a couple of hours with a two-mix epoxy glue. I let it cure overnight and will know soon after I start it if it was successful.
> 
> By the way, could I have damaged my engine? This whole thing started when my serpentine belt broke, which I suppose stopped the water pump and caused the coolant to overheat and crack the radiator. Strangely, the temperature gauge in the dashboard didn't move past the normal area. However, the engine is harder to start and then idles a bit rough. I don't see any white smoke from the exhaust. There was some little puffs in rapid succession of white steam coming out of the crack in the radiator when idling however.


this is what i mean. http://www.arizonatools.com/catalog...&ovcpn=5500HT+Plastic+Welder&ovcrn=&ovtac=PPC

hows the engine running now? how long did you allow it to run when the belt broke?


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## andym (May 24, 2004)

I originally thought that I was just low on power steering fluid when the belt broke as it just appeared like the steering was stiff. I put in extra fluid and the steering was still rigid, but a friend told me it would be safe to drive because steering is easier when the car is moving. Well it is, and I drove it, until it konked out with steam pouring from under the hood. It was at this time with the hood up when I noticed the serpentine belt gone. I now know that I shouldn't have followed my friend's advice. Does that tell you how long I drove it without the belt?  

It was about 15-20 miles or 30 minutes total that I allowed it to go. All of this time, the temperature guage didn't go past the normal temperature range.

On how it's running now, terrible. I drove it about a mile with tons of hesitation (and at times puffs of white steam seen in the rear-view mirror) and then it totally stalled. I had to be towed home.

With the hood raised, I noticed steam exiting past the Number 2 spark plug hole wire boot. Pulling this boot out, I noticed lots of condensation inside the boot. None of the other 3 spark plug boots had this condensation.

Also, my little "weld" using a soldering iron and the Gorilla Glue / epoxy films on the radiator didn't last long before failing.

This sounds serious, eh? I think I blew a head gasket. Where can I find instructions on changing a head gasket? Any threads here instructing this?

BTW, thanks on providing me info on the plastic welder. Looks like a neat gadget and quite a bit more stronger than an arts & crafts glue gun.


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## Asleep (Jan 19, 2003)

andym said:


> I originally thought that I was just low on power steering fluid when the belt broke as it just appeared like the steering was stiff. I put in extra fluid and the steering was still rigid, but a friend told me it would be safe to drive because steering is easier when the car is moving. Well it is, and I drove it, until it konked out with steam pouring from under the hood. It was at this time with the hood up when I noticed the serpentine belt gone. I now know that I shouldn't have followed my friend's advice. Does that tell you how long I drove it without the belt?
> 
> It was about 15-20 miles or 30 minutes total that I allowed it to go. All of this time, the temperature guage didn't go past the normal temperature range.
> 
> ...


wow... im going to have to agree with you on the head gasket idea. i think its blown. pull your dipstick and check to see that the oil looks normal and not milky and the same for the coolant. #2 was the spot where i blew mine too. its a very expensive job to tell you the truth. it was cheaper for me to replace the engine than it was to get the head gasket repaired. replacing the engine only cost me 950. the head gasket would have been in the neighborhood of 1600...


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## andym (May 24, 2004)

The oil looks ok. The coolant just jets out of the crack in the radiator, probably under compression from the combustion gasses. Anyone here know how to replace a head gasket? How can I prove that this is what all the problem is, that there isn't any damage to the block itself?


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## Asleep (Jan 19, 2003)

Do a cylinder leakdown test or CLT. its basically taking an air hose with a fitting on it that screws into the spark plug hole on your head. the cylinder is then pumped full of air to a pre-determined psi and see if it holds... if it starts leaking you check different areas to see where its leaking from. ie; air hissing from the exhaust would be an exhaust valve leak and a leak thru your throttle body would be an intake valve leak and bubbles from your radiator would be a head gasket leak. oh yeah, air coming from your valve cover (where you put the oil in) would be a piston or oil galley leak. the bubbles are mainly what we are looking for right now though. if the head gasket is sealing properly, there wont be any bubbles. did you ever remove the spark plugs to check them for water?


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## andym (May 24, 2004)

Is a CLT the same as a compression test? Air pump - using a compressor or can something else be used? As for bubbles in the clear radiator overflow reservior (I assume you mean this and not the radiator itself), there has been bubbles here ever since the problem first began while the engine tries to run.

Spark plugs? No I didn't check them for water. But the No. 2 spark plug boot had water/condensation inside while the other three boots did not. Should I actually take the plugs out to check? Thanks for your continued help, it's appreciated.


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## Asleep (Jan 19, 2003)

andym said:


> Is a CLT the same as a compression test? Air pump - using a compressor or can something else be used? As for bubbles in the clear radiator overflow reservior (I assume you mean this and not the radiator itself), there has been bubbles here ever since the problem first began while the engine tries to run.
> 
> Spark plugs? No I didn't check them for water. But the No. 2 spark plug boot had water/condensation inside while the other three boots did not. Should I actually take the plugs out to check? Thanks for your continued help, it's appreciated.


yup, pull the plugs completely out. you need to see whats going on inside the cylinder. the CLT is like a compression test, but you dont use the gauge part of it and the compression comes from a compressor and not the engine. the bubbles should be coming from the radiator itself with the cap removed.


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## andym (May 24, 2004)

Ok, I'll crank the engine a few times, pull out the plugs and report back. I guess you get the CLT "kit" from a parts store, which will be difficult for me to get to since I don't have a vehicle. I can get access to a compressor, but could I just blow into it myself (I'm a big windbag)?

I already phoned in an order for a head gasket to the parts store. I assume the CLT test would also help identify what things other than a head gasket will be needed at the parts store (valves, etc.), correct?

The bubbles in the reservior which I described when the engine is running/cranking, does it mean a broken head gasket? I'll check the radiator itself. I guess listen for bubbles since I can't see through the radiator?


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## andym (May 24, 2004)

Well I could NOT crank the engine at all. Not sure what the problem is. It's not the battery (brand new, plus I have an extra battery to jump). The lights in the dash just come on, and then when trying to crank it, the lights go out and nothing happens, just silence, like it's dead.

Well anyway I pulled the plugs. The last time the engine ran was approximately 24 hours before. The No. 2 plug had water within the plug electrode area. I felt this moisture and couldn't detect any slipperiness such as oil. All the other plugs were dry and just had normal carbon buildup.

Just wondering about the questions I had in my previous posting...


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## Asleep (Jan 19, 2003)

andym said:


> Well I could NOT crank the engine at all. Not sure what the problem is. It's not the battery (brand new, plus I have an extra battery to jump). The lights in the dash just come on, and then when trying to crank it, the lights go out and nothing happens, just silence, like it's dead.
> 
> Well anyway I pulled the plugs. The last time the engine ran was approximately 24 hours before. The No. 2 plug had water within the plug electrode area. I felt this moisture and couldn't detect any slipperiness such as oil. All the other plugs were dry and just had normal carbon buildup.
> 
> Just wondering about the questions I had in my previous posting...


pull all of the plugs and with them out, try cranking the engine...


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## andym (May 24, 2004)

*Thar she blows*

Thar she blows! With all the plugs out, #2 & 3 cylinders had water spout out through the plug holes when cranking the engine.


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## Asleep (Jan 19, 2003)

andym said:


> Thar she blows! With all the plugs out, #2 & 3 cylinders had water spout out through the plug holes when cranking the engine.


 thats what i was getting at. your head gasket is indeed bad.


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## andym (May 24, 2004)

Can the CLT tester be purchased at a standard parts store (Autozone, etc.) and does it only work with a compressor? I'd like to know what else besides the basic head gasket I would need at the store. I'd hate to make repeated trips.


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## Asleep (Jan 19, 2003)

andym said:


> Can the CLT tester be purchased at a standard parts store (Autozone, etc.) and does it only work with a compressor? I'd like to know what else besides the basic head gasket I would need at the store. I'd hate to make repeated trips.


well... if you do the head gasket job, be sure to get the head resurfaced too. you need a compressor with the CLT because you theres not really a better way to get that much air into the cylinder at once... im not sure where youd get one as a kit per se... you need a spark plug adapter such as you get with a compression tester and some air line and then a fitting to connect to a compressor. you put about 165psi into the cylinder and wait to see where the air goes. if you replace the head gasket, you wont need to the CLT. you already know which cylinders are full of water anyways.


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