# HS turbo manifold.



## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

After all this time I received my manifold from HS today. It is a nice piece, welds look good overall. Not extatic about the turbo flange but I gasket matched it to the T28 and it lines up pretty good. WIll have to clean it up a bit. Here are the pics. FWIW I have an extrude honed T28, if I had a standard T25/8 exhaust housing I would not have to port the flange out at all, so despite the appearance it will flow just fine.


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## chimmike (Oct 17, 2002)

yeah....that doesn't seem to be HS's best work there..........it could look better........................and it seems to have strange pipe directions......................but hey, if it works, it works!


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## dave_f (Dec 11, 2002)

nice piece, how much was it just for the manifold? or did you purchase the entire kit?
-dave


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## Michael DeLoach (Apr 30, 2002)

How much did you pay for the manifold?


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## Guest (Jan 22, 2003)

I have a 95 1.6 200sx and theyu wanted $800 for it when they told me that i laughed
Eric


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

*Piping*

I bought the piping kit which includes Manifold, DP, IC piping, couplers and clamps. I paid $1250 for the kit. 

I bought the rest on my own. As for the manifold it is a good design, pulse converter manifolds work pretty well and project 200 is indicating they have great boost response which is what I am after. Time will tell if I am happy with the performance.


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

Hey Wes, 

That was the exact same manifold I looked at last week! I was going to trade mine in because I didn't like the flange on mine either but then they told me they aren't doing the pulse converter manifold anymore, as you can see when you look up from your flange the four pipes come together into one chamber... the one I have has a divider down the middle so the pipes are paired off like a set of headers.










you can see a little above my finger and running along side it, is a piece of metal. that is the divider.


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## javierb14 (Jul 9, 2002)

some tips:
1. might want to "slot" the head flange as to prevent the mani from cracking.
2. use anti-seize on everthing when u install it
3. after the first couple of heat cycles, torque down the mani again to the head.
4. be prepared for the mani to turn a purty gold


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

*HMMM*

I thought the pulse converter design was the individual runners. The exhaust gas pulses are seperate al lthe way until they reach the turbo for the most part. I wonder how much difference that spacer will make, they all dump into the turbo right there anyway and it;s not a divided housing turbo. It would be interesting to compare the two back to back. And that's alovely red X James, hit us with the real link, I'd like to compare the two a little more. 

I was thinking of polishing the manifold since it's stainless, I love that polished heat cycled look. 

Hopefully the extrude honing of the turbo will help with spool up.


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## chef (Apr 30, 2002)

That is a very nice design. My manifold has runs just like that and I have the divided housing turbo. Hey Wes, I do think that it would look awesome polished. Congrats on getting the part. Hope to see you boosting soon. Oh and if you can make it to the SE-R convention, we can hang out. 

Chef


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

Hey sorry Wes, stupid X's... always cursing me...

I relinked it again but if it doesn't work just go to the yahoo photo album here:

Yahoo Photos


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## hagasan (Aug 5, 2002)

It looks pretty shitty IMO...well, at least considering the price as well as who it was made by...


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## chimmike (Oct 17, 2002)

hagasan said:


> *It looks pretty shitty IMO...well, at least considering the price as well as who it was made by... *



that's what I was thinking...........looks like they threw it together in 20 mins............................HS does better work than that.


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## se-r-57 (May 1, 2002)

Well I was gonna say it looked like shit but didn't wanna hurt anyone's feelings. Look at the weld right inside the exhaust flange where the big ol buger is on the inside of the weld. That's nasty and will hurt flow. The collector is just as bad. This should have been back purged to clean up the welds on the inside of it and welded at a lower heat. The welds shouldn't be dark gray like some of these IMHO after 30 years of welding. Send it back and tell them to fix it


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

give me a bit I'll take some better pictures of the inside of mine and you can get an idea... it's similar to the one Wes has but the welds are a BIT cleaner.


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

*I agree in some ways.*

The collecter area needs some cleanup work, the worst part is the rest of the welds are good, granted probably done a bit too hot, but good beads that flow nicely. Given how the pipes are cut they put a lot of material around the collector area. I will clean it up myself given that I have to enlarge the ports anyway because of the head work. 

As far as where the welds meet inside the collector they are smoother than they appear in the picture. 

As for your manifold James it looks like there is a different piece design on one of the primary tubes, like it bends one way and then another. 

I personally don't feel like any of this will affect performance the bulk of my gripes is cosmetic and it deals with the work in the collector. As stated after a gasket match it does not really protrude into the gasket area, that is how I determined it shoudln't affect flow. 

Don't worry about saying what you think, it's why I posted pictures. Not going to hurt my feelings anyway.


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## hagasan (Aug 5, 2002)

> Don't worry about saying what you think, it's why I posted pictures. Not going to hurt my feelings anyway.


You suck Wes !!! j/k

I full agree on the performance issue. Unless you are REALLY pushing for big numbers the header should be the least of your problems. I was just noting the fact that it doesn't seem to represent the quality that Hotshot seems to be {allegedly} known for.


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

My first thoughts were about the collector as well, thats why in my album I have that picture with my finger in it to show how there are these pockets that affect the flow... Hard for me to grind them down... HS said that the removal of the welded piece inside didn't make that much of a difference in power and it was too much trouble to put it in.


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

sorry pictures are a bit fuzzy...


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## javierb14 (Jul 9, 2002)

here's some nice collectors, enjoy


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

a collector like that is a 100 times easier to weld than an entire manifold...


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

wes said:


> *After all this time I received my manifold from HS today. It is a nice piece, welds look good overall. Not extatic about the turbo flange but I gasket matched it to the T28 and it lines up pretty good. WIll have to clean it up a bit. Here are the pics. FWIW I have an extrude honed T28, if I had a standard T25/8 exhaust housing I would not have to port the flange out at all, so despite the appearance it will flow just fine.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


bet it doesn't look as bad in person... lighting and camera angles can be deceiving and not very flattering.... but from that pic it could have been cleaned up a little


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## javierb14 (Jul 9, 2002)

myoung said:


> *a collector like that is a 100 times easier to weld than an entire manifold... *


true, but i could also post pics of manifolds that are more difficult to weld...that have nicer welds(welded by ffgeon). but thats not the point. point was to display some nice merge collectors for comparison. 

i agree with se-r57 
IMO they should purge the inside of the mani while TIG'ing, then those "boogers" would look just like the welds on the outside. but purging uses gas and gas costs $.....

dont get me wrong, its a nice piece but could be better.


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

*My thoughts.*

If I were to do this from scratch I would have a custom equal length manifold that used a burns stainless merge collector. Something that mirrors the FMAX manifold for the SR20. I would basically take Aaron's turbo setup and put it on a GA16 with built internals. 

I thought about doing something similar with only the T28 but I couldn;t stomach the $2,000 to have someone build a one off manifold like that. We can dream I guess. 

FWIW this manifold will do just fine. And from the looks of the picture my flange is more open than James, compare the distance from the edges of the opening to the bolt holes on the 2 pics. 

I wish I had more welding knowledge so that I could build my own manifold, that I am working towards correcting.


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## dave_f (Dec 11, 2002)

I made my own 4 into one collector out of four 45 degree elbows. It didn't come out half bad for my first attempt. I used a mig welder and schedule 40 weld els. 
-dave


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

yeah your port is bigger. man this sucks... anyone got a 2.5" exhaust lying around???


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## javierb14 (Jul 9, 2002)

i've got 2 stainless b14 2.5" exhausts in my garage....hehe. one exits before the passenger rear wheel, and the other is a full cat back. i'll post some pics later.


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

is that so??? are you interested in selling one?!


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

*Me too*

After I get rolling I will have a non-mandrel 2.5" exhaust with an APEXi N1 muffler. If you r willing to wait a bit I'd sell it.....
Cheap


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

the thing is guys, I had the CA model so I put the cat in a different location... I don't know if I can just throw any old exhaust on there and have it work.


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## FFgeoff (Nov 2, 2002)

1) If you paid 800$ for that manifold from HS, you were ripped off. Sorry.

2) A collector like the ones that javier b14 posted are anythign but easy to weld. Please not the *INSIDE* of the collector is welded. that means the collector was welded inside and out. Easy? I think not, if you are a tig welder, try welding a colector from the inside sometime, let me know how well your torch fits in there. Note that the HS manifold was not welded internally.

3) Definately grind out your collector, if nothing else, for the fact that you know that an oxidized ball of burn thru from hotshot wont hit your turbine at 120,000 rpm.

4) If you plan on using a burns collector, dont get a 304, it will crack very very quickly. You must use 321 or else thickwall 316 like us.


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

*Well.*

I did not pay $800. 

I know they are not welded internally. I will say the welds inside look better in person than the picture, not as intrusive as they appear. 

The collector area will be cleaned up, that has already been stated in this thread. What kills me is the flange and ports where the manifold connects to the head is very clean in comparison. Cleaned up nicely. 

I am not going to build a manifold with a burns collector. I am going to use this manifold.

FWIW the other welds on the manifold look good to me. I am a very detail oriented person, so I wish I had the knowledge of welding and fabriction prior to even thinking about a turbo setup, I would probably be building my own kit. 

My wife did buy me an arc welder for christmas, I hear it;s the hardest form of welding to master, so I'm going to try my hand and possibly take a course at the local technical college to learn more of the metallurgy (sp?) aspects of fabrication.


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## javierb14 (Jul 9, 2002)

here's my 2.5"ID cat back

























wes, 
welcome to welding.......its a lot like driving, seat time or practice makes a huge difference.


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

Something to ponder:

the HS is a pulse converter manifold, designed to spool the turbo up quickly, using pulse energy from the motor, as well as heat energy and expansion of the hot exhaust gasses. By pairing up cylinders 4-1 and 2-3, the turbine is hit with 4 discreet pulses with every power cycle of the motor. This cylinder pairing also helps reduce power-robbing reversion and improves flow. This design is unique to Hotshot. The manifold is made from heat resistant 304 stainless


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

Why did they change the design then Mike?


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## morepower2 (Apr 19, 2002)

James said:


> *Why did they change the design then Mike? *


For it to package better, it is still a pulse converter type, just not as optimized. It is a street kit designed to fit in a street car with a minimum of relocating things. It sacrificed a little power and spool for ease of fit in the engine compartment.

Mike


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## James (Apr 29, 2002)

IC thank you.


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## dave_f (Dec 11, 2002)

here's my first attempt at a manifold... I should have it on the car soon. it's oh so cold in Connecticut
-dave

ga16de-T turbo system


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## wes (Apr 30, 2002)

*More pics.*

Show us mor epics. of the manifold. Looks like an Eclipse T25 IIRC.


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## dave_f (Dec 11, 2002)

good call, the turbo is a t-25 from a second generation eclipse. the exhaust manifold is handmade.
exhaust manifold 
-dave


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## javierb14 (Jul 9, 2002)

that's a good pic. nice mani! i love the schedule 40......it doesnt crack


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## Engloid (Jul 7, 2002)

The part will work, but they really should get a new welder. I've been welding for a living for many years, and I'd be hunting another job if I put down welds like that. If they had run a purging gas inside while welding they could have really cut back on the mess inside. The header will work, I'm sure, but people really do want a part that looks nice when they pay that much money.

BTW..if you guys got any welding jobs you need, let me know. Just make it worth my time and I can help you out with work or advice, should you have it done elsewhere or want to try it yourself.

Pics of Some stuff I've done at work


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## Engloid (Jul 7, 2002)

FFgeoff said:


> * A collector like the ones that javier b14 posted are anythign but easy to weld. Please not the *INSIDE* of the collector is welded. that means the collector was welded inside and out. Easy? I think not, if you are a tig welder, try welding a colector from the inside sometime, let me know how well your torch fits in there. Note that the HS manifold was not welded internally.
> 
> 4) If you plan on using a burns collector, dont get a 304, it will crack very very quickly. You must use 321 or else thickwall 316 like us. *


It's not all too hard to weld inside of the HS manifold pictured above. It can be done, but the easiest thing is to make the proper fit and then weld it from the outside, getting full penetration (purging inside, of course).

As for the type of stainless...you will probably have the same problems out of 316 that you will 304. The choice to use 316 over 304 is mainly made for corrosion resistence either externally or internally. However...if you got the equipment and knowledge, fixing a crank that may occur isn't that big of a problem.


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## myoung (Apr 15, 2002)

dave_f said:


> *good call, the turbo is a t-25 from a second generation eclipse. the exhaust manifold is handmade.
> exhaust manifold
> -dave *


nice job..!.... looks sweet...


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