# BREAK-IN SCHEDULE FOR 2005 spec V



## skatehard90 (Dec 20, 2004)

For all the new and proud owners of the Spec V 2005. . . here is a break in schedule for the engine, just in case you decided to never to look at the owners manual. . . 

During the first 1,200 miles, follow these recommendations to obtain maximum engine performance and engine reliability. 

-Avoid driving for long periods at constant speed, either fast or slow, and do not run the engine over 4,000 rpm. 
-Do not accelerate at full throttle in any gear.
-Avoid quick starts.
-Avoid hard braking as much as possible.
-Do not tow a trailer for the first 500 mile. Your engine, axle or other parts could be damaged. 

(page 5-15 of owners manual)

The only reason why i'm posting this is because i keep reading threads where kids are talking about mods before the break in period. . . oh and that guy who said his car had 900 miles on it, and his friends car beat his---> well what the fuck are you racing your car right now for? can't you wait for that power up the road? it's not that long of a wait. . .cuz i have 600miles on my spec V 05, and it's been 4 days. . . so there ya go

Oh and i recomend changing the oil within or after the break in time to get rid of any unlikely metal chips, or any micro pieces floating around in the system. 

have a nice day 

:banhump:


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## Ralphieboy57 (Sep 20, 2004)

*Breakin with mods!!!*

My 04 Spec V has 8000 miles on it and runs perfect. I broke it in with bolt on mods and had no problems. What better way to break it in!! I broke it in with a AEM cai, Dcsports (no cat) header, and a 5Zigen Fireball exhaust. I also put Moble 1 synthetic in it. The car rips! I did however didn't over rev it. I let it get hot then cool down alot. I didn't bog it around and opened it up once in a while.Also I always use Premium fuel (91 octain). Good luck with your 05! :loser:


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## Zac (Mar 10, 2004)

good write up and it spells it out perfectly. :thumbup:


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## skatehard90 (Dec 20, 2004)

Ralphieboy57 said:


> My 04 Spec V has 8000 miles on it and runs perfect. I broke it in with bolt on mods and had no problems. What better way to break it in!! I broke it in with a AEM cai, Dcsports (no cat) header, and a 5Zigen Fireball exhaust. I also put Moble 1 synthetic in it. The car rips! I did however didn't over rev it. I let it get hot then cool down alot. I didn't bog it around and opened it up once in a while.Also I always use Premium fuel (91 octain). Good luck with your 05! :loser:


yeah. . . i don't think it will hurt the car if you break the engine in with the mods on it. . . and haveing the mods on while breakin time sounds like a good idea cuz everything is getting used to each part. . . mods+follow rules=sounds good. . . but you never know. . . and your 04 spec V with 8000 miles on it is still fuckin young. . . what's not to say it won't go for another 50,000 strong! 

and the premium fuel is a must anyway (in manual). . . i run 93 cuz that's all they have here :loser: 

have a nice day 

:banhump:


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## Ralphieboy57 (Sep 20, 2004)

*Respond...?*



skatehard90 said:


> yeah. . . i don't think it will hurt the car if you break the engine in with the mods on it. . . and haveing the mods on while breakin time sounds like a good idea cuz everything is getting used to each part. . . mods+follow rules=sounds good. . . but you never know. . . and your 04 spec V with 8000 miles on it is still fuckin young. . . what's not to say it won't go for another 50,000 strong!
> 
> and the premium fuel is a must anyway (in manual). . . i run 93 cuz that's all they have here :loser:
> 
> ...


I shouldn't even respond because your rude and swearing just shows me that you have little or no class. Anyhow I have 20,000 on it and still going strong. What do people think, that a performance car should last 200,000 miles. Your lucky if it goes to 50,000.


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## Bror Jace (Apr 26, 2003)

_"What do people think, that a performance car should last 200,000 miles? Your lucky if it goes to 50,000."_

If you want YOUR car to last a mere 50,000 miles, do what want. My car is my way of getting back to work ... and my job is important to me (I'm funny that way).

I also like to keep cars for at least 4-5 years ... then sell them to people I know. I often have people inquiring as to when I'm selling my used cars. 

I more or less followed the manufacturer's recommendations as that's basically the conventional wisdom on break-in: frequent oil changes, vary the engine speed and use the bottom 2/3 of the rev range during the first few thousand miles.

Synthetic oil is OK during break-in (the caution about this is a myth) but since the oil shouldn't be in for more than 2,000-3,000 miles during this time, synthetic oil is a waste. As for mods, I think intake and exhaust are pretty safe ... but I'd wait on cams, etc ...

Oh, and according to _Sport Compact Car_ the QR25DE isn't fully broken in until about 6,000 miles. My '03 has nearly 37,000 miles on the clock and hasn't burned a drop of oil in its life even though I put my foot in it now 'n then.


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## Psch91 (May 18, 2002)

Thanks for this! Its not like we havent known this since 2002 when the car first came out :loser:


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## neogeon (Nov 30, 2005)

Thats what ive been saying all along, i bet most of the problems with the QR were from dumbasses going hog wild off the showroom floor. Evos are the same way, ive heard several times that EVOs will be garbage at 40k miles and eat oil among other things if not broken in properly. On the other hand, an EVO could be a daily driver if broken in properly. I made special care to rarely rev above even 3k rpms when breaking in my engine and i have had no issues with anything. I bet thats part of the reason the pre-cat and headgaskets get screwed up, because people dont break them in properly. All parts of an engine are designed to operate at maximum efficiency at a specific temperature (especially like the cats in the exhaust that dont work until heated, hmmm, see where im going with this?) and if you hammer your car while its still warming up youll undoubtedly damage something eventually. I have faith that the QR is good for much more than 100k miles if broken in and further maintained properly. Even though it offers good performance, it still has duty as a family car motor so it is most definently understressed for longevity. I bet if people researched what kind of mileage soccer moms get in altimas with QRs they would see many over the 100k mark easily.


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## Bror Jace (Apr 26, 2003)

_"I bet most of the problems with the QR were from dumbasses going hog wild off the showroom floor ... I have faith that the QR is good for much more than 100k miles if broken in and further maintained properly. Even though it offers good performance, it still has duty as a family car motor so it is most definently understressed for longevity."_

I agree. The QR25DE is a fleet/workhorse motor ... one that sees duty not only in the SpecV but also other Sentras, the Altima and the Xtrail (others?). I believe Nissan would not put this engine in so many core vehicles (essential to Nissan's success) if they didn't test it thoroughly and know it could hold up ... as long as it was properly used and maintained, of course. 

If our motor was merely some one-off powerplant, I could see some people believing it is a tempermental, high-performance brat. But it's not and should be pretty reliable on average.


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## neogeon (Nov 30, 2005)

Bror Jace said:


> _"I bet most of the problems with the QR were from dumbasses going hog wild off the showroom floor ... I have faith that the QR is good for much more than 100k miles if broken in and further maintained properly. Even though it offers good performance, it still has duty as a family car motor so it is most definently understressed for longevity."_
> 
> I agree. The QR25DE is a fleet/workhorse motor ... one that sees duty not only in the SpecV but also other Sentras, the Altima and the Xtrail (others?). I believe Nissan would not put this engine in so many core vehicles (essential to Nissan's success) if they didn't test it thoroughly and know it could hold up ... as long as it was properly used and maintained, of course.
> 
> If our motor was merely some one-off powerplant, I could see some people believing it is a tempermental, high-performance brat. But it's not and should be pretty reliable on average.


be careful, the haters will be here soon, but thanks for someone finally seeing my point. The problems with the motor were bugs that only having cars hit high mileage with plenty of hardcore driving could find and i think it is unfair to still call the QR25 a bad motor after all the problems are fixed. Also, i see tons of QR25 altimas rolling around and i seriously doubt they all have had an engine replaced. The biggest known problem, the pre-cat, like any other catalyst, requires being heated up before it works properly, which is why the recall was mostly additional heat shielding. Now, if you just take off and go WOT all the time before your car is at its optimum operating temperature, you can bet seals wont break in right and stuff like the pre-cat will get messed up. Also, remember, heat makes things expand, so probably running it hard when the motor and pre-cat were still cold slowly tugged the smaller than optimal sized pre-cat out of its position where i could move and cause damage. Even still, the pre-cat is in a HEADER and a header is not an engine. I could put a shitty header with a bad pre-cat on an SR20 and blow it but that doesnt make the SR20 a bad motor.


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## westy66 (Mar 3, 2005)

you should never 'break-in' an engine with full synthetic oil. its lack of any abrasives will not seat rings properly. in fact, they may never seat properly. now im not saying the car will only last you a few more miles, but in comparisons sake, its not a good practice.

Bob


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## Bror Jace (Apr 26, 2003)

_"You should never 'break-in' an engine with full synthetic oil."_

This is a myth. It's not true. Note all the cars coming from the factory with Mobil 1 in the engine.

_[synthetic's] lack of any abrasives will not seat rings properly. In fact, they may never seat properly."_

No oil comes with abrasives in it ... conventional or synthetic.


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## Zac (Mar 10, 2004)

The QR25DE is a fine motor. While it still may not have aftermarket support of Honda engines, I know many people that beat the piss out of their engines and they run fine at 70k+ miles. Why? They bought their cars new, broke them in properly, and while they drive hard, they maintain them properly as well.


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## neogeon (Nov 30, 2005)

Zac said:


> The QR25DE is a fine motor. While it still may not have aftermarket support of Honda engines, I know many people that beat the piss out of their engines and they run fine at 70k+ miles. Why? They bought their cars new, broke them in properly, and while they drive hard, they maintain them properly as well.


Good to see nissanforums.com spec v owners have their heads screwed on straight. I just got a 2 day ban from b15sentra.net for arguing with those hard headed haters. I think that both the pre-cat and headgasket failure is from driver error and the butterflies is a random hiccup where the screws were not tightened to spec (as people have reported everything from loose screws to so tight they couldnt get them off when trying to add loctite.)


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## westy66 (Mar 3, 2005)

Bror Jace said:


> _"You should never 'break-in' an engine with full synthetic oil."_
> 
> This is a myth. It's not true. Note all the cars coming from the factory with Mobil 1 in the engine.
> 
> ...



(1) cars, ie engines, that come from the factory with Mobil 1 in the case are somewhat broken in and have had the rings seated properly at the factory. we're not talking about Nissans and Honduh's here. 

(2) I didnt want to get all technical, but.. the uniform diameter of synthetic oil polymers allows them to more easily slide over one another. This results in reduced friction and reduced internal engine wear. this is a FACT. that small abount of friction wear is what seats the rings properly. Sorry... i shouldnt have said "abrasives", what i meant was crude oil possesses thousands of varieties of contaminants, depending upon the oil's geographical and geological origins, which no amount of refining can entirely remove. Corrosive acids, paraffins and other waxes, heavy metals, asphalt, naphthenes and benzenes, as well as countless compounds of sulfur, chlorine, and nitrogen, remain in the finished product. i just thought "abrasives" would be easier.  

*Most* engine and lubricant manufacturers recommend that synthetic oil not be used during the "break-in" period of an engine. The reason for this is that synthetics, possessing extraordinary lubricity and lubricant film strength, do not permit the metal wear necessary for the seating of piston rings. A change to synthetic motor oil should wait until your new or rebuilt engine has completed the break-in period. Im talking about the first couple thousand miles.

Why dont you call the Nissan tech line and ask them? let us know what they say.

Bob


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## Bror Jace (Apr 26, 2003)

*Westy66*, the number of cars coming from the factory with Mobil 1 seems to grow each year and not all are specialty cars like Porsches with pre-broken-in motors.

I see you have some of the technical lingo down, but you are missing key components to the picture:

_"... the uniform diameter of synthetic oil polymers allows them to more easily slide over one another. This results in reduced friction and reduced internal engine wear. this is a FACT."_

Nope. Whether the base oil is 'conventional' or 'synthetic' does not determine its coefficient of friction. True, synthetic esters have some of this affinity for metal ... but I don't know of any PAOs (maybe SuperSyn) that do. Oh, and polymers refer to plastic or polmer-based viscosity index improvers (an STP-like substance). True synthetics have few if any 'polymers.' It's not the "uniform molecules" or any other components that determine the coefficient of friction as much as the additive package ... moly, boron, ZDDP, calcium, etc ...

_"I meant was crude oil possesses thousands of varieties of contaminants, depending upon the oil's geographical and geological origins, which no amount of refining can entirely remove. Corrosive acids, paraffins and other waxes, heavy metals, asphalt, naphthenes and benzenes, as well as countless compounds of sulfur, chlorine, and nitrogen, remain in the finished product."_

Trace amounts of these should be in any mineral oil ... but even most 'synthetics' these days are actually from a Group III mineral base stock. You can't talk about 'synthetics' these days without mentioning this fact. And it's not new. Castrol bas been doing this since 1997-98. 

And most of the heavier petroleum contaminants like waxes don't exist in any significant Group II, II+ or III base oils as these have been isomerized (de-waxed) and/or hydrocracked. Years ago, with Group I base oil, you might have ahd a point about this (with some brands). 

Some (microscopic) grit can be found in _all_ bottled oils ... mostly contaminants from the pipes at the refinery and bottling plants. Some batches of Mobil 1 and other synthetics were showing a lot of iron in lab tests for a while, for example.

_"*Most* engine and lubricant manufacturers recommend that synthetic oil not be used during the "break-in" period of an engine. The reason for this is that synthetics, possessing extraordinary lubricity and lubricant film strength, do not permit the metal wear necessary for the seating of piston rings. A change to synthetic motor oil should wait until your new or rebuilt engine has completed the break-in period. I'm talking about the first couple thousand miles."_

Find me a manufacturer that still says that. My Nissan manual recommends a mineral oil be used. Period. I think they recommend mineral oils because of all the nonsense claims made by Amsoil and others that it's perfectly safe to go 30,000 miles without an oil change. I use Schaeffer synthetic blend (with real PAO) and sensibleintervals of about 4,000-5,000 miles.

For most people, any amount over 5,000 miles with mass-market oils is neglect. How far can you go with synthetics? It depends, depends, depends. 

I used cheaper mass-market oils when my QR25DE was brand new. Why? Because I changed my oil every 2,500 miles or so for the first 10,000 miles to get rid of break-in residue.


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## neogeon (Nov 30, 2005)

Things are getting pretty hot in heavy in the tech debate. Both of you are slinging around facts about why the oils consist of lower or higher friction coefficients but neither of you really hit the common usage points. Here's the bottom line: Natural Oil=cheap, synthetic=not cheap. During break in, like the post above me states, it is possible to have break in related particles that should try to be removed and changing oil frequently will probably do that. If you are changing oil very often like that (2500 miles) it is a waste to use sythetic. It has been tested that often natural oil can be run up to about 5,000 miles before a necessary change is required, changing it at 3,000 is like changing your bathwater halfway through your bath, it doesnt hurt anything but its kind of unnecessary, unless of course you are trying to get rid of break-in materials. Also, Synthetics should be able to run for many more miles than natural oils because of its chemical properties that resist thermal breakdown which is a big reason regular oil needs to be changed frequently.

The bottom line of what I'm saying is, whether or not synthetic from the get go is necessarily dangerous, you might as well just use conventional oil until you've broken in the motor so you aren't throwing money out of the window changing the oil constantly. Also, if you are breaking in a motor you shouldnt be running it hard enough for the difference in lubricants to be noticeable. These points alone should justify conventional first and synthetic later if you so choose. Although, I have heard from several places that conventional oil breaks in seals better which I believe to be true. Don't forget, the QR25DE isn't a ferrari motor with a 9 grand redline, it has duty in the altima and an SUV, so its not tremendously stressed to necessitate incredibly low friction lubrication, then again it would almost certainly increase hp from lowered resistance.


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## westy66 (Mar 3, 2005)

hey, im no scientist, im a home inspector actually  im not trying to get into a tech pissing contest. do what you want, i just wouldnt tell any of my friends to break in their engines with synthetic. 

i drive an '02 WRX that i broke in with castrol and switched to M1 at 5000 miles. modded to 339 dyno hp (turbo, IC, fuel system and engine mgmt) at 20k miles. its got 60k on the clock now and i have no complaints. ~145lbs compression in all four cylinders and doesnt burn a drop of oil. was it the dino oil at break-in... who knows. 

like the post above states, its cheaper anyway. why take the chance?


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## Bror Jace (Apr 26, 2003)

*westy66*, I'm not into contests, either.

You're on the right track (at least you're interested in knowing technical details about oils) but your oil info needs some tweaking/updating.

You might want to do some reading at this site:

http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi


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## Zac (Mar 10, 2004)

oh what the heck, might as well specify in this thread that once you go synthetic, you CAN go back to dino.


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## skatehard90 (Dec 20, 2004)

very interesting facts to know about oil. . . lol the only problem is that maybe 5% of car owners might understand that. i had friends that tell me they ran their little hondas for 8-10k without changing oil (conventional), which is funny cuz when pulling the dip stick out, it was like pulling a spoon out of peanut butter. 

right now i'm at 18K on my spec 05 and i change my oil every 4-5K (synthetic). I don't run it that hard(maybe once in awhile), but i do put a lot of miles on it. 17/yr
so far, no oil problems, runs fine, but damn O2 sensors are trippin the check engine light. . . need to put that in the dealerships hands lol

thanks for the oil info

have a nice day


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## modenaf1 (Nov 12, 2005)

I read in Road and Track a tech correspondance thing about break in and he recommended every now and then to smoothly go full throttle in the midrange and that it helps seat the rings? Also from what I read varying RPM and deceleration were good, for example, leaving it in gear as you brake and maybe downshift a few times, but never really go over 4000RPM or so.

I'm not sure, but that is what I read. Anyone have any thoughts on this?

Also, dealers tend to let people test drive cars that are pretty new. People tend to go full out on test drives too... Not so hot for break-in eh?


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## neogeon (Nov 30, 2005)

modenaf1 said:


> I read in Road and Track a tech correspondance thing about break in and he recommended every now and then to smoothly go full throttle in the midrange and that it helps seat the rings? Also from what I read varying RPM and deceleration were good, for example, leaving it in gear as you brake and maybe downshift a few times, but never really go over 4000RPM or so.
> 
> I'm not sure, but that is what I read. Anyone have any thoughts on this?
> 
> Also, dealers tend to let people test drive cars that are pretty new. People tend to go full out on test drives too... Not so hot for break-in eh?


thats why I'm glad i got my car with 60 miles on it, no chance for 16 year olds to play 2 fast 2 furious in it (actually it would have to be the original at that time, but whatever). I kept my "redline" to about 4-4.5k rpms while I was breaking it in but I also got on the throttle once the car was warmed up. Its all debatable, I think the most important thing at any point in a car's life is that you wait until the temperature gage is at the normal point before you drive hard as all the components are designed to operate at that temperature. Another thing pertaining to redline though, people are always scared to go up to redline (6250 in our cars) but the redline is put there to say "the motor is safe to rev up to this point." On the other hand, I have seen people rev into the redline in cars without a rev limiter and thats a good way to bend valves and ruin your motor.


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## 200sx_guy (Nov 13, 2004)

this breaking in motor info is very good. someone should sticky this. i just picked up my spec v with 43k on it. I'm glad i baught it from a close friend that i know broke it in properly :thumbup:


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## ScarCrow28 (May 14, 2002)

I believe there is an editorial article in motor trend this month that also discusses the break in theory. Id double check that, but i left the issue on my work desk..... However i do remember reading it. (pretty sure it was in motortrend and not online somewhere) Of course there was no - do this, not that- final answer, just some theories to back up both sides of the taking it easy, Vs. give the motor a gun ho every now and then during break in argument. 

Also i found it interesting that my boss' new IS 250 seems to requre no breakin procedure... nothing stated in the manual, and the dealer told him, just do what you do to it. it'll be fine. At least thats what my boss tells me..

P.S. after many years hiatus i've finally returned to be active in this forum. Now that i've gotten a new 06 Volcanic Orange Spec V, my interest is suddenly sparked again. Tho I have been reading the threads every so often just to keep myself somewhat in the know... :thumbup:


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## Zac (Mar 10, 2004)

MotorTrend is a good source, however, whatever BITOG states is usually the most up to date information.


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## ScarCrow28 (May 14, 2002)

Im sorry but not familar with who or what BITOG refers to? and i do'nt seem to see it in the previous posts...


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## Zac (Mar 10, 2004)

BITOG is a form dedicated primarily to lubricants.
http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?category=10
Bror Jace is one expert on NF and BITOG who is well informed on break in schedules. The information on BITOG is worth its weight in gold...and there is a lot of info their.


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## ScarCrow28 (May 14, 2002)

ok thanks for the info. I'll be checking out taht site. do they say anything reguarding the breakin schedule of LEV engines? (thinking of the IS250 - no bread in schedule Vs. Spec V's schedule.)


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## David Hasselhoff (Jun 24, 2006)

neogeon said:


> thats why I'm glad i got my car with 60 miles on it, no chance for 16 year olds to play 2 fast 2 furious in it (actually it would have to be the original at that time, but whatever). I kept my "redline" to about 4-4.5k rpms while I was breaking it in but I also got on the throttle once the car was warmed up. Its all debatable, I think the most important thing at any point in a car's life is that you wait until the temperature gage is at the normal point before you drive hard as all the components are designed to operate at that temperature. Another thing pertaining to redline though, people are always scared to go up to redline (6250 in our cars) but the redline is put there to say "the motor is safe to rev up to this point." On the other hand, I have seen people rev into the redline in cars without a rev limiter and thats a good way to bend valves and ruin your motor.


i got mine with 12 still had transport plastic on it :x


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