# not sure what this is called...



## B11sleeper (Oct 15, 2003)

I have a car that doesn't have speakers in the door currently, but the doors have metal inserts that are big enough to hold 4x6 speakers, the door panel doesn't have the space cut out for speakers yet, but someone made a messy hole for some poorly installed speakers since gone. I'm getting the door panels redone, so now is the time to put in speakers, do they make something like a surround to house the speaker in? something to make the install nicer and perhaps set the speaker out a little since there isn't a whole lot of room behind...


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## jlee1469 (Dec 4, 2003)

They sell the adapters on crutchfield.

Would be cheaper to make em outta MDF though.


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## B11sleeper (Oct 15, 2003)

i'm thinking perhaps fiberglass.

I've never done that before, but there's a first time for everything...

What do they call those thingies anyways? When i googled, crutchfield was one of the things that came up, but it's hard to find something you don't know what it's called.


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## sr20dem0n (Mar 19, 2003)

Most people call them spacers, and mdf is an easy, cheap, and effective material to use for them.

Something like this, right:


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## B11sleeper (Oct 15, 2003)

Thanks!
I ended up just cutting holes in the insert pieces i made and the speakers i got aren't very deep, so i don't think i'll have to do anything.

maybe pics later when i remember where my camera is...


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## B11sleeper (Oct 15, 2003)

well i guess i need those spacers after all. the speaker is keeping the window from rolling down the last inch or 2.

d'oh


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## infazorak (Jun 18, 2005)

*Spacers eh?*



sr20dem0n said:


> Most people call them spacers, and mdf is an easy, cheap, and effective material to use for them.
> 
> Something like this, right:


First off, nice looking work there. :thumbup: Band-saw? Jig-saw? Would this be the kind of application you would use to mount a set of speakers so the grilles face outside of the doorpanel? 

I've never done any kind of major audio install work, other than removing what was there, and replacing with similar components. So, now I've picked up a set of Rockford Fosgate Punch speakers. (Don't laugh, my deck isn't high end, nor am I looking for a superiour system, just something that sounds better than what was there) I want to mount them on the back deck of my Sentra. 6.5" coax setup for back there. 5.25" Components for the front doors. 

So, would I build one of these spacer rigs to get the speakers to sit up above the back deck and out of the door-panel? I mean, the speakers sound good, and look pretty cool, so I want to shwo em off. 

Are there any things I should be careful of in mounting the speakers like this? Or anything special I should take note of when building the spacers. And before anybody thinks of it, I'm going to pick up some B-Quiet sound proofing mats in the future. It's on the list, just don't have the bennies for it now. 

Thanks for any forthcoming info. 
*Zorak Out*


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## sr20dem0n (Mar 19, 2003)

Router actually, you can't use a band saw for cutting out the inside of the spacer (so it looks like a donut instead of a plate), and jig saws are sort of a pita.

There are a few issues with what you want to do, but nothing major. First is that you'll have to cut a hole in the stock grill, naturally, which could end up looking like crap. Second is that showing off the speakers invites criminals to break into your car (the ones in the doors aren't really a problem, it's the ones in the rear deck). Past that you could do it if you wanted, just remember that if you change your mind after the fact it's too late, you've already destroyed the door panels which cost a couple hundred bucks each from the dealership.


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## infazorak (Jun 18, 2005)

sr20dem0n said:


> Router actually, you can't use a band saw for cutting out the inside of the spacer (so it looks like a donut instead of a plate), and jig saws are sort of a pita.
> 
> There are a few issues with what you want to do, but nothing major. First is that you'll have to cut a hole in the stock grill, naturally, which could end up looking like crap. Second is that showing off the speakers invites criminals to break into your car (the ones in the doors aren't really a problem, it's the ones in the rear deck). Past that you could do it if you wanted, just remember that if you change your mind after the fact it's too late, you've already destroyed the door panels which cost a couple hundred bucks each from the dealership.


These are all good points. Thanks for that :thumbup: . Concidering how much work it'll take, I may just forget doing all that. I also found that the supposed "grilles" that are on my speakers are open and would be prone to damanging the cones. So I'll probably just keep them under wraps as it were for protection. 

I will however, have to fabricate a mounting ring for the speakers. Do you think quarter inch MDF would do this without bringing the speakers too close? I don't think they make MDF any smaller than that. Something thinner, like balsa wood would probably crack and sound like crap :thumbdwn:

Also, what's the shiney foil on your door panel? Sound deadener? I thought that was supposed to adhere to the outside skin, instead of the inside. Or is that just the liner on your door. 
*Zorak Out*


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## sr20dem0n (Mar 19, 2003)

infazorak said:


> These are all good points. Thanks for that :thumbup: . Concidering how much work it'll take, I may just forget doing all that. I also found that the supposed "grilles" that are on my speakers are open and would be prone to damanging the cones. So I'll probably just keep them under wraps as it were for protection.
> 
> I will however, have to fabricate a mounting ring for the speakers. Do you think quarter inch MDF would do this without bringing the speakers too close? I don't think they make MDF any smaller than that. Something thinner, like balsa wood would probably crack and sound like crap :thumbdwn:
> 
> ...



I believe [don't quote me on this] the B14 sentra can hold 3/4" spacers without interfering with the door panels. It's sort of a game you have to play, you have the maximum mounting depth the doors can allow without interfering with the window travel, and you have the maximum spacer size you can use without interfering with the door panel. In the b15 you start with a 2" mounting depth, and to keep from interfering with the door panel you have to keep the spacer thickness under 1". Since I'm using speakers that have a 3" depth, I had to use a 1" thick spacer, and to keep from interfering with the door panel I had to make a 2 layer spacer where the bottom layer had the flanges for the bolts and the top layer was just a donut which provided extra spacing. It's an incredibly tight fit in my case, it was really interesting trying to get my mids to fit. I think the B14 can handle a 2" mounting depth without a spacer, so what size spacer you use depends on the mounting depth of the speaker you're trying to fit. I didn't know they even made 1/4" mdf, but I know they make 1/2, 3/4, and 1" mdf.


The shiney shit on my door is sound deadening. One of the worst problems with putting mids in your doors is that the people who designed the car didn't have sound quality in mind when they designed the door. They filled the door with holes, massive holes, our worst enemy. See when a speaker is playing, the sound radiates off of the cone. The problem is that the sound comes off of the front and the back of the cone, and the sound coming off of the back of the cone is 180 degrees out of phase with the sound coming off the front of the cone (when the front of the cone generates a high pressure, the rear of the cone generates a vacuum, and vice versa). This sound coming off the rear of the cone reflects off of the metal surface right behind the speaker, passes through these gaping holes in the door, and causes an ENORMOUS amount of cancellation with the sound coming off the front of the cone. The worst cancellation occurs in the lower frequencies, which means you get almost zero midbass output. The only way to get decent output in the double digits is to seal off the baffle so that the rear waves can't interfere with the front waves. The only way to do that is to close off all of those holes with enough deadening material where no (or very very little) sound can transmit through it. That's what I've done, with 200+ mils (.2 inches) of deadening material. It's expensive, but honestly it's worth its weight in gold. A $200 set of speakers in stock doors would literally get its ass handed to it by a $150 set of speakers with $50 in deadening on the doors. Hell, a $400 set of speakers in stock doors would get its ass handed to it by a $150 set of speakers with $50 in deadening on the doors. If you spend any more than $100 on your door speakers, you better deaden them well, or the money you spent on the speakers was a waste.


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## infazorak (Jun 18, 2005)

sr20dem0n said:


> ...I know they make 1/2, 3/4, and 1" mdf.
> 
> The shiney shit on my door is sound deadening. One of the worst problems with putting mids in your doors is that the people who designed the car didn't have sound quality in mind when they designed the door. They filled the door with holes, massive holes, our worst enemy. See when a speaker is playing, the sound radiates off of the cone. The problem is that the sound comes off of the front and the back of the cone, and the sound coming off of the back of the cone is 180 degrees out of phase with the sound coming off the front of the cone (when the front of the cone generates a high pressure, the rear of the cone generates a vacuum, and vice versa). This sound coming off the rear of the cone reflects off of the metal surface right behind the speaker, passes through these gaping holes in the door, and causes an ENORMOUS amount of cancellation with the sound coming off the front of the cone. The worst cancellation occurs in the lower frequencies, which means you get almost zero midbass output. The only way to get decent output in the double digits is to seal off the baffle so that the rear waves can't interfere with the front waves. The only way to do that is to close off all of those holes with enough deadening material where no (or very very little) sound can transmit through it. That's what I've done, with 200+ mils (.2 inches) of deadening material. It's expensive, but honestly it's worth its weight in gold. A $200 set of speakers in stock doors would literally get its ass handed to it by a $150 set of speakers with $50 in deadening on the doors. Hell, a $400 set of speakers in stock doors would get its ass handed to it by a $150 set of speakers with $50 in deadening on the doors. If you spend any more than $100 on your door speakers, you better deaden them well, or the money you spent on the speakers was a waste.


I'm probably wrong about the 1/4" MDF. Never took woodshop class  If I took my time, think I could pull the project off with a dremmel?

I'm definately after sound deadening in the future. I'm going to have to buy a few rolls of B-Quiet (cause it's cheaper than Dynamat and better) and do up the inside door panels and the back deck with the Ultimate or Extreme stuff. Once I get a sub in, I'll do the rest of the trunk, and probably the back seat deck. I've also concidered their HLiner product for under the hood, but not too sure there. 
Thanks for the tips
*Zorak Out*


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